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On January 02 2012 08:06 Moralez wrote:
i hope is day9 leaving and not artosis <3 dan
noone leaves here alive!!!
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Not that I want anyone to leave the show because I <3 all u guyzz
but i think the show overall would be improved with fewer pillars.
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On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:On January 02 2012 02:10 Papulatus wrote:
Why would Slasher ever be on sotg when he knows nothing about sc2? I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right?  I'm masters too, and I don't know shit  The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it.
zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway.
Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosis
he plays on korean
I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA.
Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet*
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On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:On January 02 2012 02:10 Papulatus wrote:
Why would Slasher ever be on sotg when he knows nothing about sc2? I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet*
So in your opinion the play he did months ago counts more then his play NOW? What?
Also, do you actually listen to his cast or his stream? Anyone who is halfway decent at this game has to recognize that artosis has very good insight into this game. I would even say that, counting out pros (and day(9) i guess), he knows more about the game than anyone else .
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On January 02 2012 10:41 Ryuu2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:
[quote]
I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* So in your opinion the play he did months ago counts more then his play NOW? What? Also, do you actually listen to his cast or his stream? Anyone who is halfway decent at this game has to recognize that artosis has very good insight into this game. I would even say that, counting out pros (and day(9) i guess), he knows more about the game than anyone else .
The period of the game where he was trying the most was NASL, so yes it is reasonable to weigh that over what he does now in game... ( which is?).
lol counting out the pros he has the best insight? That's like saying counting out every other TL member, I can proudly say I have the most posts.
What's holding tyler back? Mechanics?
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On January 02 2012 10:41 Ryuu2 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:
[quote]
I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* So in your opinion the play he did months ago counts more then his play NOW? What? Also, do you actually listen to his cast or his stream? Anyone who is halfway decent at this game has to recognize that artosis has very good insight into this game. I would even say that, counting out pros (and day(9) i guess), he knows more about the game than anyone else .
No. The top pros know a lot more than any of the casters. Day9 has been wrong on many accounts, but who knows, it could have been from fatigue.
In addition Artosis has very good insight on the game I give him that, but I believe he's too stubborn on some topics that sway his decision making in casting. If you've watched his strean you know that he's amazing at analyzing, but his personal views of the game affect his analytical skills most of the time.
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On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:On January 02 2012 02:10 Papulatus wrote:
Why would Slasher ever be on sotg when he knows nothing about sc2? I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet*
I read that as ''It doesn't matter what you guys say, i'm a hater so i'm gonna hate anyway''
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On January 02 2012 11:10 stormchaser wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:On January 02 2012 02:13 Replice wrote:
[quote]
I agree so much, i thought the whole point of sotg was having people who knew alot about the game talk about the state of the game + a wild jp hosting. Cant see where slasher fits in. Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* I read that as ''It doesn't matter what you guys say, i'm a hater so i'm gonna hate anyway''
right, because I totally didn't say he was a great person and great sc1 player. Nobody in sc2 is great with his limited practice time.
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On January 02 2012 11:07 AxelTVx wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 10:41 Ryuu2 wrote:On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:[quote] Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* So in your opinion the play he did months ago counts more then his play NOW? What? Also, do you actually listen to his cast or his stream? Anyone who is halfway decent at this game has to recognize that artosis has very good insight into this game. I would even say that, counting out pros (and day(9) i guess), he knows more about the game than anyone else . No. The top pros know a lot more than any of the casters. Day9 has been wrong on many accounts, but who knows, it could have been from fatigue. In addition Artosis has very good insight on the game I give him that, but I believe he's too stubborn on some topics that sway his decision making in casting. If you've watched his strean you know that he's amazing at analyzing, but his personal views of the game affect his analytical skills most of the time.
+1.
