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On September 22 2010 09:30 Pekkz wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 09:27 TaKemE wrote:
Blizzard:
We are currently aware of this issue and hope to have it resolved in a future patch.
Beware of Ultras!! :p Gotta love blizzard, hope it takes few months to do somthing about it.
They did say "in a future patch" instead of "in a hotfix", so I'd say it'll be a while. Meanwhile we'll get to play the game enough to see that it isn't any kind of a balance issue. In army vs army fights, ultras are even worse than before (they were good though so they can take it.) There's like 4 different simple workarounds a Terran can use to avoid this entirely.
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To be entirely honest, I think this "bug" is actually an unintended fix for an unintended effect of SCVs plus PFs.
I don't think Blizzard intended for Planetary Fortresses to survive forever while being repaired by 30 SCVs.
I think the Ultralisk splash will be changed, but that there will be a limit on how many SCVs can repair a unit/building at a time.
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Clearly, Blizzard did not think this through. I can't imagine this not being patched, however awesome it is :/
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It's outrageous that T aren't able to repair a building (or a Thor I guess) being attacked by Ultras. I mean it starts like that and then you end up with a race that can't repair buildings at all!
+ Show Spoiler +
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Blizzard is going to patch it. So only terrans are allowed to not run away when their CC is not being attacked. Great.
Oh, no AI patch so that SCV are targeted? Good. I totally love when my ultras run around the building being aie with AoE (that doesn't hit the SCV btw) trying to find a small spot to do damage.
*sigh*
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On September 22 2010 09:34 SpaceYeti wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 09:26 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:24 MassAirUnits wrote:On September 22 2010 09:22 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:19 SpaceYeti wrote:On September 22 2010 09:18 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:13 Whomp wrote:
You terrans QQ'ing know how fast you can kill a hive with the same amount of stimmed marauders compared to those ultras? Just pull away your workers much like we have to do when you have banshees, helions, thor drops, marauder drops, viking lands and cliffed tanks. seriously l2p Ye, its hilarious. Terran has 5 ways to harass a expansion. Zerg had ZERO ways to harass terran expo with PF. Now there is a tier 3 unit that can do it, and all terrans here scream imbalance, its so god damn funny  Really? Zero? Do you play this game? Please don't make Zerg look bad.  Ok, enlighten me how im gonna kill or harass a PF with turrets around it, i would love to know. Brood Lords? So i need to make broodlords to counter a building, maby i didnt get your sarcasm, sry. No, but you might need to make a "siege unit" to break an entrenched position head on.
broodlords wont do shit. scvs outrepair BL damage from 6 BLs. U cant even pick off the scvs because they just move to the other side of the PF once u start attacking them. by the time a terran sees BLs he can just get a starport switched with a reactored building and make a few vikings which can sit over the PF and pwn ur BLs.
Sorry, BLs aint the answer.
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They'll probably lessen the radius a bit so that it only attacks the scvs near the ultra, or something like that.
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I like this change from a game-balance point of view, but honestly, that looks so terrible and broken... SCV's exploding on contact with a CC? I don't know how, but there needs to be an in-between here somewhere.
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Because people have clearly not caught the official Blizzard response in this fast paced thread:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/forum/topic/627980105
"We are currently aware of this issue and hope to have it resolved in a future patch."
....
Told you so.  ("Neener-neener" and all the immature stuff)
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On September 22 2010 09:31 SpaceYeti wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 09:22 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:19 SpaceYeti wrote:On September 22 2010 09:18 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:13 Whomp wrote:
You terrans QQ'ing know how fast you can kill a hive with the same amount of stimmed marauders compared to those ultras? Just pull away your workers much like we have to do when you have banshees, helions, thor drops, marauder drops, viking lands and cliffed tanks. seriously l2p Ye, its hilarious. Terran has 5 ways to harass a expansion. Zerg had ZERO ways to harass terran expo with PF. Now there is a tier 3 unit that can do it, and all terrans here scream imbalance, its so god damn funny Really? Zero? Do you play this game? Please don't make Zerg look bad. Ok, enlighten me how im gonna kill or harass a PF with turrets around it, i would love to know. And dont say banelings, they die before they can scrach the scvs and prolly cost more then the PF to begin with. Lol. Micro and positioning are your friends....or they should be. Banelings can easily reach SCVs on a PF protected mineral line unless you're A-moving them in with no other attention paid to them. Also, two fungal growths kill SCVs. Wanna get your banelings in? Spam ITs by the PF (spread them and it's even better) and roll those puppies on in. There are lots of ways to harass a Terran player in midgame if you are imaginative and especially use infestors.
Post something that happens above your bronze league. Never seen a high level game where a zerg has successfully harassed a PF with turrets without taking massive losses.
Are you also serious about zerg having to invest in mass infestors + banelings ( hello gass?) to take down a PF? Terran will only counter attack and own you after you used silly ammouny of resources/energy on taking down a building. To do somthing like that you need to be miles ahead.
You just crack me up man
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5 range ultralisks....yeah.....
