If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
So, is this Trap in disguise and a sudden increase in his form or Maru played a late night BO7 against Reynor?
Why the F Maru keep building his Barrack outside of his base for no real value? It delay everything on his production and leave that gaping hole for Protoss to counter attack.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Koraen Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
It doesn't cancel out the fact that the top Korean Terrans could not win against the top Korean Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. The top Korean Protoss had an abusive 2/3 of 2021, winning over and over again against the top Korean Terran.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
Edit> to prove the point> Code S S1 Maru 3:1 Hurrican Trap 3:2 Innovation Maru 4:3 Trap (that was during the Trap's reign in lower tier tournaments)
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Koraen Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
Well if instead of season 2 GSL 2021 you look at GSL season 1 2021, you got a radically different picture.
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: PvT was def not a stable matchup 2021 i'd say but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Well, thats the point why I write xelnaga is a troll
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: PvT was def not a stable matchup 2021 i'd say but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Well, thats the point why I write xelnaga is a troll
On January 24 2022 18:04 Vindicare605 wrote: If it was that difficult to beat Bunny, Zest better pray that Hero knocks out Maru because there is absolutely no chance that level of PvT is gonna take Maru down.
OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
On January 24 2022 18:07 deacon.frost wrote: [quote] OTOH It's Maru, he's like Rogue in many ways and Terran isn't as stable race as Zerg is (IMO)
Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
I am at work and not bored enough to reply to you in any at least semi-serious way, so ... uh... well... nope? I know trolls strive for replies, but are mine enough to keep you fed? I doubt that
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
On January 24 2022 18:10 Vindicare605 wrote: [quote] Thats why Im leaving open the possibility that Hero pulls off an upset. But no way Maru loses to Zest if he beats Hero, no way, not if Zest plays like that.
Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
I am at work and not bored enough to reply to you in any at least semi-serious way, so ... uh... well... nope? I know trolls strive for replies, but are mine enough to keep you fed? I doubt that
All you do is troll. See, I bring up the point that you should use Premier level tournaments where both the Koreans and Europeans compete in, when assessing the state of the game. Now you just avoid this all together, not responding to why Premier level tournaments should be used, preferring to stick with your "cherry picked" tournaments. This is what a troll does, they try to move on to a different subject rather than addressing the fundamental point (which is that Premier level tournaments with Koreans and Europeans competing in should be used instead of your cherry picked tournaments).
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
On January 24 2022 18:12 deacon.frost wrote: [quote] Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
I am at work and not bored enough to reply to you in any at least semi-serious way, so ... uh... well... nope? I know trolls strive for replies, but are mine enough to keep you fed? I doubt that
All you do is troll. See, I bring up the point that you should use Premier level tournaments where both the Koreans and Europeans compete in, when assessing the state of the game. Now you just avoid this all together, not responding to why Premier level tournaments should be used, preferring to stick with your "cherry picked" tournaments. This is what a troll does, they try to move on to a different subject rather than addressing the fundamental point (which is that Premier level tournaments with Koreans and Europeans competing in should be used instead of your cherry picked tournaments).
It's not my fault that your arguments are invalid. Learn to read and properly discuss and maybe I will start taking you seriously, until then you're an object of entertainment and not a partner for discussion.
On January 24 2022 18:12 deacon.frost wrote: [quote] Well, I was talking about Maru v Zest. For two reasons. First - Maru will play 2nd PvT so Zest can have some idea what will go on, Second - It's Maru and while he's not as YOLO as Bunny is, Maru can do overaggressive shit and against Protoss it isn't good idea because shield batteries exist. But I am nor Maru nor good so I am probably wrong XD
When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
I am at work and not bored enough to reply to you in any at least semi-serious way, so ... uh... well... nope? I know trolls strive for replies, but are mine enough to keep you fed? I doubt that
All you do is troll. See, I bring up the point that you should use Premier level tournaments where both the Koreans and Europeans compete in, when assessing the state of the game. Now you just avoid this all together, not responding to why Premier level tournaments should be used, preferring to stick with your "cherry picked" tournaments. This is what a troll does, they try to move on to a different subject rather than addressing the fundamental point (which is that Premier level tournaments with Koreans and Europeans competing in should be used instead of your cherry picked tournaments).
