• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:06
CEST 16:06
KST 23:06
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0
Community News
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers19Maestros of the Game 2 announced92026 GSL Tour plans announced15Weekly Cups (April 6-12): herO doubles, "Villains" prevail1MaNa leaves Team Liquid25
StarCraft 2
General
MaNa leaves Team Liquid Maestros of the Game 2 announced 2026 GSL Tour plans announced Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool
Tourneys
2026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers INu's Battles#14 <BO.9 2Matches> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 522 Flip My Base The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss Mutation # 520 Moving Fees
Brood War
General
ASL21 General Discussion Data needed BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ FlaSh: This Will Be My Final ASL【ASL S21 Ro.16】 BW General Discussion
Tourneys
Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Ro16 Group C [ASL21] Ro16 Group D
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend? Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV Diablo IV Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Sexual Health Of Gamers
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1899 users

[IEM] Katowice 2023 - RO8, RO4, Grand Finals - Page 95

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 93 94 95
Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax
argonautdice
Profile Joined January 2013
Canada2719 Posts
February 13 2023 17:32 GMT
#1881
On February 14 2023 00:04 dysenterymd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2023 23:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
On February 13 2023 07:13 Glorfindelio wrote:
On February 13 2023 06:47 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Big Oliveira fan now, didn't know he was so wholesome!
And the way he played was just so amazing, he was on top of everything!
Curious to see if his skill really jumped and will maintain in the future, or if he just played out of his mind today.



Oliveria/Time has always been a good dude, so couldn't be happier for him. General life parable of how hard work and determination intersects with a bit of luck sometimes to produce an amazing result. Especially when you consider how close he came to retiring and the upheaval in China with Blizzard.

I mean, just an insane, wild bracket--Serral forgetting how to play ZvZ/not practicing it and leaving a 50/50 won game (seriously, rewatch it), Rogue being in the military, Dark getting crushed by Hero--but also Time clutching it up and reverse sweeping Reynor and then beating the best TvT player in Sc2 history in the biggest and most unlikely match of his life.

How can you not be inspired by that. Don't know how many of you watch the NBA, but insert Kevin Garnet yelling "ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE."


Yeah that was definitely one of the most amazing things to happen in SC2 history!
Arguably the most notable tournament/finals, other than maybe Serral being the first foreigner to win whatever he won I forget (since Serral wasn't great until then, kinda like Oliveira), or maybe MVP vs Squirtle.



Serral wasn't great before 2018, but he came into Blizzcon 2018 with such great form that him winning wasn't remotely surprising - still a big moment because he was the first foreigner to do it though. Oliveira was truly out of nowhere, he didn't play too many international tournaments and got bopped in the one he did attend (DHM Atlanta.)


Yeah Oliveira got 0-6'd at Atlanta and didn't even make top 32, though there were signs of brilliance with his run to the TSL9 winner's semifinal before being stopped by visa, and winning recent ESL cups beating Dark multiple times. He also made top 4 of DH last chance a year ago beating Zest, Elazer, and DRG.
very illegal and very uncool
argonautdice
Profile Joined January 2013
Canada2719 Posts
February 13 2023 17:37 GMT
#1882
On February 13 2023 21:50 dysenterymd wrote:
Although hitting perfect attack timings was the main thing that clinched it for TIME, it's worth noting that he also beat Reynor and Maru in late games. Truly a beastly day of games.

Also definitely watch TIME vs Dark game 2 and TIME vs Clem game 1 in the group stage for some incredible late game and comeback. It's kind of weird to say this, but TIME made all the terran opponents he faced look helpless.
very illegal and very uncool
SootShade
Profile Joined October 2018
31 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-14 03:08:54
February 14 2023 03:08 GMT
#1883
On February 14 2023 00:42 TossHeroes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2023 23:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
On February 13 2023 07:13 Glorfindelio wrote:
On February 13 2023 06:47 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Big Oliveira fan now, didn't know he was so wholesome!
And the way he played was just so amazing, he was on top of everything!
Curious to see if his skill really jumped and will maintain in the future, or if he just played out of his mind today.



Oliveria/Time has always been a good dude, so couldn't be happier for him. General life parable of how hard work and determination intersects with a bit of luck sometimes to produce an amazing result. Especially when you consider how close he came to retiring and the upheaval in China with Blizzard.

I mean, just an insane, wild bracket--Serral forgetting how to play ZvZ/not practicing it and leaving a 50/50 won game (seriously, rewatch it), Rogue being in the military, Dark getting crushed by Hero--but also Time clutching it up and reverse sweeping Reynor and then beating the best TvT player in Sc2 history in the biggest and most unlikely match of his life.

How can you not be inspired by that. Don't know how many of you watch the NBA, but insert Kevin Garnet yelling "ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE."


