|
On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg?
ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore.
so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock.
|
On February 22 2013 08:09 Snusmumriken wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 04:07 HTOMario wrote:On February 22 2013 03:45 Tsubbi wrote:On February 22 2013 03:43 shindigs wrote:
Hellbat transformation requiring upgrade.
Siege tech does not require upgrade.
WHAT IS MY WORLD i hope they reintroduce siege tech as well, it creates so many tense timing situations in tvz as well as tvt and it never achieved what it was supposed to, which was make mech more viable in tvp It did exactly that. Pff what do you know about mech in tvp. (lulz) Show nested quote +When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? Skyterran with mass raven battlecruisers is extremely good vs zerg :o
Raven + anything is amazing vs Zerg nowdays.
Raven + Mech, Raven + Air, it all depends which composition the Zerg player is going.
Also Ravens are basically a necessity if they are going SH at all and microing their SH. Good to have a couple just in case of tech switch, even though they completely decimate the majority of Zerg armies anyway.
On February 22 2013 06:23 quebecman77 wrote:
you can pretty much expect blizzard to nerf terran into the ground just like they did in wol at this point
Seriously? Terran went in to WoL incredibly powerful, and most the Terran nerfs were post-release, and after months of nerfs that Terrans were saying would break the race, they were still in good shape.
On February 22 2013 07:13 Beakyboo wrote:
I feel like they're too quick to make these sorts of changes lately. Zerg has damn good scouting. Certainly they're capable of anticipating hellbats. If these hellbat pushes are too strong then that's probably an issue with hellbats being too strong. They're 100 mineral units that now require more tech than a thor to make. There's just something wrong with that.
I haven't had a problem facing hellbat drops since patch, but haven't faced too many pushes so I can't judge that too well.
But from my experience fighting Hellbats, the issue is most likely due to teching. Even though Roaches outrange the Hellbats slightly, if you try having some micro battles with them, due to the attack delay of Roaches being pretty large the Hellbats still trade with the Roaches.
Hydras are actually more successful defending Hellbats than Roaches. Even though they are light units and get torn up by the fire, you can actually have a micro battle. So you need to tech (which means sacrificing workers) and spend quite a bit of a gas investment to be able to fight them without huge casualties, even if you scout the hellbats coming.
Post-patch, the Terran composition will probably need to be more varied to counteract this.
|
On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock.
Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game.
|
On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game.
Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case.
Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this.
But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army.
BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up!
|
On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up!
Raven is pretty amazing vs Toss, till he gets HTs. Then its just deadweight.
|
On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up!
It's so easy to run away from SM's, especially when tempests can shoot from so far. And feedback alone kills ravens/bc's.
|
On February 22 2013 08:39 Breach_hu wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up! Raven is pretty amazing vs Toss, till he gets HTs. Then its just deadweight.
What is that, like 10 minutes?
|
United Kingdom12025 Posts
On February 22 2013 08:39 Breach_hu wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up! Raven is pretty amazing vs Toss, till he gets HTs. Then its just deadweight.
As someone who has been mech (tank hellion ghost(if necessary)) ravening, that's entirely untrue. You should never really be flying ravens around alone and siege tanks and good positioning means you shouldn't get feedbacked.
You basically need ravens as mech vs toss with tempest/skytoss or you just lose instantly for example.
|
Blizzard just cant get things right with Terran and its pissing me off
All they had to do from the very beginning was add 1 new unit to help transition into late game but some how they managed to make a mess of the Terran tech structure. They dont know when something is broken ffs, this is the same shit we had with the reaper
|
On February 22 2013 08:45 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up! It's so easy to run away from SM's, especially when tempests can shoot from so far. And feedback alone kills ravens/bc's.
It's easy to run from 1, maybe 2 SM's, but not a number of them.
And with proper placement you can get off some SM's before they are able to feedback you. As well as proper placement makes sure their slow movement speed won't be able to get out of range before the missile goes off.
