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The lack of a dynamic map pool and overall poor quality of maps has killed all interest in SC2 (won't even be getting hots) for me. SC:BW always had new maps coming out because the servers and map pool in ladder was controlled by third parties. Now that the ball is in Blizzard's court like almost everything to do with starcraft 2 they have dropped it on the ground and walked away.
The lack of any change to map pool (even the new maps where not added, merely they switched in a 2v2 map to the pool, and another) makes the game boring and stagnant.
For veterans we know the hype with new maps.. outsider, destination, etc we know how the maps changed and how builds/strategies changed. Instead for SC2 with blizzard support now we get no new maps, the maps are poor, and poorly organized tournaments (blizzcon)
I understand how hard it is to make new maps blizzard, and the huge challenge it is, which is why so many people unpaid have made so many maps, and iccup even offered to work with you in any way to get their custom maps in. It's definitely a sure sign that you support ESPORTS and the SC2 community with this awesome dynamic map pool that just makes the game so good.
I hope people understand this thread is made with good intentions, aka to get blizzard to wake up from whatever stupor they are in and start not sucking. They even admit over and over how SC:BW was balanced with map design. Yet SC2 comes out and they expect kespa map makers to come in and do everything for them. It's just not possible with bnet 2.0 being such a horrible platform for 3rd party maps to fix things.
Poll: Your Thoughts on Map PoolI hate the Map Pool (1044) 58% I rage at the Map Pool harder than when Idra does against cheesy terrans. (336) 19% Indifferent (218) 12% I like the Map Pool (213) 12% 1811 total votes Your vote: Your Thoughts on Map Pool (Vote): I like the Map Pool
(Vote): Indifferent
(Vote): I hate the Map Pool
(Vote): I rage at the Map Pool harder than when Idra does against cheesy terrans.
The main problem is blizzard has said "tournaments should use their own maps"
the problem with this is the diversity of tournaments, testing said maps, etc. As the freaking developer of the game and with the dictatorship you have over server/online play you should at least ATTEMPT to make new maps of a higher quality.
We all figured out most of the maps where terrible a long time ago and blizzard has had no response. Everyone I've heard talk about the subject is like "wtf is blizzard doing"
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Personally, I laugh when I see steppes of war in a tournament's map pool. And then I cry on ladder because i can't thumbs down temple, steppes, delta, and jungle all at the same time. It makes Starcraft a very emotional game for me.
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Map pool can definitely be better but the game is still so new that new strategies are developing even with the same maps. Eventually blizzard is going to need to accept 3rd party maps though..fan made maps have shown to have a lot of potential in bw. Also someone correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Warcraft 3 tournaments only involve blizzard maps? If they had fan made maps maybe the game would have been more successful.
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I think the biggest issue with a lot of the maps now are that theyre too small and thus too succeptable to all ins, if they were all the same size as Shakuras, it would make for some longer and more interesting games IMO.
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The poll choices are way too bipolar. I hate the map pool, but still watch SC2.
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need the option "I hate the map pool"
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United Kingdom38254 Posts
Your poll options don't leave a lot of room for middle ground, in fact I'm fairly certain you just skewed the options wildly so you'd get the most one sided reactionary response you could...
I'd say I dislike the current map pool, but still maintain a high level of interest in watching SC2
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I don't like the map pool, I still enjoy the game and am interested in it.
Pool doesn't have enough options.
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The map pool is rather terrible, but I deal. It's not killing any interest in the game, but rather it offers more enjoyment for me when I do see new maps.
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I redid the poll, sorry guys :0
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I don't get why people are so harsh on SC2, the game is in its infancy... it took years for SC:BW to become the game it is now. As Tasteless said last night, nerds will never be happy, "Why isn't this perfect??!?!".
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Like the map pool; do think it makes official tourneys stagnant.
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Yeah the poll options are pretty stupid.
But I think the main problem, is the overreaction about things like these. Yeah I like iCCup maps better, new maps would be good... It's just like how there is no LAN or cross realm play, it really didn't effect many people.
So my view on this, yes, new maps would make it more interesting, however, there is still alot of diversity in builds, and different strategies... Instead of complaining about the map pool you should force yourself to do builds that don't even seem good, or go templar etc... You'll see they are relatively powerful.
If the game is boring, I believe it's more a flaw of the game itself, which I'm not saying it does, but maps don't make a difference to such an extent.
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I find the maps are alright, however I wish they would rotate more often.. and by more often I mean.. AT ALL.. seriously.. Maps should be monthly or something, even if every month they added 2 and took 2 out..
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xelnaga and shakuras are the only good maps in the current pool. metal is crappy in close positions, LT has that stupid ledge drop mechanics, jungle basin is imbalanced as fuck, blistering, delta and steppes are jokes anyway.
and i agree, more rotation would be nice. doesnt have to be a completely new mappool every month, but 2 new maps per month would be decent.
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Australia8532 Posts
It seems that no matter how many threads are made on this topic, blizzard won't listen. I think i read a "i hate the map pool" thread once a week here and still no response. I agree there needs to be a change and there should definately be community involvement. A few days ago they were testing iCCup maps on the Gisado stream (GSL).. so i don't want to read to much into it but that is a positive sign..
All good things will come in time.. everyone knows the sc2 team is tiny and with the limited resources i just don't think the map pool is sitting top on their list just yet.. i guarantee this will have to change in the future for the game to remain competitive..
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On January 07 2011 10:43 Coufu wrote:
The poll choices are way too bipolar. I hate the map pool, but still watch SC2.
Agreed, I'm not in love with the map pool, but I still don't hate the game or anything.
The problem is, the game is being balanced around this kind of map pool(or rather, the size of the current maps). If Blizzard makes the maps same size as fx. Kulas terran will be sooo boned(toss less so). Meta shows that the clearest, I cross my fingers when I get TvZ, 66% chance I win, 33% chance I loose.
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The options are WAY to harsh and over exaggerated. Where are the options "I dislike the Map Pool" or "The Map Pool is decent, but could use some change".
I very much do Dislike the Map Pool, but hate? I don't know about that.
I think bigger maps ala Starcraft 1 could definitely do nothing but help the game though.
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On January 07 2011 10:42 ZidaneTribal wrote:
Map pool can definitely be better but the game is still so new that new strategies are developing even with the same maps. Eventually blizzard is going to need to accept 3rd party maps though..fan made maps have shown to have a lot of potential in bw. Also someone correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't Warcraft 3 tournaments only involve blizzard maps? If they had fan made maps maybe the game would have been more successful.
half of the maps on blizz ladder come from custom map contests. The problem with wc3 was not the quality of the maps (most were pretty good), but the fact, that blizzard hasnt changed the mappool since 2008 (?). Since the last year more and more tournies have started to use non-ladder maps, but it was already kind off to late -_-
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Also, imagine if some slight changes were made to the map pool;
Metal/LT/DQ/Shakuras: You can now only spawn in cross or close-by-air/far-by-ground positions...
Then you would have some definitively strong macro maps XNC, Metal, LT, Shakuras and some maps with are less macro-oriented due to anti-macro map characteristics: Steppes, DQ (less variable depending on spawns now), Blistering Sands, Jungle Basin, Scrap Station.
Given that we don't want every game to be a macro-fest, I think a balance is right, and the only issue is that even the good macro maps can have close spawns. If you look at GSL recently, one of the best days of play was because we had cross spawn Shakuras x2, and cross spawn Meta x1. On the contrary, one of the worst days, we had good maps (meta/LT), but we had close spawns.... and all we needed was cross spawns to discourage short games...
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