• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 18:54
CET 00:54
KST 08:54
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview12Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info3herO wins SC2 All-Star Invitational14SC2 All-Star Invitational: Tournament Preview5RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jan 26-Feb 1): herO, Clem, ByuN, Classic win2RSL Season 4 announced for March-April7Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win3Weekly Cups (Jan 12-18): herO, MaxPax, Solar win0BSL Season 2025 - Full Overview and Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Stellar Fest "01" Jersey Charity Auction StarCraft 2 Not at the Esports World Cup 2026 Weekly Cups (Jan 26-Feb 1): herO, Clem, ByuN, Classic win HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview Weekly Cups (Jan 19-25): Bunny, Trigger, MaxPax win
Tourneys
HomeStory Cup 28 RSL Season 4 announced for March-April PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) $21,000 Rongyi Cup Season 3 announced (Jan 22-Feb 7)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[A] Starcraft Sound Mod
External Content
Mutation # 511 Temple of Rebirth The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 510 Safety Violation Mutation # 509 Doomsday Report
Brood War
General
[ASL21] Potential Map Candidates Can someone share very abbreviated BW cliffnotes? BW General Discussion Liquipedia.net NEEDS editors for Brood War BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Azhi's Colosseum - Season 2 Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10
Strategy
Zealot bombing is no longer popular? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Path of Exile Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Join illminati in Luanda Angola+27 60 696 7068
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Play, Watch, Drink: Esports …
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Life Update and thoughts.
FuDDx
How do archons sleep?
8882
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1412 users

[IEM] Katowice 2023 - RO8, RO4, Grand Finals - Page 95

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 93 94 95
Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax
argonautdice
Profile Joined January 2013
Canada2719 Posts
February 13 2023 17:32 GMT
#1881
On February 14 2023 00:04 dysenterymd wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2023 23:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
On February 13 2023 07:13 Glorfindelio wrote:
On February 13 2023 06:47 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Big Oliveira fan now, didn't know he was so wholesome!
And the way he played was just so amazing, he was on top of everything!
Curious to see if his skill really jumped and will maintain in the future, or if he just played out of his mind today.



Oliveria/Time has always been a good dude, so couldn't be happier for him. General life parable of how hard work and determination intersects with a bit of luck sometimes to produce an amazing result. Especially when you consider how close he came to retiring and the upheaval in China with Blizzard.

I mean, just an insane, wild bracket--Serral forgetting how to play ZvZ/not practicing it and leaving a 50/50 won game (seriously, rewatch it), Rogue being in the military, Dark getting crushed by Hero--but also Time clutching it up and reverse sweeping Reynor and then beating the best TvT player in Sc2 history in the biggest and most unlikely match of his life.

How can you not be inspired by that. Don't know how many of you watch the NBA, but insert Kevin Garnet yelling "ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE."


Yeah that was definitely one of the most amazing things to happen in SC2 history!
Arguably the most notable tournament/finals, other than maybe Serral being the first foreigner to win whatever he won I forget (since Serral wasn't great until then, kinda like Oliveira), or maybe MVP vs Squirtle.



Serral wasn't great before 2018, but he came into Blizzcon 2018 with such great form that him winning wasn't remotely surprising - still a big moment because he was the first foreigner to do it though. Oliveira was truly out of nowhere, he didn't play too many international tournaments and got bopped in the one he did attend (DHM Atlanta.)


Yeah Oliveira got 0-6'd at Atlanta and didn't even make top 32, though there were signs of brilliance with his run to the TSL9 winner's semifinal before being stopped by visa, and winning recent ESL cups beating Dark multiple times. He also made top 4 of DH last chance a year ago beating Zest, Elazer, and DRG.
very illegal and very uncool
argonautdice
Profile Joined January 2013
Canada2719 Posts
February 13 2023 17:37 GMT
#1882
On February 13 2023 21:50 dysenterymd wrote:
Although hitting perfect attack timings was the main thing that clinched it for TIME, it's worth noting that he also beat Reynor and Maru in late games. Truly a beastly day of games.

Also definitely watch TIME vs Dark game 2 and TIME vs Clem game 1 in the group stage for some incredible late game and comeback. It's kind of weird to say this, but TIME made all the terran opponents he faced look helpless.
very illegal and very uncool
SootShade
Profile Joined October 2018
31 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-14 03:08:54
February 14 2023 03:08 GMT
#1883
On February 14 2023 00:42 TossHeroes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2023 23:46 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
On February 13 2023 07:13 Glorfindelio wrote:
On February 13 2023 06:47 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:
Big Oliveira fan now, didn't know he was so wholesome!
And the way he played was just so amazing, he was on top of everything!
Curious to see if his skill really jumped and will maintain in the future, or if he just played out of his mind today.



