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On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:Show nested quote +On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!).
They haven't done it yet because its really hard to convince companies that advertising with your channel/stream/whatever is going to be beneficial to them and worth the investment, particularly on a regular basis rather than a one-off event. Companies pay many millions to have their company names and logos on F1 cars because hundreds of millions of people worldwide watch F1 races, unless GOM can drum up significant viewing figures then comapnies won't see the return on their investment. I'm not saying they have to have similar viewing figures to F1 or any other sport, but significant enough in their own rights to make it worthwhlie.
I'm sure that GOM would like to take this route, as people have already said having the streams and VODs for 'free' would encourage greater viewer numbers, but there's the immediate costs of bandwidth and running the shows which, if the figures do not increase to the point where many advertisers take an interest, could put the show out of business.
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On February 01 2011 09:11 Darkong wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). They haven't done it yet because its really hard to convince companies that advertising with your channel/stream/whatever is going to be beneficial to them and worth the investment, particularly on a regular basis rather than a one-off event. Companies pay many millions to have their company names and logos on F1 cars because hundreds of millions of people worldwide watch F1 races, unless GOM can drum up significant viewing figures then comapnies won't see the return on their investment. I'm not saying they have to have similar viewing figures to F1 or any other sport, but significant enough in their own rights to make it worthwhlie. I'm sure that GOM would like to take this route, as people have already said having the streams and VODs for 'free' would encourage greater viewer numbers, but there's the immediate costs of bandwidth and running the shows which, if the figures do not increase to the point where many advertisers take an interest, could put the show out of business.
Aren't they already doing this? I thought it was $10 for the VODs with ads and $20 for the ones without.
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On February 01 2011 09:12 Sein wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On February 01 2011 09:11 Darkong wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). They haven't done it yet because its really hard to convince companies that advertising with your channel/stream/whatever is going to be beneficial to them and worth the investment, particularly on a regular basis rather than a one-off event. Companies pay many millions to have their company names and logos on F1 cars because hundreds of millions of people worldwide watch F1 races, unless GOM can drum up significant viewing figures then comapnies won't see the return on their investment. I'm not saying they have to have similar viewing figures to F1 or any other sport, but significant enough in their own rights to make it worthwhlie. I'm sure that GOM would like to take this route, as people have already said having the streams and VODs for 'free' would encourage greater viewer numbers, but there's the immediate costs of bandwidth and running the shows which, if the figures do not increase to the point where many advertisers take an interest, could put the show out of business. Aren't they already doing this? I thought it was $10 for the VODs with ads and $20 for the ones without.
You would be mistaken. GSL January (Season 4) was $10 for ad-less VODs and HQ stream. However, it seems like GSTL February will be just $5 with advertisements in VODs? That's what the premium package messaging says, anyway.
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On February 01 2011 09:12 Sein wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:11 Darkong wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). They haven't done it yet because its really hard to convince companies that advertising with your channel/stream/whatever is going to be beneficial to them and worth the investment, particularly on a regular basis rather than a one-off event. Companies pay many millions to have their company names and logos on F1 cars because hundreds of millions of people worldwide watch F1 races, unless GOM can drum up significant viewing figures then comapnies won't see the return on their investment. I'm not saying they have to have similar viewing figures to F1 or any other sport, but significant enough in their own rights to make it worthwhlie. I'm sure that GOM would like to take this route, as people have already said having the streams and VODs for 'free' would encourage greater viewer numbers, but there's the immediate costs of bandwidth and running the shows which, if the figures do not increase to the point where many advertisers take an interest, could put the show out of business. Aren't they already doing this? I thought it was $10 for the VODs with ads and $20 for the ones without.
I mean wholly paid for by advertisments, rather than the partial model there.
With that said though, I'll happily wager a significant amount of money that the moment after GOM switch to this (assuming they do of course) that Starcraft related forums all over the internet will explode with whining about how the adverts are destroying E-sports and ruining SC2 and how everything would be so much better of they just removed the ads.
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On February 01 2011 09:21 Darkong wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:12 Sein wrote:On February 01 2011 09:11 Darkong wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). They haven't done it yet because its really hard to convince companies that advertising with your channel/stream/whatever is going to be beneficial to them and worth the investment, particularly on a regular basis rather than a one-off event. Companies pay many millions to have their company names and logos on F1 cars because hundreds of millions of people worldwide watch F1 races, unless GOM can drum up significant viewing figures then comapnies won't see the return on their investment. I'm not saying they have to have similar viewing figures to F1 or any other sport, but significant enough in their own rights to make it worthwhlie. I'm sure that GOM would like to take this route, as people have already said having the streams and VODs for 'free' would encourage greater viewer numbers, but there's the immediate costs of bandwidth and running the shows which, if the figures do not increase to the point where many advertisers take an interest, could put the show out of business. Aren't they already doing this? I thought it was $10 for the VODs with ads and $20 for the ones without. I mean wholly paid for by advertisments, rather than the partial model there. With that said though, I'll happily wager a significant amount of money that the moment after GOM switch to this (assuming they do of course) that Starcraft related forums all over the internet will explode with whining about how the adverts are destroying E-sports and ruining SC2 and how everything would be so much better of they just removed the ads.
