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Official State of the Game Podcast Thread - Page 1056

Forum Index > SC2 General
54608 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 1054 1055 1056 1057 1058 2731 Next
I_Love_Bacon
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States5765 Posts
May 14 2011 00:49 GMT
#21101
On May 14 2011 09:47 MrCon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 09:39 Azarkon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:30 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:23 Azarkon wrote:
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the SOTG hosts on this issue - it's a huge advantage for GSL players, not so much for MLG players. The opportunity costs are simply not the same.

I think they didn't really thought about it from a foreigner perspective :
- Place 2 to 4 goes to code A :
-- if they lose first round, they can just return to US directly and just spent 2 to 5 days in Korea
-- if they lose ro16, they just go back to US after 7 to 10 days (those 2 cases still makes a nice hollidays)
-- if th go ro8 or better, then they can actually have a shot in code S, so staying one month has a real point

- Place 1 gets to code S :
-- same process ; he gets eliminated in group play, he just returns to US, next GSL the next MLG winner will get his spot (he obviously won't play the up and down, they haven't announced the details but I guess it will be like that)
-- if he wins group play, he already earned more (or equal ?) than a second place in MLG. He only stays in Korea while he keeps winning, so he risks nothing and potentially gains a lot (in money and fame)

Foreigners wins in all those scenarii.


Code A is pretty much worthless, so basically they get a shot at money IF they decide to stay in Korea for a month+ AND IF they get through Code A. Code S is awarded to only one player, and that player can be a Korean. By contrast, getting seeded into the Champion's Bracket gives you a pretty damn good chance of winning money in the three or so days that you're there for MLG. It's great for people like Naniwa who want to go to the GSL anyways. But for most MLG players it's an opportunity that's probably not even going to be used, especially given the skill discrepancy that typically exists at MLG vs GSL.

Foreigners win in none of these scenarios, except the one foreigner who gets seeded into Code S *if* he's a foreigner.

Yes but you forget the part where they just can go back to US if they lose, without having risked anything. That's a pretty big opportunity for the most talented guys, again with no risk involved.


Where the wheels come off are the fact that, if you're good enough to place well at MLG, then you're probably competing in other online tournaments. The NASL, IPL, etc.. wont want to be played online from Korea because of the lagging issue. Instead, they can stay home and play in optimal conditions.
" i havent been playin sc2 but i woke up w/ a boner and i really had to pee... and my crisis management and micro was really something to behold. it inspired me to play some games today" -Liquid'Tyler
iYiYi
Profile Joined March 2011
United States489 Posts
May 14 2011 00:50 GMT
#21102
It drives me nuts how people try to underplay players achievements in SC2. I am glad IdrA got all that information out there. The top SC2 progamers are very talented and it is time to stop that hate.
VPCursed
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
1044 Posts
May 14 2011 00:51 GMT
#21103
On May 14 2011 09:48 bluestuff wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 09:46 VPCursed wrote:
War3 players doing terrible? see tsl

think he was talking specifically about Korean wc3 pros.

oh.. i just tuned in as he was ranting
elmizzt
Profile Joined February 2010
United States3309 Posts
May 14 2011 00:53 GMT
#21104
awww, I wish kennigit would post those 1/3
d=(^_^)z
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
May 14 2011 00:57 GMT
#21105
On May 14 2011 09:47 MrCon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 09:39 Azarkon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:30 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:23 Azarkon wrote:
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the SOTG hosts on this issue - it's a huge advantage for GSL players, not so much for MLG players. The opportunity costs are simply not the same.

I think they didn't really thought about it from a foreigner perspective :
- Place 2 to 4 goes to code A :
-- if they lose first round, they can just return to US directly and just spent 2 to 5 days in Korea
-- if they lose ro16, they just go back to US after 7 to 10 days (those 2 cases still makes a nice hollidays)
-- if th go ro8 or better, then they can actually have a shot in code S, so staying one month has a real point

- Place 1 gets to code S :
-- same process ; he gets eliminated in group play, he just returns to US, next GSL the next MLG winner will get his spot (he obviously won't play the up and down, they haven't announced the details but I guess it will be like that)
-- if he wins group play, he already earned more (or equal ?) than a second place in MLG. He only stays in Korea while he keeps winning, so he risks nothing and potentially gains a lot (in money and fame)

Foreigners wins in all those scenarii.


Code A is pretty much worthless, so basically they get a shot at money IF they decide to stay in Korea for a month+ AND IF they get through Code A. Code S is awarded to only one player, and that player can be a Korean. By contrast, getting seeded into the Champion's Bracket gives you a pretty damn good chance of winning money in the three or so days that you're there for MLG. It's great for people like Naniwa who want to go to the GSL anyways. But for most MLG players it's an opportunity that's probably not even going to be used, especially given the skill discrepancy that typically exists at MLG vs GSL.

Foreigners win in none of these scenarios, except the one foreigner who gets seeded into Code S *if* he's a foreigner.