You seem to be trapping yourself in to negative thinking. That's like me saying my Broodlords will be useless because you can counter them with Vikings. It's a RTS, every unit has strengths and weaknesses. Use the strengths to your advantage and use proper micro and compositions to avoid the weaknesses.
Even your Terran brethren above agree. Don't trap yourself with negative thinking and try it.
|
now fix tvp early game thanks
too much of a coin-flip guessing what 2 gas 1 base build protoss is going to do
|
On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game.
"If toss doesn't go ht you don't go ghost." There's half of your problem in TvP right there. Go ghost. It's amazing how much ghosts raped the toss army.
|
On February 22 2013 09:18 netherDrake wrote:
now fix tvp early game thanks
too much of a coin-flip guessing what 2 gas 1 base build protoss is going to do
Psh, don't you know? You're supposed to get better as Terran. Stop whining!
|
United Kingdom12025 Posts
On February 22 2013 09:18 netherDrake wrote:
now fix tvp early game thanks
too much of a coin-flip guessing what 2 gas 1 base build protoss is going to do
It's actually pretty simple to work it out. If you scout 2 gas, no nexus and 2 pylons in his base when there should be 3, you know it's most likely a proxy stargate. They could proxy blink but that would make no sense. If you see a twilight council it's going to either be blink OR dt's so you can just get a turret at your front anyways and stay up your ramp if you haven't expanded yet. Gateway all ins are super easy to scout too.
You think it's bad now, try playing BW. Zealot openings from proxy 2 gates were much stronger and more common, then you had reaver drops that if you didn't defend perfectly your entire mineral line would die to a single scarab and then you had DTs which I'd argue were better in BW due to how much later you actually got the ability to scan. That's not even counting bulldog builds which dropped on top of your tanks defending your front.
EDIT: Also open siege expand and your safe from pretty much everything but stargate which is countered by a few turrets (as mech you can afford it). Sure you'll be slightly behind against any form of fast nexus, but better behind than dead. What the hell do you even need the minerals that quickly for anyway as mech?
I can't comment on bio since I don't play it.
|
On February 22 2013 09:13 Spyridon wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 08:45 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:On February 22 2013 08:33 Spyridon wrote:On February 22 2013 08:28 WeRRa wrote:On February 22 2013 08:13 Decendos wrote:On February 22 2013 08:07 WeRRa wrote:
When does Terran finally get a lategame buff, so you don't have to play 3 times better to beat an a-move deathball of protoss or zerg? ravens are now OP in lategame vs zerg. build them and dont forget to support them. raven got huge buffs so build them. if he goes BL infestor and you have a raven + support army you cant lose. if he goes ultras its harder but still doable. once you got your 150 supply army of BC raven viking you literally cant lost anymore. so yeah ravens are key in lategame now and they rock. Problem is it takes ages to get to this point and it is useless vs toss i mean colossi, ht, tempest. Ghost buff would be welcome, ghosts are not worth there money. The only reason you get ghost ingame is to counter hts, if toss doesn't go ht you never go ghosts, cause the tech route is so expensive and it is not really worth it. Also techreactor upgrade at fusion core would be nice so tech switches don't pull terran out of the game. Serious question, wasn't the Terran problem in TvZ with late-game anyway? How long it takes to get there shouldn't be too much of an issue if that's the case. Also Terran can usually tech quicker than the Zerg can, especially if they do an early push that needs to be defended, and especially if you are going with a fairly fast factory build such as this. But I would like to see Ghosts get a buff honestly. As a Zerg player I rarely ever see them, and I don't feel their abilities have very much synergy with the rest of the Terran army. BTW, Ravens are pretty amazing vs Toss as well. Toss is known for their deathballs, and their deathballs are realllly tight usually. And they love choke points! Seeker Missiles blow them the hell up! It's so easy to run away from SM's, especially when tempests can shoot from so far. And feedback alone kills ravens/bc's. It's easy to run from 1, maybe 2 SM's, but not a number of them. And with proper placement you can get off some SM's before they are able to feedback you. As well as proper placement makes sure their slow movement speed won't be able to get out of range before the missile goes off. You seem to be trapping yourself in to negative thinking. That's like me saying my Broodlords will be useless because you can counter them with Vikings. It's a RTS, every unit has strengths and weaknesses. Use the strengths to your advantage and use proper micro and compositions to avoid the weaknesses. Even your Terran brethren above agree. Don't trap yourself with negative thinking and try it.