Oliveria/Time has always been a good dude, so couldn't be happier for him. General life parable of how hard work and determination intersects with a bit of luck sometimes to produce an amazing result. Especially when you consider how close he came to retiring and the upheaval in China with Blizzard.

I mean, just an insane, wild bracket--Serral forgetting how to play ZvZ/not practicing it and leaving a 50/50 won game (seriously, rewatch it), Rogue being in the military, Dark getting crushed by Hero--but also Time clutching it up and reverse sweeping Reynor and then beating the best TvT player in Sc2 history in the biggest and most unlikely match of his life.

How can you not be inspired by that. Don't know how many of you watch the NBA, but insert Kevin Garnet yelling "ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE."


Yeah that was definitely one of the most amazing things to happen in SC2 history!
Arguably the most notable tournament/finals, other than maybe Serral being the first foreigner to win whatever he won I forget (since Serral wasn't great until then, kinda like Oliveira), or maybe MVP vs Squirtle.

But also, as a Serral fan, i was quite tilted at him leaving the game.
I understand that often times, when viewers feel a game isn't over yet, the pro knows and is right that it's definitely over.
But THAT game? G5 in the world championships? I do not get how you can not just stay in the game for 10 more seconds and play it out. Is it pride? Is it fear of coming off as if you're disrespecting your opponent? If that is your last game there is absolutely no reason, if you really want the highest chance of winning, to not stay for a little longer.

There were 11 Roaches popping out for Serral, ~5 roaches still alive, and all Ragnarok had at Serral's front was like ~3 morphing Ravagers, ~5 Roaches, and ~15 lings on the way.
Serral's wave of Roaches that were coming out in a couple seconds would have fended and pushed off Ragnarok's ~5 Roaches and ~3 Ravagers, until his lings came. By that time, Serral could have even evacuated his drones from his third to his natural, and bought time at his ramp since he had a wall and a choke.
Even if he did lose his 15-20 drones at his 3rd, they would still be even in workers, Serral may even be up a few drones still... and there's no way Ragnarok could kill the 3rd in time without Serral mustering more forces.

The 1 reason i can think of as to maybe why it was actually over, is if Serral lost all his Queens and had no more injects/larvae? If only he had the judgement to pull 15 workers to defend that push, cus even if he lost them he'd still be up 5-8 workers or something and at least survive, but oh well. Either way though, whether it's a miscalculation and he left too early or he should have pulled some drones to tank, it's a skill issue, so while I feel bad, i guess it's up to him to improve on for next time.


Most likely Serral just had a poor read of the situation. He even saw there was no drone saturation at rag’s third

Serral lost majority of his zvz series this tournament.

Serral always had a habit of leaving the game a bit earlier, whereas his peers would usually keep fighting until they are “truly” dead.



Yeah, I think Serral had an exceptionally bad read of that game all the way through. It happens to him occasionally - usually his ability to read the game state is what really sets him apart as a player, but every now and then that inexplicably reverses and he seemingly instead gets completely the wrong idea stuck in his head. This was just an exceptionally tragic case, with it being the last map of the play-offs series and him seemingly actually being in a winning position still at the end. As a fan it was absolutely galling.

Yet I'm honestly almost glad that it happened. Because however shaky his ZvZ is sometimes, as far as TvZ goes I honestly think he's the one player that would have stopped Oliveira's momentum if they met in the bracket stage, and I don't think Maru would have stopped Serral either. But that's of course an entirely pointless counterfactual, and I could be very wrong, especially considering just how beastly Oliveira's decision making was by the time he got to the finals. He was clearly picking up speed through the entire bracket stage, so it's entirely possible he would have just leveled up as much as was necessary to win, even if someone else had put up more of a fight than Maru did in the finals.
Classic15d
Profile Joined January 2023
3 Posts
February 14 2023 03:41 GMT
#1884
Oliveira'win made me feel a lot.Those unfamiliar with Oliveira may not know how rich he is. His game talent is probably high compared to the average person. But it's still a long way from the top players like Serral and maru. He needs to work harder to fill them.He could have driven a fancy sports car and lived in a fancy villa.Even picking up girls like every rich kid we know.But Oliveira chose to train for 12 or even 15 hours a day. He would shut himself up in his computer house every night like a mouse, curling up in his esports chair and practicing over and over until his hands grew blood blisters and calluses.So when Oliveira said during his acceptance speech that he loved the game, it wasn't just a speech. It was from the heart.Full disclosure: I'm 21 years old. Just a year younger than Oliveira. I couldn't find my passion for a long time. I thought I just wanted to make more money, because then I could have beautiful cars and beautiful women. I thought this was my passion. But look at Oliveira. I think I'm going to find a career that I really love and put my efforts into it.
Garnet
Profile Blog Joined February 2006
Vietnam9033 Posts
February 17 2023 13:52 GMT
#1885
On February 14 2023 12:41 Classic15d wrote:
Oliveira'win made me feel a lot.Those unfamiliar with Oliveira may not know how rich he is. His game talent is probably high compared to the average person. But it's still a long way from the top players like Serral and maru. He needs to work harder to fill them.He could have driven a fancy sports car and lived in a fancy villa.Even picking up girls like every rich kid we know.But Oliveira chose to train for 12 or even 15 hours a day. He would shut himself up in his computer house every night like a mouse, curling up in his esports chair and practicing over and over until his hands grew blood blisters and calluses.So when Oliveira said during his acceptance speech that he loved the game, it wasn't just a speech. It was from the heart.Full disclosure: I'm 21 years old. Just a year younger than Oliveira. I couldn't find my passion for a long time. I thought I just wanted to make more money, because then I could have beautiful cars and beautiful women. I thought this was my passion. But look at Oliveira. I think I'm going to find a career that I really love and put my efforts into it.

