EPTNBA General Discussion - Page 38
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
Ex players aren't often good GMs/Coaches/Owners. Turns out being really tall and athletic doesn't have much bearing on being a good manager. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
On August 21 2020 13:52 cLutZ wrote: Ex players aren't often good GMs/Coaches/Owners. Turns out being really tall and athletic doesn't have much bearing on being a good manager. Depends on the sport I'd say. The two best baseball execs of the past 50 years are former players. During a lengthy stretch when the Toronto Maple Leafs played more playoff games than any other NHL team the Prez of the team was a former player and very tall. The coach of the team was a former player and very big and tall and intimidating. A lot of CEOs are quite tall. It allows them to immediately command a room. https://www.livescience.com/5552-taller-people-earn-money.html | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
On August 21 2020 16:30 cLutZ wrote: That is a huge selection bias. Most non players get almost no chances, If players were at replacement level we'd expect 99%+ coaches/gms to be players. There are too many exceptions to your rule... to claim it is a rule. just off the top of my head... Pat Gillick , Andrew Friedman , Pat Quinn, Cito Gaston, Ken Dryden, Red Kelly, Scottie Bowman, i mean i can go on and on all day listing former players who were great coaches and managers. There are tonnes of former players who are scouts. The best scouts are former players because they know what to look for when watching inexperienced young athletes perform. Those top notch scouts who acquire the 485398 other skills required to be GM move up the corporate ladder and become great GMs. Now if you want to claim elite level former players don't make good coaches or management personnel you might have a point there. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
On August 22 2020 02:58 cLutZ wrote:. The problem is that ex-players are basically promoted to high positions with no evidence that they are good. For every Jerry West there are 50 Isiah Thomases. good point. | ||
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
Another issue is wealth. Jordan is just about the richest ex-player in NBA history but he's one of the least wealthy owners. His team spends like it. Dunno who else Garnett has in his ownership group but he's going to need some financial firepower. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On August 22 2020 03:40 andrewlt wrote: I think a better phrasing of clutz's point is that there is no correlation between playing ability and coaching/gm ability. There are more successful coaches/gms who were role players than star players just because of sheer numbers. Star players don't get an advantage in terms of success. Another issue is wealth. Jordan is just about the richest ex-player in NBA history but he's one of the least wealthy owners. His team spends like it. Dunno who else Garnett has in his ownership group but he's going to need some financial firepower. Exactly. When Durant retires, its pretty unlikely that Bank of America is going to make him Vice President of operations. OTOH, some NBA team might. He's about equally qualified for both. Now, he might secretly be an awesome banker, IDK, but he'd never get that job in that manner. I think one of the biggest market inefficiencies in America right now is sports teams (and this goes on at the college level as well) hiring too many ex-players. Its basically like Nepotism. There is no way all of your children are the best at <insert whatever business you have>. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
https://streamable.com/j7rfaa On August 22 2020 03:54 cLutZ wrote: Exactly. When Durant retires, its pretty unlikely that Bank of America is going to make him Vice President of operations. OTOH, some NBA team might. He's about equally qualified for both. On August 21 2020 16:30 cLutZ wrote: That is a huge selection bias. Most non players get almost no chances, If players were at replacement level we'd expect 99%+ coaches/gms to be players. When entering the sports operations side of a pro sports team the most common place to start is scout. Non-players are not nearly as qualified as ex-players for that initial scouting job. ex-players who start out there can gradually climb to the top and if they are willing to learn and grow professionally year after year they can become really good upper management people. There are tonnes of players who become scouts and move up thru the organization. IMO, the best GMs are great scouts. You started off by saying Garnett is not qualified to be near the top of the executive food chain on an NBA team. I agree with that. He is not qualified. Most ex-superstar players do not wish to start at the bottom and build their own personal foundation of abilities as they slowly climb the corporate ladder. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
Masai Ujiri and Bobby Webster head up an org that has produced two different COY winners in three years. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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zev318
Canada4306 Posts
pacers/heat series is over, oladipo didnt play well, and MJ warren went back to playing like TJ warren. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada17199 Posts
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