Dimaga may switch to Terran - Page 17

On August 15 2010 07:05 NuKedUFirst wrote:


Pretty much this. Terran will get nerfed and zerg players will still be losing and saying how zerg is still too weak. I think it is really the play style of the zerg players and not the race itself.

On August 15 2010 07:12 Naraka wrote:


This is only partially correct. There will always be people screaming that something in under/overpowered. There are still terran players claiming that terran needs buffs. It's nothing new and will never go away. The difference is when it's just that handful of individuals screaming, or 90% of the entire community.

In the case of zerg, it's not just the handful of people that cry for sake of crying. It's the majority of the people playing zerg, constantly playing in an uphill battle no matter the map or situation. Maps just sometimes make the current imbalance even worse. i.e. Lost Temple.

On August 15 2010 07:05 NuKedUFirst wrote:


Pretty much this. Terran will get nerfed and zerg players will still be losing and saying how zerg is still too weak. I think it is really the play style of the zerg players and not the race itself.

On August 15 2010 04:49 NuKedUFirst wrote:


APM isn't the issue. Just because 1 player spams between hotkeys more then another doesn't make him a better player. Zerg has to deal with the timings and when to make what.





FOR SURE
http://sc2ranks.com/

Do you have a source or are you trying to prove a point? IdrA was playing protoss when warp in was completely imbalanced. I don't think it was a "OP / UP" problem. If so please state the source.

On August 15 2010 03:18 floor exercise wrote:


it's a daily poll since early in the beta where you just vote which race you want to cry about today, it's broken up by certain milestones like patches, tournament results etc, in order to see the trends in the public perception of balance.

red is zerg, green is terran, protoss is blue, and purple is none

On August 15 2010 07:00 Kelberot wrote:


Oh my god what a great argument! No one ever brought this up before in this thread!

You're a genius! He's right guys, zerg is fine, l2p!

On August 15 2010 07:35 Traveler wrote:


So wait, you are saying that the numbers lie? That the hard proof, the win ratios are not different enough to be statistically significant, must be false?

Also thank you for the compliments, you may doubt that your compliments could be true, but its ok, this zerg player does just fine against terran.

On August 15 2010 07:40 tacrats wrote:


ur saying its balanced because LADDER win ratios are equal?

ROFLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

On August 15 2010 07:45 Traveler wrote:


Your saying its imbalanced because people cry when they lose?
What other proof do you need? If zerg wins the same ratio of games at different levels (top diamond, middle, and lower, and the other divisions) then what more do you need in order to make a valid argument that there is no existing imbalance?

I hope that those who believe in this imbalance despite facts, are going into or are currently in professions that don't require a lot of math. Because the first thing you learn in any statistics course is, that there cannot be much uncertainty when you have a ton of numbers all saying the same thing.

On August 11 2010 18:18 rrowland wrote:
I just want to preface by saying I won't be discussing my views on racial balance in this thread. There's enough debate on that going on already. I will only be discussing the misconceptions around ladder statistics, and explaining how to correctly understand them.

You can see the current ladder statistics here: http://sc2ranks.com/stats/all/1/all

Race Average Win Ratio
At the time of post: All races are at 56% in diamond, including random.
This is the main statistic I want to address as it's the most commonly cited for "Stop QQing, races are balanced" arguments. The truth of the matter is that equal-looking results will always be present due to how Battle.net 2.0's matchmaking system is designed. When a player loses, he's matched with a lower-skilled player for a better chance of winning. In the end, it always evens out.

Doesn't that mean all races are balanced? No, not at all. Let's take an extreme example to illustrate my point: Let's say protoss is so overpowered that even the worst players can beat terran players leagues above them. Bronze protoss player starts playing. He faces a terran player in Gold and wins due to racial imbalance. This continues until bronze protoss begins facing platinum/diamond terran and begins to lose. Eventually it evens out and bronze protoss is considered equal skill with mid-platinum terran. Recorded stats regarding the average of 1000 of these cases would read that terran and protoss both have the same win percentage due to the matchmaking service adjusting who a player is matched against.

Snapping out of the hypothetical, we can see the matchmaking system doesn't match based on (skill = skill), rather (skill + racial = skill + racial). This will always equal out to create the illusion of statistical balance regardless of racial inequalities.

Furthermore, the fact that 'Random' has roughly the same win percentage as the three individual races should be a clear example of my hypothetical situation. Essentially, random is about 3 times harder to master than any individual race. All random players would have to be much more skilled than any single race player to realistically achieve an equal win percentage in a system that reflected true balance statistics.

Race Distribution
At the time of post: 8.6% random, 35.75% protoss, 35.4% terran, 20.23% zerg
This is a much more telling statistic. Although it doesn't necessarily represent the balance between races, it does represent the willingness that players have to play each race. When two of the races account for almost 80% of non-random players, each having 75% MORE players than the third race (almost double), it says something about the playability and attraction of the race.

Again, not saying any of the races are overpowered or underpowered in this thread, just pointing out what the statistics do and do not reflect. Hopefully I have cleared up some common misconceptions. Statistics are a very easy thing to abuse and misinterpret.

On August 15 2010 07:45 Traveler wrote:


Your saying its imbalanced because people cry when they lose?
What other proof do you need? If zerg wins the same ratio of games at different levels (top diamond, middle, and lower, and the other divisions) then what more do you need in order to make a valid argument that there is no existing imbalance?

I hope that those who believe in this imbalance despite facts, are going into or are currently in professions that don't require a lot of math. Because the first thing you learn in any statistics course is, that there cannot be much uncertainty when you have a ton of numbers all saying the same thing.