Artosis is def. one of the best master league players at analyzing the game, though some times his personal opinions on his favoruite playstyle (mech) simply makes his analysis biased instead of objective. However on the other hand artosis definitely knows more about tvt and other non toss matchup, than i do about nonterran matchup. But the average high master terran player definitely understands terran matchups better than artosis, though they may not be as good as articulating their analysis.
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On January 02 2012 11:07 AxelTVx wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 10:41 Ryuu2 wrote:On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:[quote] Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* So in your opinion the play he did months ago counts more then his play NOW? What? Also, do you actually listen to his cast or his stream? Anyone who is halfway decent at this game has to recognize that artosis has very good insight into this game. I would even say that, counting out pros (and day(9) i guess), he knows more about the game than anyone else . No. The top pros know a lot more than any of the casters. Day9 has been wrong on many accounts, but who knows, it could have been from fatigue. In addition Artosis has very good insight on the game I give him that, but I believe he's too stubborn on some topics that sway his decision making in casting. If you've watched his strean you know that he's amazing at analyzing, but his personal views of the game affect his analytical skills most of the time.
Please read my post one more time. I said counting out the PROS, artosis knows more then anyone else.
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So... when is the next sotg?
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On January 02 2012 11:16 Garth wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 11:10 stormchaser wrote:On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:On January 02 2012 02:17 Swilvan wrote:[quote] Afaik JP was masters with random, imho that probably means he knows quite a bit about the game right? I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* I read that as ''It doesn't matter what you guys say, i'm a hater so i'm gonna hate anyway'' right, because I totally didn't say he was a great person and great sc1 player. Nobody in sc2 is great with his limited practice time.
I don't understand this one bit. Why is it his knowledge is brought into question, because he doesn't play enough? Thats absurd! He studies the game inside and out, he has to so he can be a good caster. He talks to players constantly and watches the best players in the world break this game down to its fullest extent. He can't be knowledgeable because he hasn't the time to play the game? Because his mechanics aren't the strongest or he isn't very fast. He doesn't lose games because hes an idiot. Same with day 9, he is gm with all three races and yet he knows less then a specific pro? I think that caster that knows how the game works such as artosis or day 9 can be just as knowledgeable as any pro out there because it's their job as analytic casters to know.
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On January 02 2012 21:35 Hoodlum wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 11:16 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 11:10 stormchaser wrote:On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:[quote] I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* I read that as ''It doesn't matter what you guys say, i'm a hater so i'm gonna hate anyway'' right, because I totally didn't say he was a great person and great sc1 player. Nobody in sc2 is great with his limited practice time. I don't understand this one bit. Why is it his knowledge is brought into question, because he doesn't play enough? Thats absurd! He studies the game inside and out, he has to so he can be a good caster. He talks to players constantly and watches the best players in the world break this game down to its fullest extent. He can't be knowledgeable because he hasn't the time to play the game? Because his mechanics aren't the strongest or he isn't very fast. He doesn't lose games because hes an idiot. Same with day 9, he is gm with all three races and yet he knows less then a specific pro? I think that caster that knows how the game works such as artosis or day 9 can be just as knowledgeable as any pro out there because it's their job as analytic casters to know.
pretty much this.
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The thing I understand the least is being high masters in Korea makes him a bad player. Obviously he doesn't have the mechanics to play at a top level, watching his stream you can see he is considerably slower than many other pros are on their streams. His game knowledge though I think is superb. On par with most pros, at least foreign pros. Some top Koreans probably are more familiar with some of the minute details of builds and strategies, but I do think Artosis shoiuld be considered one of the most knowledgeable people in sc2.