Yeah that was definitely one of the most amazing things to happen in SC2 history!
Arguably the most notable tournament/finals, other than maybe Serral being the first foreigner to win whatever he won I forget (since Serral wasn't great until then, kinda like Oliveira), or maybe MVP vs Squirtle.

But also, as a Serral fan, i was quite tilted at him leaving the game.
I understand that often times, when viewers feel a game isn't over yet, the pro knows and is right that it's definitely over.
But THAT game? G5 in the world championships? I do not get how you can not just stay in the game for 10 more seconds and play it out. Is it pride? Is it fear of coming off as if you're disrespecting your opponent? If that is your last game there is absolutely no reason, if you really want the highest chance of winning, to not stay for a little longer.

There were 11 Roaches popping out for Serral, ~5 roaches still alive, and all Ragnarok had at Serral's front was like ~3 morphing Ravagers, ~5 Roaches, and ~15 lings on the way.
Serral's wave of Roaches that were coming out in a couple seconds would have fended and pushed off Ragnarok's ~5 Roaches and ~3 Ravagers, until his lings came. By that time, Serral could have even evacuated his drones from his third to his natural, and bought time at his ramp since he had a wall and a choke.
Even if he did lose his 15-20 drones at his 3rd, they would still be even in workers, Serral may even be up a few drones still... and there's no way Ragnarok could kill the 3rd in time without Serral mustering more forces.

The 1 reason i can think of as to maybe why it was actually over, is if Serral lost all his Queens and had no more injects/larvae? If only he had the judgement to pull 15 workers to defend that push, cus even if he lost them he'd still be up 5-8 workers or something and at least survive, but oh well. Either way though, whether it's a miscalculation and he left too early or he should have pulled some drones to tank, it's a skill issue, so while I feel bad, i guess it's up to him to improve on for next time.


Most likely Serral just had a poor read of the situation. He even saw there was no drone saturation at rag’s third

Serral lost majority of his zvz series this tournament.

Serral always had a habit of leaving the game a bit earlier, whereas his peers would usually keep fighting until they are “truly” dead.



Yeah, I think Serral had an exceptionally bad read of that game all the way through. It happens to him occasionally - usually his ability to read the game state is what really sets him apart as a player, but every now and then that inexplicably reverses and he seemingly instead gets completely the wrong idea stuck in his head. This was just an exceptionally tragic case, with it being the last map of the play-offs series and him seemingly actually being in a winning position still at the end. As a fan it was absolutely galling.

Yet I'm honestly almost glad that it happened. Because however shaky his ZvZ is sometimes, as far as TvZ goes I honestly think he's the one player that would have stopped Oliveira's momentum if they met in the bracket stage, and I don't think Maru would have stopped Serral either. But that's of course an entirely pointless counterfactual, and I could be very wrong, especially considering just how beastly Oliveira's decision making was by the time he got to the finals. He was clearly picking up speed through the entire bracket stage, so it's entirely possible he would have just leveled up as much as was necessary to win, even if someone else had put up more of a fight than Maru did in the finals.
Classic15d
Profile Joined January 2023
3 Posts
February 14 2023 03:41 GMT
#1884
Oliveira'win made me feel a lot.Those unfamiliar with Oliveira may not know how rich he is. His game talent is probably high compared to the average person. But it's still a long way from the top players like Serral and maru. He needs to work harder to fill them.He could have driven a fancy sports car and lived in a fancy villa.Even picking up girls like every rich kid we know.But Oliveira chose to train for 12 or even 15 hours a day. He would shut himself up in his computer house every night like a mouse, curling up in his esports chair and practicing over and over until his hands grew blood blisters and calluses.So when Oliveira said during his acceptance speech that he loved the game, it wasn't just a speech. It was from the heart.Full disclosure: I'm 21 years old. Just a year younger than Oliveira. I couldn't find my passion for a long time. I thought I just wanted to make more money, because then I could have beautiful cars and beautiful women. I thought this was my passion. But look at Oliveira. I think I'm going to find a career that I really love and put my efforts into it.
Garnet
Profile Blog Joined February 2006
Vietnam9041 Posts
February 17 2023 13:52 GMT
#1885
On February 14 2023 12:41 Classic15d wrote:
Oliveira'win made me feel a lot.Those unfamiliar with Oliveira may not know how rich he is. His game talent is probably high compared to the average person. But it's still a long way from the top players like Serral and maru. He needs to work harder to fill them.He could have driven a fancy sports car and lived in a fancy villa.Even picking up girls like every rich kid we know.But Oliveira chose to train for 12 or even 15 hours a day. He would shut himself up in his computer house every night like a mouse, curling up in his esports chair and practicing over and over until his hands grew blood blisters and calluses.So when Oliveira said during his acceptance speech that he loved the game, it wasn't just a speech. It was from the heart.Full disclosure: I'm 21 years old. Just a year younger than Oliveira. I couldn't find my passion for a long time. I thought I just wanted to make more money, because then I could have beautiful cars and beautiful women. I thought this was my passion. But look at Oliveira. I think I'm going to find a career that I really love and put my efforts into it.