In my experience against the rage inducing tempest, SM is the wrong ability to be using. If you use it against tempest you will damage one or two of them if they just let their tempest spread naturally. Against voids though, its so good unless the toss is really good at splitting. Id say ravens are the only reason voids arent used more in pvt but Im pretty bad so who knows. Zerg has fungals but collosus and zealots are pretty good at keeping the infestors back from what ive seen
|
I thought Terran was going to be able to do mech vs protoss.....
Honestly, they never even tried making it viable, saying that terran mech would work vs protoss while it clearly wouldn't, gave some stupid siege tank buff that won't change anything, and then called mech viable. I am 100% positive that mech isn't going to be viable against protoss right now, but it seems like Blizzard is not willing to change anything to make it more viable. I'm extremely disappointed with HoTS tbh.
|
On February 22 2013 06:33 A.Alm wrote:
Reapers still rape zerg in the early game. I dough this is enough of a nerf.
dont worry , they will nerf reaper soon , then mine
after all reaper ''can" kill some worker before the 15 min mark , and in some bad time , force the zerg to make some unit
clearly need to be nerfed no ?
|
On February 22 2013 09:32 Qikz wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2013 09:18 netherDrake wrote:
now fix tvp early game thanks
too much of a coin-flip guessing what 2 gas 1 base build protoss is going to do It's actually pretty simple to work it out. If you scout 2 gas, no nexus and 2 pylons in his base when there should be 3, you know it's most likely a proxy stargate. They could proxy blink but that would make no sense. If you see a twilight council it's going to either be blink OR dt's so you can just get a turret at your front anyways and stay up your ramp if you haven't expanded yet. Gateway all ins are super easy to scout too. You think it's bad now, try playing BW. Zealot openings from proxy 2 gates were much stronger and more common, then you had reaver drops that if you didn't defend perfectly your entire mineral line would die to a single scarab and then you had DTs which I'd argue were better in BW due to how much later you actually got the ability to scan. That's not even counting bulldog builds which dropped on top of your tanks defending your front. EDIT: Also open siege expand and your safe from pretty much everything but stargate which is countered by a few turrets (as mech you can afford it). Sure you'll be slightly behind against any form of fast nexus, but better behind than dead. What the hell do you even need the minerals that quickly for anyway as mech? I can't comment on bio since I don't play it.
Please,post your replays.I want to see you "siege expand" and defending Oracles.Later want to see you fighting Tempest,Carrier,HTs.Thanks.
|
in a few months both siege tech and merged upgrade will be reverted to the way it is. It's fine to adjust timing and stuffs but completely removing some tasks just lower the required skills and thus making the game less appealing
|
On February 22 2013 09:38 Jerom wrote:
I thought Terran was going to be able to do mech vs protoss.....
Honestly, they never even tried making it viable, saying that terran mech would work vs protoss while it clearly wouldn't, gave some stupid siege tank buff that won't change anything, and then called mech viable. I am 100% positive that mech isn't going to be viable against protoss right now, but it seems like Blizzard is not willing to change anything to make it more viable. I'm extremely disappointed with HoTS tbh.
If anything the real problem is that they tried.
The whole hellbat/warhound mess is/was because Blizzard tried.
By now they did terrible damage to other match-ups and mech TvP is about as dead as in WoL.
And everyone should see that coming.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