OK so which ones are those premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021 we should look at?
On January 24 2022 18:16 tigera6 wrote: [quote] When Maru lost PvT series in 2021, it was either to a Trap at his best, or when he was forced to play in GSL less than 12hrs after a long Bo7 with Reynor in DH Summer. Other than that, he was pretty great in PvT as well, yeah he threw games, but I dont know if he would throw the entire series.
Maru and all the other top Korean Terrans were very bad at PvsT in the first 2/3 of 2021. Maru straight up lost two series to Protoss in GSL Season 2 in 2021. Maru lost to sOs, and then Maru lost to Zoun in GSL Season 2: Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
And as I mentioned earlier, all the other top Korean Terrans were struggling heavily against Protoss in the first 2/3 of 2021. If it was a series between the top 3 Korean Protoss versus the top 3 Korean Terran - that is a series between Trap/Zest/Parting against Maru/Cure/(whoever 3rd best Korean Terran is), Trap/Zest/Parting would typically come out on top in the first 2/3 of 2021.
It wasn't until Cure had the amazing GSL Season 3 run that a top Terran finally managed to beat out Trap/Zest/Parting. But even in GSL Season 3 when Cure had his amazing run, Maru also lost to Trap.
You realize the gsl group of maru was played right after his finals vs reynor in the season finals so he included your example in his statement
You realize xelnaga is just trolling?
This is what you do Deacon Frost, you just troll over and over. You cherry pick the tournaments that suit you and prove your point. You outright ignore the Premier tournaments that don't suit your points.
Tell me lies, tell me sweet little lies, no-no, you can't disguise
Deacon Frost, all you do is cherry pick and troll. Pretty sad, IMO.
If you wanted more integrity in your arguments, you don't cherry pick. Just use all Premier tournaments, specifically the ones where all the top Koreans and top Europeans are mixed in. That's the best way to assess performance.
I am at work and not bored enough to reply to you in any at least semi-serious way, so ... uh... well... nope? I know trolls strive for replies, but are mine enough to keep you fed? I doubt that
All you do is troll. See, I bring up the point that you should use Premier level tournaments where both the Koreans and Europeans compete in, when assessing the state of the game. Now you just avoid this all together, not responding to why Premier level tournaments should be used, preferring to stick with your "cherry picked" tournaments. This is what a troll does, they try to move on to a different subject rather than addressing the fundamental point (which is that Premier level tournaments with Koreans and Europeans competing in should be used instead of your cherry picked tournaments).
It's not my fault that your arguments are invalid. Learn to read and properly discuss and maybe I will start taking you seriously, until then you're an object of entertainment and not a partner for discussion.
See, all you do is troll, troll, and troll. Once again, you try to avoid the discussion of Premier level tournaments by trying to switch the subject. SMH.
Felt suffocated watching Byun playing. First game was a bit okay but he didn't have anything to defend the lings banes run-by just like the yesterday game when he got swarmed easily by single nydus pop up. The 2nd game was just, did not know how to say...
On January 24 2022 19:55 swarminfestor wrote: Felt suffocated watching Byun playing. First game was a bit okay but he didn't have anything to defend the lings banes run-by just like the yesterday game when he got swarmed easily by single nydus pop up. The 2nd game was just, did not know how to say...
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
RIP Data, RIP you not beiung a troill
Why are you even trying anymore, i think it's best for all of us to ignore him from now on.
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
RIP Data, RIP you not beiung a troill
Why are you even trying anymore, i think it's best for all of us to ignore him from now on.
My boring meeting just started and it was a low hanging fruit xD A truly good troll wouldn't say something this ezly denied.
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
On January 24 2022 19:50 Argonauta wrote: OK so which ones are those premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021 we should look at?