No one bitches about MLG having ads, or even about the Korean ads during BW casts. The closest you'll get to that is people making fun of them.
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The SQ quality live is like 240p on youtube, probably worse it feels like. I honestly can barely stand it, but I'm not going to pay money for something I barely watch live.
No point in buying VOD's, I spoil the games for myself I dont watch anyways.
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On February 01 2011 09:26 Fruscainte wrote:
No point in buying VOD's, I spoil the games for myself I dont watch anyways.
Clearly, you're not an example of e-sports' target market, let alone GOM's.
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On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net.
Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic.
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On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic.
They've streamed team leagues/events in the past for free. Realistically its $5 to pay for the VOD hosting.
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Personally I would never pay a PENNY to watch one month's worth of sc games. Not a fucking penny. I'd rather watch replays or sc1 or something, and I've been watching starcraft since july won his golden mouse. If they want it to get popular they would treat it as an actual sport and not some money milking machine. They're trying to milk as much money as they can from people, and IMO it not going to work IMO. I don't know how many people subscribe to the GSL, but I can tell you they would have a lot more people interested in the sport if they made it free.
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why do ppl keep asking about this, theres been so many topics about this already.
Why do you need someone elses approval to decide? If you enjoy the games enough and don't wanna stay up late, and/or would like HQ. Then pay the simple $10. I
Personally, I pay for the $10 ticket because I like to watch when I wake up rather than stay up later than I'd prefer to watch. Not to mention HQ is better quality in a VOD than live  . and i can skip parts that boring. $10 for a ton of games is awesome
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On February 01 2011 09:36 UruzuNine wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:26 Fruscainte wrote:
No point in buying VOD's, I spoil the games for myself I dont watch anyways. Clearly, you're not an example of e-sports' target market, let alone GOM's.
I think we're all examples of e-sports' target market merely by being fans of the game. I don't buy the VODs either and I don't watch games I spoil for myself unless I hear they're spectacular (which they usually aren't).
The animosity that the buyers of the VODs in this thread have toward the people who haven't purchased them is insane. We're all on the same team here.
A perfect example of a true Starcraft fan is Manifesto7. From an interview with Artosis in 2009 (which is no longer available), he stated that he buys:
"Hite Beer, CJ Rice, KTF Phone Service and banks with Shinhan Bank"
Whether or not he buys the VODs from GOM (I assume he does), the fact that he actively purchases products from sponsors of StarCraft tournaments ensures the livelihood of the scene.
I personally bought a new computer last year and without any questions went with an Intel processor. Why? Because they sponsor StarCraft tournaments. The fact of the matter is that sponsors are not, and should not be lost unto westerners. I would gladly purchase from tournament sponsors whenever convenient, and in that sense it would be a Win-Win. Companies just need to figure that out so that we can stopped being charged for the tournaments themselves.
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On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic.
You don't think a week of games is worth $5? Thats less than an hour of work at any job (minimum wage is at least $7.25 in the US) and would probably be spent at starbucks. I'm willing to sacrifice one frappacino for homemade coffee and a week of GSTL.
The prices are so dirt cheap I don't see what the problem is.
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On February 01 2011 09:47 Phaded wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic. They've streamed team leagues/events in the past for free. Realistically its $5 to pay for the VOD hosting.
Really? Let's say 100 people pay the GSTL and watch the games. They aren't going to "balance even" on $500. They will make money on this no matter how much they charge. Realistically, 500+ people will probably pay to watch the videos; so I can't imagine it's entirely for VOD hosting.
Now, if GOMtv were bringing in funds for a future tournament, increasing the prize pool, advertising, etc. Those things would seem more likely for charging $5 on the GSTL broadcasting.
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On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:
If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic.
Could you explain to me how roughly 2 hours per match, 7 matches (i.e. ~14 hours of content) isn't worth $5? How much money do you spend on a single 2-hour-long movie ticket?
Just trying to gauge how pathetic I am for spending $12 to see TRON: Legacy in 3D.
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On February 01 2011 09:56 UruzuNine wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:
If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic. Could you explain to me how roughly 2 hours per match, 7 matches (i.e. ~14 hours of content) isn't worth $5? How much money do you spend on a single 2-hour-long movie ticket? Just trying to gauge how pathetic I am for spending $12 to see TRON: Legacy in 3D.