Yes but you forget the part where they just can go back to US if they lose, without having risked anything. That's a pretty big opportunity for the most talented guys, again with no risk involved.


No, I'm not forgetting that part. Code A players can only get into the next season of Code S, so there is a substantial time delay in-between success in Code A and success in Code S. Foreigners are going to have to sacrifice months of time to get into Code S and that's IF they get into Code S. By contrast, Koreans play for three days. It's a big difference and will change how many people are interested.
RogerChillingworth
Profile Joined March 2010
Chad3132 Posts
May 14 2011 00:58 GMT
#21106
Too much drama. Talk about Starcraft 2
MrCon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France29748 Posts
May 14 2011 00:58 GMT
#21107
Yeah, about the Elephant, I was not aware of the past of those 3 players. The sole fact that Idra respects their bw career is enough for me :D
PanN
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States2828 Posts
May 14 2011 00:59 GMT
#21108
Yay game talk ! I really don't care about how or why idra was banned, watching to learn about the state of the game.
We have multiple brackets generated in advance. Relax . (Kennigit) I just simply do not understand how it can be the time to play can be 22nd at 9:30 pm PST / midnight the 23rd at the same time. (GGzerg)
VPCursed
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
1044 Posts
May 14 2011 01:00 GMT
#21109
Puts up room and board for him. and this is what Dan gets
ellirc
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden3286 Posts
May 14 2011 01:02 GMT
#21110
On May 14 2011 10:00 VPCursed wrote:
Puts up room and board for him. and this is what Dan gets

My thoughts too....
MrCon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France29748 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-14 01:04:59
May 14 2011 01:03 GMT
#21111
On May 14 2011 09:57 Azarkon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 09:47 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:39 Azarkon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:30 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:23 Azarkon wrote:
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the SOTG hosts on this issue - it's a huge advantage for GSL players, not so much for MLG players. The opportunity costs are simply not the same.

I think they didn't really thought about it from a foreigner perspective :
- Place 2 to 4 goes to code A :
-- if they lose first round, they can just return to US directly and just spent 2 to 5 days in Korea
-- if they lose ro16, they just go back to US after 7 to 10 days (those 2 cases still makes a nice hollidays)
-- if th go ro8 or better, then they can actually have a shot in code S, so staying one month has a real point

- Place 1 gets to code S :
-- same process ; he gets eliminated in group play, he just returns to US, next GSL the next MLG winner will get his spot (he obviously won't play the up and down, they haven't announced the details but I guess it will be like that)
-- if he wins group play, he already earned more (or equal ?) than a second place in MLG. He only stays in Korea while he keeps winning, so he risks nothing and potentially gains a lot (in money and fame)

Foreigners wins in all those scenarii.


Code A is pretty much worthless, so basically they get a shot at money IF they decide to stay in Korea for a month+ AND IF they get through Code A. Code S is awarded to only one player, and that player can be a Korean. By contrast, getting seeded into the Champion's Bracket gives you a pretty damn good chance of winning money in the three or so days that you're there for MLG. It's great for people like Naniwa who want to go to the GSL anyways. But for most MLG players it's an opportunity that's probably not even going to be used, especially given the skill discrepancy that typically exists at MLG vs GSL.

Foreigners win in none of these scenarios, except the one foreigner who gets seeded into Code S *if* he's a foreigner.

Yes but you forget the part where they just can go back to US if they lose, without having risked anything. That's a pretty big opportunity for the most talented guys, again with no risk involved.


No, I'm not forgetting that part. Code A players can only get into the next season of Code S, so there is a substantial time delay in-between success in Code A and success in Code S. Foreigners are going to have to sacrifice months of time to get into Code S and that's IF they get into Code S. By contrast, Koreans play for three days. It's a big difference and will change how many people are interested.
I agree, but you know if you failed or not in less than 10 days. If you failed, you just come back and missed nothing (or just a NASL match you had to play with lag).
If you succeed, you stay one month, can win code A (not a lot of money but a lot of fame), then either you qualify for code S, then you can return to US for the 2-4 weeks between GSLs and return to Korea to try code S, or you don't qualify for code S, and you're a young man who just spent a month in Korea for free, training with the best, playing on TV...
Perhaps for the "old guys" like idra (who is young but lived in korea) or tyller this is nothing, but for the typical progamer like morrow, naniwa, thorzain and all this is an awesome opportunity.
elmizzt
Profile Joined February 2010
United States3309 Posts
May 14 2011 01:04 GMT
#21112
On May 14 2011 10:00 VPCursed wrote:
Puts up room and board for him. and this is what Dan gets

Always trying to stir up drama where there is none. sigh
d=(^_^)z
rysecake
Profile Joined October 2010
United States2632 Posts
May 14 2011 01:04 GMT
#21113
I missed what Idra said about the elephant article. Could anyone sumarize? Else I'll just wait for the vod.
The Notorious Winkles
Karthane
Profile Joined June 2010
United States1183 Posts
May 14 2011 01:04 GMT
#21114
"you'd be surprised" lolol
Ribbon
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5278 Posts
May 14 2011 01:04 GMT
#21115
On May 14 2011 10:04 rysecake wrote:
I missed what Idra said about the elephant article. Could anyone sumarize? Else I'll just wait for the vod.