Repeating this post again:
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
In the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021, the top 3 Korean Terran would typically lose out against the top 3 Korean Protoss.
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run.
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
Do you know what the best part of Deacon.Frost's post is? Deacon.Frost didn't post a link to his/her source. That's a big red flag in itself when a link isn't posted so we can double check Deacon.Frost's source. But you just blindly gobbled up whatever Deacon.Frost posted. SMH.
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
So I don't know who is the 3rd best Korean Terran in 2021. It's probably one of Bunny, Dream, or Byun. But if I look up Bunny and Dream against Trap/Zest/Parting, it doesn't look so good for Bunny and Dream from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021:
So for Bunny and Dream, they did pretty bad against the top 3 Protoss from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021, for this Aligulac data.
One thing you have to consider is that Aligulac also includes lower prized tournaments in these stats as well. It still gives us a data point to look at, so that is important (I am not saying we should disregard this data from Aligulac, please don't get my words wrong). However, in my opinion, for a player like Zest, Zest often is not at his best for the lower prized tournaments. If you watch Zest enough, you will know that Zest saves his best focus and best play for the Premier level tournaments.
That's why I said the top Korean Terran struggled against the top Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021. If I had to put money on Trap/Zest/Parting in a Premier tournament over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in the the first 2/3 of 2021, I would have put money on Trap/Zest/Parting coming out over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in a Premier tournament in the first 2/3 of 2021. I already posted how the top 3 Korean Terrans generally struggled against the top 3 Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021 in my summary here: https://tl.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/584302-gsl-super-tournament-1-day-three?page=4#71
Nothing I said was inaccurate. But you would have to be pretty blind or biased to not recognize that the top Korean Terrans didn't struggle against the top Korean Protoss in Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021.
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
So I don't know who is the 3rd best Korean Terran in 2021. It's probably one of Bunny, Dream, or Byun. But if I look up Bunny and Dream against Trap/Zest/Parting, it doesn't look so good for Bunny and Dream from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021:
So for Bunny and Dream, they did pretty bad against the top 3 Protoss from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021, for this Aligulac data.
One thing you have to consider is that Aligulac also includes lower prized tournaments in these stats as well. It still gives us a data point to look at, so that is important (I am not saying we should disregard this data from Aligulac, please don't get my words wrong). However, in my opinion, for a player like Zest, Zest often is not at his best for the lower prized tournaments. If you watch Zest enough, you will know that Zest saves his best focus and best play for the Premier level tournaments.
That's why I said the top Korean Terran struggled against the top Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021. If I had to put money on Trap/Zest/Parting in a Premier tournament over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in the the first 2/3 of 2021, I would have put money on Trap/Zest/Parting coming out over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in a Premier tournament in the first 2/3 of 2021. I already posted how the top 3 Korean Terrans generally struggled against the top 3 Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021 in my summary here: https://tl.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/584302-gsl-super-tournament-1-day-three?page=4#71
Nothing I said was inaccurate. But you would have to be pretty blind or biased to not recognize that the top Korean Terrans didn't struggle against the top Korean Protoss in Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021.
so the top 4 and 5 terran struggle against the top 3 protoss in TvP.... inst that... expected? normal? the opposite of your point?
On January 24 2022 19:44 xelnaga_empire wrote: [quote]
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
So I don't know who is the 3rd best Korean Terran in 2021. It's probably one of Bunny, Dream, or Byun. But if I look up Bunny and Dream against Trap/Zest/Parting, it doesn't look so good for Bunny and Dream from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021:
So for Bunny and Dream, they did pretty bad against the top 3 Protoss from Jan 1 to August 31 in 2021, for this Aligulac data.
One thing you have to consider is that Aligulac also includes lower prized tournaments in these stats as well. It still gives us a data point to look at, so that is important (I am not saying we should disregard this data from Aligulac, please don't get my words wrong). However, in my opinion, for a player like Zest, Zest often is not at his best for the lower prized tournaments. If you watch Zest enough, you will know that Zest saves his best focus and best play for the Premier level tournaments.