I think I can explain this. I've watched literally hundreds of professional brood war games over the past seven years. Probably over a thousand to be completely honest, if you include replays. How much did I pay for those? $0. And they were at least as entertaining as GSL vods, if not more so.
That's how it's not worth the money.
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On February 01 2011 09:50 Lucid90 wrote:
Personally I would never pay a PENNY to watch one month's worth of sc games. Not a fucking penny. I'd rather watch replays or sc1 or something, and I've been watching starcraft since july won his golden mouse. If they want it to get popular they would treat it as an actual sport and not some money milking machine. They're trying to milk as much money as they can from people, and IMO it not going to work IMO. I don't know how many people subscribe to the GSL, but I can tell you they would have a lot more people interested in the sport if they made it free.
I take it you've never had a job before, since you don't seem to value the importance of earning a paycheque. The people at GOM aren't working for charity, they're working to support their families. Call it a "money milking machine" if you want and watch pirated SC:BW VODs on YouTube or wherever, but don't try to pretend like you actually care for the longevity of e-sports.
It hurts my head to see how many kids just want to get everything for free, and make their complaints while hiding behind the self-righteous concept of "furthering e-sports," even though their selfish suggestions would prevent such an industry from ever being financially viable.
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On February 01 2011 09:54 Exxo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:47 Phaded wrote:On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:On February 01 2011 07:58 Creem wrote:On January 31 2011 06:30 StarBrift wrote:
It absolutely cuts exposure for the GSL. But it's the path they've chosen to go as worldwide streaming is not free and they have to finance it somehow. Hopefully they can get sponsors abroad and have a high quality free stream + vods in the future. I really don't understand why GSL haven't implemented commercials for the foreign stream already. On the live stream they have ample time to add a ton of commercials in between games, and they could attach commercials to the VODs aswell. I think pay to watch should be the last resort, they really need to explore other sources of revenues first (SMALL HINT: COMMERCIALS/SPONSORS!). If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic. They've streamed team leagues/events in the past for free. Realistically its $5 to pay for the VOD hosting. Really? Let's say 100 people pay the GSTL and watch the games. They aren't going to "balance even" on $500. They will make money on this no matter how much they charge. Realistically, 500+ people will probably pay to watch the videos; so I can't imagine it's entirely for VOD hosting. Now, if GOMtv were bringing in funds for a future tournament, increasing the prize pool, advertising, etc. Those things would seem more likely for charging $5 on the GSTL broadcasting.
Have you seen the quality of the stream S1 and now? That should speak for itself.
There are still issues yes but the streaming has improved quite well and going from 50 dollars to 10 in less than half a year. I don't know what you can think of that then.
People just whine because they want better content from GOM while they're doing everything they can to improve. GOM listens to the community which is something what distinguishes them from KeSPA for the better but they also have faults which KeSPA does better (promotion of matches / event planning etc).
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Anyone who plays/watches/follows/does anything Starcraft related knows about the GSL. How much exposure do you want? If it was absolutely free it would still have the same word-of-mouth it has now.
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On February 01 2011 10:02 Meta wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On February 01 2011 09:56 UruzuNine wrote:Show nested quote +On February 01 2011 09:44 bmml wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On February 01 2011 08:55 UruzuNine wrote:
If you look at the GSTL pricing model, it seems like it's gonna be cheaper ($5) with supporting ads. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if GOM eventually managed to switch over to an ad-only model, but that model only works if you actually have advertisers. Up until now, GOM hasn't had any foreign advertising, hence the premium package for services at GOMtv.net. Wait they are making people pay for $5 for GSTL? its a week of games, thats absolutely pathetic. Could you explain to me how roughly 2 hours per match, 7 matches (i.e. ~14 hours of content) isn't worth $5? How much money do you spend on a single 2-hour-long movie ticket? Just trying to gauge how pathetic I am for spending $12 to see TRON: Legacy in 3D. I think I can explain this. I've watched literally hundreds of professional brood war games over the past seven years. Probably over a thousand to be completely honest, if you include replays. How much did I pay for those? $0. And they were at least as entertaining as GSL vods, if not more so. That's how it's not worth the money.
Professional Brood War games? Oh, you mean all that pirated OGN/MBC content you watched on YouTube? I guess that's fine, since those Korean broadcasters never had any intention of distributing their content internationally anyway. However, you really don't have a valid argument if all you're banking on is the fact that you can get pirated content for free.
As for replays: http://www.sc2replayed.com/ or any of the many other SC2 replay sites. Problem solved. Besides, I don't recall GOM ever asking money for replay files.
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EPT