Idra: MC, Fruitdealer, and Nestea were much better in BW than the article claims. All the other crappy BW players are crappy SC2 players, so that proves nothing. Koreans are only "slacking off" compared to the slave labor format of Brood War.
nvs.
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada3609 Posts
May 14 2011 01:05 GMT
#21116
I wish day9 was here to be asked about the progaming rumours.
Count9
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
China10928 Posts
May 14 2011 01:05 GMT
#21117
What's this sixjax thing they talked about? Can someone link me please?
elmizzt
Profile Joined February 2010
United States3309 Posts
May 14 2011 01:06 GMT
#21118
On May 14 2011 10:05 Count9 wrote:
What's this sixjax thing they talked about? Can someone link me please?

http://www.sixjaxgaming.com/wp/scii/2011/05/09/liquid-versus-eg-the-pr-war/

horribly written and fact-checked.
d=(^_^)z
Azarkon
Profile Joined January 2010
United States21060 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-14 01:07:54
May 14 2011 01:07 GMT
#21119
On May 14 2011 10:03 MrCon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2011 09:57 Azarkon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:47 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:39 Azarkon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:30 MrCon wrote:
On May 14 2011 09:23 Azarkon wrote:
Unfortunately, I have to agree with the SOTG hosts on this issue - it's a huge advantage for GSL players, not so much for MLG players. The opportunity costs are simply not the same.

I think they didn't really thought about it from a foreigner perspective :
- Place 2 to 4 goes to code A :
-- if they lose first round, they can just return to US directly and just spent 2 to 5 days in Korea
-- if they lose ro16, they just go back to US after 7 to 10 days (those 2 cases still makes a nice hollidays)
-- if th go ro8 or better, then they can actually have a shot in code S, so staying one month has a real point

- Place 1 gets to code S :
-- same process ; he gets eliminated in group play, he just returns to US, next GSL the next MLG winner will get his spot (he obviously won't play the up and down, they haven't announced the details but I guess it will be like that)
-- if he wins group play, he already earned more (or equal ?) than a second place in MLG. He only stays in Korea while he keeps winning, so he risks nothing and potentially gains a lot (in money and fame)

Foreigners wins in all those scenarii.


Code A is pretty much worthless, so basically they get a shot at money IF they decide to stay in Korea for a month+ AND IF they get through Code A. Code S is awarded to only one player, and that player can be a Korean. By contrast, getting seeded into the Champion's Bracket gives you a pretty damn good chance of winning money in the three or so days that you're there for MLG. It's great for people like Naniwa who want to go to the GSL anyways. But for most MLG players it's an opportunity that's probably not even going to be used, especially given the skill discrepancy that typically exists at MLG vs GSL.

Foreigners win in none of these scenarios, except the one foreigner who gets seeded into Code S *if* he's a foreigner.

Yes but you forget the part where they just can go back to US if they lose, without having risked anything. That's a pretty big opportunity for the most talented guys, again with no risk involved.


No, I'm not forgetting that part. Code A players can only get into the next season of Code S, so there is a substantial time delay in-between success in Code A and success in Code S. Foreigners are going to have to sacrifice months of time to get into Code S and that's IF they get into Code S. By contrast, Koreans play for three days. It's a big difference and will change how many people are interested.
I agree, but you know if you failed or not in less than 10 days. If you failed, you just come back and missed nothing (or just a NASL match you had to play with lag).
If you succeed, you stay one month, can win code A (not a lot of money but a lot of fame), then either you qualify for code S, then you can return to US for the 2-4 weeks between GSLs and return to Korea to try code S, or you don't qualify for code S, and you're a young man who just spent a month in Korea for free, training with the best, playing on TV...
Perhaps for the "old guys" like idra (who is young but lived in korea) or tyller this is nothing, but for the typical progamer like morrow, naniwa, thorzain and all this is an awesome opportunity.


It's a good opportunity for novelty in their pro-gaming lives, but given the competition in Code A, I doubt most of them (esp. if the likes of Idra do not go and the opportunity is relegated to worse placing players) would win anything, whereas the Korean GSL top players have a very good chance of winning something from MLG.
MrCon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France29748 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-14 01:10:04
May 14 2011 01:07 GMT
#21120
On May 14 2011 10:04 rysecake wrote:
I missed what Idra said about the elephant article. Could anyone sumarize? Else I'll just wait for the vod.

MC was good in bw, he was 1-9 because he was so talented that they pushed him too soon.
Fruitdealer just hated the slave status, but he was his team ace (iirc)
Nestea wasn't given any opportunity, they made him play 2vs2 and coach

sc2 houses are slacking compared to slave bw house, but they are still training very hard.
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