That's why I said the top Korean Terran struggled against the top Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021. If I had to put money on Trap/Zest/Parting in a Premier tournament over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in the the first 2/3 of 2021, I would have put money on Trap/Zest/Parting coming out over Maru/Cure/(whoever the 3rd best Terran is) in a Premier tournament in the first 2/3 of 2021. I already posted how the top 3 Korean Terrans generally struggled against the top 3 Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021 in my summary here: https://tl.net/forum/sc2-tournaments/584302-gsl-super-tournament-1-day-three?page=4#71
Nothing I said was inaccurate. But you would have to be pretty blind or biased to not recognize that the top Korean Terrans didn't struggle against the top Korean Protoss in Premier tournaments in the first 2/3 of 2021.
so the top 4 and 5 terran struggle against the top 3 protoss in TvP.... inst that... expected? normal? the opposite of your point?
My point was the top 3 Korean Terran struggled against the top 3 Korean Protoss in the Premier tournaments for the first 2/3 of 2021.
I have never deviated from that point. And I have provided proof of that, in the Premier tournament results. I also said the turning point for this was when Cure won GSL Season 3, beating the top 3 Protoss to win it.
I assume some Protoss players here don't want to admit that the top Korean Protoss did very well against the top Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 for Premier level tournaments. It is a fact though.
Just like some Protoss players say Protoss hasn't won anything in the last 2 years, when the facts show Trap won 6 Premier level tournaments in the last 1.5 years.
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
The data did support this. Like I said, the top 3 Korean Protoss would typically win out against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021. It happened over and over again, until GSL Season 3 with Cure's run. I (deacon) made the bolding and underscoring
Since January 01 2021 to August 31 2021 Maru is 11:10 vs Trap(3:2), 2:1 vs Parting(1:0, 9:2 vs Zest(4:0) Cure is 32:22 vs Trap(10:6), 28:21 vs Parting(8:3), 874 vs Zest(22:21) Byun is 24:20 vs Trap(9:5), 19:37 vs Parting(4:12), 86:78 vs Zest(25:19)
RIP Data, RIP you not beiung a troill
To the fake data claim, read the post I quoted. Top 3 Protoss players would typically win against the top 3 Terran players. NOTHING. ELSE. WRITTEN.
So what have I done? Open aligulac. Picked search results. Entered range 01Jan2021 - 31Aug2021. Picked Maru and Trap. Picked Maru and Parting. Picked Maru and Zest.
Didn't filter anything else.
Considering Maru doesn't play weeklies if Maru has overall successful rating that claim was already wrong. But hey, why not add weekly tournaments and stop cherrypicking data when XELNAGA wrote no restrictions in his post.
No trolling, no false data, no fake news. Just beating troll with data.
Just FYI.
Let's go on and see what the troll will come up with next.
Edit> I would like to note that if you open the quotation and search for premier you find no such word. You don't have to read it Edit2> Oh shoot, now you find premier in the previous edit. OH NOE, I DID IT AGAIN!
On January 24 2022 19:38 darklycid wrote: but tournaments dont support protoss dominating terran in the first 2/3 of 2021 it was pretty mixed.
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
On January 24 2022 19:44 xelnaga_empire wrote: [quote]
Then you are either very biased or blind. The Korean Terrans said multiple times they wanted to avoid Protoss in 2021.
Like were you not listening or watching interviews?
The Korean Terrans weren't saying they wanted to avoid Zerg. They wanted to avoid Protoss, over and over again.
What massive goalpost moving is this, like do you even read what you write? If the data doesnt support your claim i guess we take what ppl are saying now. I got a massive job opportunity for you at the local circus my man
Alright, Premier level tournaments are listed here: Premier Tournaments. The data is there to see the performance of the top Korean Protoss against the top Korean Terran.
Dreamhack Last Chance 2020/2021: Trap comes out on top, winning the whole thing.