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They *have* to fix that haha.. or rather.. maybe just fix scv repairing
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On September 22 2010 09:37 tacrats wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 09:34 SpaceYeti wrote:On September 22 2010 09:26 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:24 MassAirUnits wrote:On September 22 2010 09:22 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:19 SpaceYeti wrote:On September 22 2010 09:18 Pekkz wrote:On September 22 2010 09:13 Whomp wrote:
You terrans QQ'ing know how fast you can kill a hive with the same amount of stimmed marauders compared to those ultras? Just pull away your workers much like we have to do when you have banshees, helions, thor drops, marauder drops, viking lands and cliffed tanks. seriously l2p Ye, its hilarious. Terran has 5 ways to harass a expansion. Zerg had ZERO ways to harass terran expo with PF. Now there is a tier 3 unit that can do it, and all terrans here scream imbalance, its so god damn funny Really? Zero? Do you play this game? Please don't make Zerg look bad. Ok, enlighten me how im gonna kill or harass a PF with turrets around it, i would love to know. Brood Lords? So i need to make broodlords to counter a building, maby i didnt get your sarcasm, sry. No, but you might need to make a "siege unit" to break an entrenched position head on. broodlords wont do shit. scvs outrepair BL damage from 6 BLs. U cant even pick off the scvs because they just move to the other side of the PF once u start attacking them. by the time a terran sees BLs he can just get a starport switched with a reactored building and make a few vikings which can sit over the PF and pwn ur BLs. Sorry, BLs aint the answer.
You know, you *could* target the SCVs. :p It's not like the brood lord is at risk of dying to a PF anytime soon. :D
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On September 22 2010 09:32 phaded wrote:
I thought splash was meant to originate x units out of the center of the targeted unit, not x units out of the edge of the targeted unit?
ie. Tank splash would be the same size regardless of hitting a zergling or an ultralisk?
(sorry I play protoss and rarely get archons so I'm not very familiar with that kind of splash damage)
Tank splash doesn't work the same way ultra splash does, based on what some other ppl researching have said.
Tank splash is up to 2 or 1.5 radius from center of target.
Ultra splash is 2 + radius of the target itself, from the center of the target.
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While I thoroughly enjoyed watching a saturated gold mine evaporate, it definitely needs to be patched. I hope they don't revert to the old ram attack, instead changing where the splash damage originates (from the ultralisk's blades rather than the unit/structure being targetted).
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Here are some numbers I'd like everyone to remember before you make statements about Planetary Fortress cost efficiency.
The PF costs 550 minerals and 150 gas AND 270 minerals every 87 seconds.
If you had turned your PF into an OC instead you would if you used every 50 energy on MULE had a MULE every 1 minute and 27 seconds. Lets say one and a half minute for simplicity.
So after just 3 minutes of play the PF has actually costed you 1090/150.
After 6 minutes 1630/150
After 12 minutes 2710/150
Terran player realize this added virtual cost and it is why it is a tough decision every time you decide between an OC and a PF. But reading threads like this makes me think that most zerg players might not quite grasp this.
This is why the PF HAS to be repairable. Because otherwise it is just not worth it cost for cost.
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On September 22 2010 09:38 jdseemoreglass wrote:
I like this change from a game-balance point of view, but honestly, that looks so terrible and broken... SCV's exploding on contact with a CC? I don't know how, but there needs to be an in-between here somewhere.
Totally agree. I agree with this mechanic in theory, but only the SCVs within a reasonable distance to the Ultra should get splash damage, not SCVs just standing on the opposite side lol
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On September 22 2010 09:26 Slayer91 wrote:
Patch X:
"Splash now starts from the centre of the target rather than around the impact location"
Terrans: YAY TANKS ARE GOOD NOW THANKS BLIZZARD.
Patch 1.1. Ultras benefit from this now toss
Terrans: Blizzard, ffs fix this, this is bullshit.
Ah, I see. No double standards of course.
All splash damage originates from the center of the target, but Ultras have the only attack where the splash radius gets bigger corresponding to the size of its target. If a Siege Tank shoots a Command Center, it damages nothing else because its splash radius is smaller than the building.
A Marine (Range 5) standing on the opposite side of a Command Center (Size 3) being attacked by an Ultralisk would die if he tried to defend it.
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Optimally, I'd like to see this replaced with an equally effective buff for Zerg versus Planetary Fortresses, because from a lore standpoint, it's kinda counterintuitive. However, I'd never like to see this be removed.
A secondary effect of this some of you may have missed: Zerg now has the ability to really wreck bases. Splash Ultras can destroy building clumps far, far faster, giving the opponent less time to react. This could help push Nydus over the edge into being used in competitive lategame, and force more defensive play in terms of keeping some of the army back to snipe Ultras before they can wreck everything. I'd call this a good thing, because previously Missile Turrets/Photon Cannons could keep away most all Zerg harass (namely Mutas), but I'd rather see the base-destruction power reduced for all races, lowering Ultras and Marauders down to reasonable levels.
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On September 22 2010 09:39 VanGarde wrote:
Here are some numbers I'd like everyone to remember before you make statements about Planetary Fortress cost efficiency.
The PF costs 550 minerals and 150 gas AND 270 minerals every 87 seconds.
If you had turned your PF into an OC instead you would if you used every 50 energy on MULE had a MULE every 1 minute and 27 seconds. Lets say one and a half minute for simplicity.
So after just 3 minutes of play the PF has actually costed you 1090/150.
After 6 minutes 1630/150
After 12 minutes 2710/150
Terran player realize this added virtual cost and it is why it is a tough decision every time you decide between an OC and a PF. But reading threads like this makes me think that most zerg players might not quite grasp this.
This is why the PF HAS to be repairable. Because otherwise it is just not worth it cost for cost.
Are you seriously complaining about not having MULEs when your fortress can kill a 50-100 supply army of zerglings and roaches and hydra?
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EPT