This reads like a copy pasta.
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9433 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-19 21:13:30
February 19 2023 21:07 GMT
#1886
I guess this finally settles the debate to the people who were arguing that Serral was dead.


As I had speculated, Pig also concluded that Serral most likely wasn't aware just how many Roaches had in production and underestimated his drone advantage.

There was never a question as to whether Serral would hold or not. He would hold 100%, the question was only who would be ahead afterwards.
Azzur
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia6260 Posts
February 20 2023 05:27 GMT
#1887
On February 20 2023 06:07 Hider wrote:
I guess this finally settles the debate to the people who were arguing that Serral was dead. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwj8B4m-H_o&t=2625s

As I had speculated, Pig also concluded that Serral most likely wasn't aware just how many Roaches had in production and underestimated his drone advantage.

There was never a question as to whether Serral would hold or not. He would hold 100%, the question was only who would be ahead afterwards.

It didn't even matter who would've had the advantage afterwards - even if Serral had a 1% chance of winning, he should've played on since it was game5 and his tournament would've been over after the loss. If it was game1, leaving early is understandable.
davetesta
Profile Joined June 2019
United States80 Posts
February 24 2023 00:46 GMT
#1888
To our Korean friends: I made a post in Touranments, $400+ KR Weekly Open starting up!

Message ChickenmanSC or DaveTestaSC on twitter or discord!
"Oh s@#t! They found my proxy!"
G5
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
United States2921 Posts
February 27 2023 02:54 GMT
#1889
"Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax"

Why would this be moderated aggressively? Is it an issue for people on a forum to discuss imbalances in the game or on maps during a tournament? Seems like an odd take.
SmoKim
Profile Joined March 2010
Denmark10305 Posts
February 28 2023 18:05 GMT
#1890
On February 27 2023 11:54 G5 wrote:
"Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax"

Why would this be moderated aggressively? Is it an issue for people on a forum to discuss imbalances in the game or on maps during a tournament? Seems like an odd take.


I think you know the difference between balance whining and discussing imbalance
"LOL I have 202 supply right now (3 minutes later)..."LOL NOW I HAVE 220 SUPPLY SUP?!?!?" - Mondragon
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9840 Posts
February 28 2023 18:07 GMT
#1891
There must be places to go 'discuss balance'.
Let me ask, what do those places normally end up like?
RIP Meatloaf <3
Prev 1 93 94 95
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
11:00
Playoffs Day 3
Classic vs RogueLIVE!
MaxPax vs Percival
herO vs Clem
WardiTV1319
IntoTheiNu 445
Ryung 418
Rex133
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Ryung 418
SortOf 149
Rex 133
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 20447
Hyuk 1235
EffOrt 1056
Stork 470
actioN 296
Hyun 249
firebathero 243
ggaemo 169
ToSsGirL 124
Last 120
[ Show more ]
Backho 97
Pusan 95
Sharp 78
Soulkey 65
[sc1f]eonzerg 46
Barracks 42
Free 33
soO 32
HiyA 25
Sacsri 23
yabsab 23
Rock 17
GoRush 16
JulyZerg 14
Noble 11
Terrorterran 8
Sexy 8
IntoTheRainbow 8
Icarus 6
NotJumperer 5
Dota 2
Gorgc5659
qojqva68
Counter-Strike
byalli839
kRYSTAL_20
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor435
Quackniix92
Liquid`Hasu1
Other Games
singsing2260
B2W.Neo1099
DeMusliM386
XBOCT340
Lowko279
RotterdaM68
MindelVK22
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream14730
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• EnkiAlexander 26
• LUISG 17
• Adnapsc2 16
• iHatsuTV 12
• Dystopia_ 1
• Kozan
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 3
• FirePhoenix2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2834
• TFBlade1457
Other Games
• WagamamaTV327
Upcoming Events
Ladder Legends
54m
Bunny vs GgMaChine
ByuN vs Percival
MaxPax vs Krystianer
Solar vs Cham
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
54m
BSL
4h 54m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
19h 54m
WardiTV Map Contest Tou…
20h 54m
Ladder Legends
1d
BSL
1d 4h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 9h
Replay Cast
1d 18h
Wardi Open
1d 19h
[ Show More ]
Afreeca Starleague
1d 19h
Soma vs hero
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Leta vs YSC
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Escore
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W4
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W5
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.