IEM Katowice: Parting/Zest knock out Ty & Innovation (Clem gets knocked out by Zest)
GSL Super Tournament 1: Trap wins this again, beating multiple Korean Terrans along the way.
Next S1: Trap wins this too. Cure is the last Terran holdout, getting beat by Zest.
TSL 7: Trap wins this, beating Cure along the way.
GSL Season 2: This is where Maru loses to sOs and Zoun. Bunny also gets beat by Trap (Bunny or Dream are probably the 3rd best Korean Terran by GSL Season 2 so that's why I am including Bunny in this note).
DH Summer Masters 2021: Finally, an upset by Maru against the top 3 Protoss here with Maru winning against Zest in the group stages. Maru gets out of the group stages and avoids Protoss in the playoffs. Because Maru avoids Protoss, he manages to make it to the finals.
Seriously darklycid, the data is right there for Premier tournaments. How can you be so biased to not see that the top 3 Korean Protoss typically came out on top against the top 3 Korean Terran in the first 2/3 of 2021?
Aligulac shows all the series Cure played against Trap from January 1 to August 31. I get Cure 17 wins, Trap 16 wins in head to head games. In series count, I get Cure 5 series wins, Trap 5 series wins. Here is what I see in the Aligulac breakdown:
How is Decaon getting Cure is 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap?
Maybe consider that Deacon is the one that is trolling?
Even if cure is 5:5 with trap the data still doesn't support your claim + L + ratio.
On January 24 2022 21:00 xelnaga_empire wrote:
On January 24 2022 20:16 darklycid wrote: Deacon alrdy deleted ur data claim + L + ratio.
darklycid, why are you so quiet now that I showed Deacon Frost has wrong data? How is Deacon Frost getting 32:22, and 10:6 in series against Trap from January 1 to August 31 of 2021?
do you actually think i have this threads open 24/7 and just wait for your stupid troll posts?
I wasn't going to call you a troll and I was going to keep it civil with you. But at this point, you are a troll too.
You fell for Deacon.Frost's troll data. Deacon.Frost literally made up data to troll everyone and you fell for it. Are you trolling along with Deacon.Frost? Why do you support Deacon.Frost's troll data?
Well, weren't you the one who recommended ignoring him? And look and behold who's replying to the troll xD
Touche :D Triggered me way too hard, but ye now i'll ignore (i hope).
Well I'm gonna ignore him as well but let's be honest, he won't starve out here.
I actually wonder if I entered there January-January xD But hey, you did the data and they show Maru and Cure are fine, so why care. Well, that's what I get for arguing with a troll.
Another interview from Maru on TeamNV youtube channel, done right after Last Chance.
Turn out Maru did not have Zerg as practice partner, so he asked Ryung to play Terran with his new build idea against Maru playing Zerg, and Maru lost all the games in the end. Also, Maru confident that he can play Protoss (OP) and beat any Terran.
On January 24 2022 20:51 RKC wrote: Maru-Dark final hype!
(But this is ST, so we're fated to have a PvP final clown fiesta...)
This could be a repeat of ST1 in 2020, which was one of the great ST final imo.
Yeah, one of the most epic finals of all time! Let's not jinx it...
Maru vs Dark has been almost consistently a legendary match. All of their bo7s have been historic and they're basically even in h2h
Aside from their matches in late 2019 when Zerg was busted and Dark stomped all over Maru I agree. They produce the most consistently amazing games of any 2 players. Their styles just match each other in a very fun way.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/977.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/3226.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1850.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/682.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/951.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/4729.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/2838.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/5566.jpg)
Also wonder how many trolls we will see this time xD
Global StarCraft II League/2021/Season 2. The irony was, sOs's level had dropped and sOs was retiring, but it was still enough for sOs to beat Maru. A retiring Protoss player could still beat the GOAT for Terran, and Maru is still in his prime while sOs was not even close to his prime.
4 vs Zest(22:21)