This reads like a copy pasta.
Hider
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Denmark9420 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-19 21:13:30
February 19 2023 21:07 GMT
#1886
I guess this finally settles the debate to the people who were arguing that Serral was dead.


As I had speculated, Pig also concluded that Serral most likely wasn't aware just how many Roaches had in production and underestimated his drone advantage.

There was never a question as to whether Serral would hold or not. He would hold 100%, the question was only who would be ahead afterwards.
Azzur
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia6260 Posts
February 20 2023 05:27 GMT
#1887
On February 20 2023 06:07 Hider wrote:
I guess this finally settles the debate to the people who were arguing that Serral was dead. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwj8B4m-H_o&t=2625s

As I had speculated, Pig also concluded that Serral most likely wasn't aware just how many Roaches had in production and underestimated his drone advantage.

There was never a question as to whether Serral would hold or not. He would hold 100%, the question was only who would be ahead afterwards.

It didn't even matter who would've had the advantage afterwards - even if Serral had a 1% chance of winning, he should've played on since it was game5 and his tournament would've been over after the loss. If it was game1, leaving early is understandable.
davetesta
Profile Joined June 2019
United States77 Posts
February 24 2023 00:46 GMT
#1888
To our Korean friends: I made a post in Touranments, $400+ KR Weekly Open starting up!

Message ChickenmanSC or DaveTestaSC on twitter or discord!
"Oh s@#t! They found my proxy!"
G5
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
United States2921 Posts
February 27 2023 02:54 GMT
#1889
"Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax"

Why would this be moderated aggressively? Is it an issue for people on a forum to discuss imbalances in the game or on maps during a tournament? Seems like an odd take.
SmoKim
Profile Joined March 2010
Denmark10305 Posts
February 28 2023 18:05 GMT
#1890
On February 27 2023 11:54 G5 wrote:
"Balance whining will be moderated aggressively

-Wax"

Why would this be moderated aggressively? Is it an issue for people on a forum to discuss imbalances in the game or on maps during a tournament? Seems like an odd take.


I think you know the difference between balance whining and discussing imbalance
"LOL I have 202 supply right now (3 minutes later)..."LOL NOW I HAVE 220 SUPPLY SUP?!?!?" - Mondragon
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9768 Posts
February 28 2023 18:07 GMT
#1891
There must be places to go 'discuss balance'.
Let me ask, what do those places normally end up like?
RIP Meatloaf <3
Prev 1 93 94 95
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nathanias 146
FoxeR 119
UpATreeSC 110
JuggernautJason91
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 10720
Artosis 838
Shuttle 72
Hyuk 30
NaDa 26
Dota 2
syndereN629
NeuroSwarm80
League of Legends
C9.Mang0256
Counter-Strike
Foxcn248
taco 231
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox790
AZ_Axe103
Mew2King74
Liquid`Ken13
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor157
Other Games
summit1g8999
tarik_tv3489
FrodaN1245
shahzam619
ArmadaUGS133
ViBE115
ZombieGrub34
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick176
StarCraft 2
CranKy Ducklings8
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 88
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 45
• HerbMon 37
• RayReign 36
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota22224
League of Legends
• Doublelift3796
Other Games
• imaqtpie1726
• WagamamaTV382
• Shiphtur210
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
6m
The PondCast
10h 6m
WardiTV Invitational
12h 6m
Replay Cast
1d
RongYI Cup
2 days
herO vs Maru
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-02-03
HSC XXVIII
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Acropolis #4 - TS4
Proleague 2026-02-04
Rongyi Cup S3
Nations Cup 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W7
Escore Tournament S1: W8
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.