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On January 02 2012 21:35 Hoodlum wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 11:16 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 11:10 stormchaser wrote:On January 02 2012 10:21 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 06:36 Recognizable wrote:On January 02 2012 06:32 Garth wrote:On January 02 2012 03:00 Grettin wrote:On January 02 2012 02:53 Tantaburs wrote:On January 02 2012 02:34 CruelZeratul wrote:On January 02 2012 02:23 xlava wrote:[quote] I'm masters too, and I don't know shit The people who know a lot about the game are people who win tournaments, thats it, and I suppose some GM players. So Artosis doesn't know anything about the game? Well i mean he doesn't really play SC2 :p I guess you haven't been around for a while, have you? Streaming almost daily with commentary, getting lots of positive feedback because of it. He might not play the game THAT much overall, because of casting and other life, but he sure as hell knows the game well enough. And like casting games daily, doesn't help you understand the game better and better.. if he knew that much about the game he'd have been able to get above rank 600 in NA ladder. You can know alot about the game but just don't have the mechanics to do it. zz, then comes in the argument that he was a sc1 pro gamer and sc2 having easier mechanics should favor the player who has more game knowledge rather than mechanics, protoss is more knowledge oriented anyway. Yeah, i mean since he's not playing the on NA server anymore, he should totally be above top 600 there. Also he only is like top 450 on the korean server which is pretty bad. He really knows nothing about the game! http://sc2ranks.com/kr/854110/Artosishe plays on korean I was referring to the period of time in nasl where he grinded 100s of games and was still about 600 in NA. Give respect where respects due, he's a great person, a great sc1 pro gamer, but he doesn't have it in sc2. *yet* I read that as ''It doesn't matter what you guys say, i'm a hater so i'm gonna hate anyway'' right, because I totally didn't say he was a great person and great sc1 player. Nobody in sc2 is great with his limited practice time. I don't understand this one bit. Why is it his knowledge is brought into question, because he doesn't play enough? Thats absurd! He studies the game inside and out, he has to so he can be a good caster. He talks to players constantly and watches the best players in the world break this game down to its fullest extent. He can't be knowledgeable because he hasn't the time to play the game? Because his mechanics aren't the strongest or he isn't very fast. He doesn't lose games because hes an idiot. Same with day 9, he is gm with all three races and yet he knows less then a specific pro? I think that caster that knows how the game works such as artosis or day 9 can be just as knowledgeable as any pro out there because it's their job as analytic casters to know.
Because starcraft 2 is a game more about applying specific knowledge and strategy /tactics more than it is abusing brute force mechanics to win a game, for instance as protoss most mechanics that you need tbh is maintaining macro while defending drops, protoss even with the warp prism can't really pull off effective 3 prong attacks like terran that requires mechanics.
Guess what, other pros also talk to other pros constantly and they also break the best player's game down to its fullest extent, that tbh is the purpose of a team house. You'd be surprised why people lose games, practice has two purposes, 1. to improve mechanics, 2. To improve the mental aspect like strategy APPLICATION of things you have made inferences about. Sure I can make a thousand conclusions from watching a replay but it doesn't do me shit if I don't know how to apply them. To say he loses his games purely because of mechanics is absurd, nestea loses some games because of the mental side, we all do. Starcraft is more of a game of strategy than was starcraft 1 where brute force mechanics could win you games pretty much by itself. The last time I played artosis I beat him not because of my mechanics, there was a flaw in his strategy.
The casters can have a certain type of knowledge, but when you put it in a game it isn't the same because they don't have first hand experience IMPLEMENTING that knowledge. Day9 plays a lot more than artosis or when he was GM with all 3 races, theres a difference about having great PRACTICAL knowledge and then being able to infer things and gain great theoretical knowledge, my first and only point is that people need to stop putting artosis on a pedastool and ASSUME he has great practical knowledge because he doesn't, he doesn't play enough -_-.
Again I will say this, Artosis is a great person, a great guy for the community, a great starcraft 1 pro gamer, in my opinion the greatest foreign caster, but nobody can seriously say he is great at starcraft 2. At least not yet.
Also who are you comparing his knowledge to? Nobody in this game that is super good is in a position where they give out their insight constantly to the general public, so if you compare artosis to husky... Of course artosis is going to win. We haven't seen a single korean truly dig deep and tell us about the game or tbh any good foreigner. Imagine how smart Nestea would sound if his job for a day was "analytical caster"
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On January 02 2012 08:00 iamke55 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 07:41 LeakyBucket wrote:On January 02 2012 03:10 CallousCarter wrote:
I'd also like to see state of the game focus more on the actual game. I don't think it's the obligation of this podcast to cover every major tournament or piece of drama and act like the voice of the community. This was originally about important people in the scene giving insight on the game. Not saying they have to have a rigid format because there's a lot of good discussions and entertaining/informative rants that come out of the current style but i'd much rather get insight from the hosts on what strategies people are doing at the moment, how to counter them, what they thing will work in the future than have an hours worth of tournament predictions. Regarding the content of the show, I would also like to hear more discussion of the metagame. I do still like hearing all of the discussions about tournaments, news etc. but I would appreciate a little more variety. As always I like the shows that are a little less formal and relaxed. Can't wait for more SOTG! Agreed, I love to see the show become a bit more of a "State of the Metagame". While it's nice to hear the pillars' opinions about who will go far in which tournaments, I'd much rather hear them discuss why people are no longer going 4 gate on Tal'Darim Altar, or the recent resurgence of mutalisk-based ZvP.
Agreed. Individual player predictions come up naturally in that conversation anyway. "So all this mutalisk-based ZvP resurging is going to be great for player X and his Y tendencies..."
Also, "State of the Metagame" is a MUCH better title. Seriously. If you don't take that name some other show eventually will.
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On January 03 2012 05:27 JFlynn wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2012 08:00 iamke55 wrote:On January 02 2012 07:41 LeakyBucket wrote:On January 02 2012 03:10 CallousCarter wrote:
I'd also like to see state of the game focus more on the actual game. I don't think it's the obligation of this podcast to cover every major tournament or piece of drama and act like the voice of the community. This was originally about important people in the scene giving insight on the game. Not saying they have to have a rigid format because there's a lot of good discussions and entertaining/informative rants that come out of the current style but i'd much rather get insight from the hosts on what strategies people are doing at the moment, how to counter them, what they thing will work in the future than have an hours worth of tournament predictions. Regarding the content of the show, I would also like to hear more discussion of the metagame. I do still like hearing all of the discussions about tournaments, news etc. but I would appreciate a little more variety. As always I like the shows that are a little less formal and relaxed. Can't wait for more SOTG! Agreed, I love to see the show become a bit more of a "State of the Metagame". While it's nice to hear the pillars' opinions about who will go far in which tournaments, I'd much rather hear them discuss why people are no longer going 4 gate on Tal'Darim Altar, or the recent resurgence of mutalisk-based ZvP. Agreed. Individual player predictions come up naturally in that conversation anyway. "So all this mutalisk-based ZvP resurging is going to be great for player X and his Y tendencies..." Also, "State of the Metagame" is a MUCH better title. Seriously. If you don't take that name some other show eventually will.
Well I'm not sure if you follow sports at all but when it comes to Football I watch a show called Inside the Game. In this show they talk about the weeks games and their opinions on what happened but never actually talk strategy. State of the Game has plenty of viewers so this is a formula that works.
To be clear I'm not arguing with anyone simply saying that it works no matter the genre. I would love to hear strategy talk but instead of turning SoTG into that maybe make a different show. Something more strategic based, someone with the money could easily host a show and cycle in players each week to discuss strategy and such.
I'd say we had a show like this but 12 weeks with pros has been long gone since Bitter has taken up casting.
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So does anyone know when the new episodes will start?
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Episodes will continue when we're ready. I'm not going to give any time frame until I'm 100% sure.
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On January 04 2012 06:47 itmeJP wrote:
Episodes will continue when we're ready. I'm not going to give any time frame until I'm 100% sure.
Is that interview ep with Nestea/MVP still on when you come back? :3
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EPT
