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On May 20 2020 19:35 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:34 looken wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:29 Morbidius wrote:
Terrans saying the balance is good for Terran=Game more imbalanced than WoL, Protoss and Zergs run for the hills. Can you point out the moments where you defended T/P during the zerg heavy years we just had? Just being curious where your standards were then. Can you point out how something that was wrong in the past can justify something that is wrong now? I'm not advocating for that, I am advocating for the fact that many people are not for balance. We had 2 unbalanced years and many were silent while they're just now woken up and have to say - wait, not now. Also if Zergs had their reign, why not terrans for a while.
You're just contradicting yourself.
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It's a bit sad to have all this balance talk on top such great play from TY rather than just enjoying the games (unless you're a Dark fan, that is understandable). Dark didn't lose because of balance, he lost because of TY playing amazing and Dark not having a good day.
According to aligulac, TvZ has been perfectly balanced for the last three months. So yeah we can definitely discuss the upcoming balance patch but today was not about balance.
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On May 20 2020 19:42 Morbidius wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:40 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:36 DieuCure wrote:On May 20 2020 19:33 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 DieuCure wrote:TY lost to Elazer 2-0 yesterday.  That's why Aligulac is a terrible metric. How should that show that Aligulac is a terrible metric? It might show that online tournaments played right before important offline events are a terrible metric. It favors online tournament heroes, Zest out of the top 10 is just how bad it is. That's another discussion, and Zest is ALSO an online hero. Most sucessful and consistent Protoss in SC2 history is now an ''online hero''.
There is also the fact that ping favors EU players over KR so it's easier to get results.
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On May 20 2020 19:43 atrox_ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:42 Morbidius wrote:On May 20 2020 19:40 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:36 DieuCure wrote:On May 20 2020 19:33 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 DieuCure wrote:TY lost to Elazer 2-0 yesterday. That's why Aligulac is a terrible metric. How should that show that Aligulac is a terrible metric? It might show that online tournaments played right before important offline events are a terrible metric. It favors online tournament heroes, Zest out of the top 10 is just how bad it is. That's another discussion, and Zest is ALSO an online hero. Most sucessful and consistent Protoss in SC2 history is now an ''online hero''. Not sure consistent is a word I'd use to describe zest
He's consistent like Innovation is consistent, sure he has embarassing moments and big slumps, but its someone we know can bounce back to the top at any time.
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Czech Republic12134 Posts
On May 20 2020 19:41 looken wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:35 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:34 looken wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:29 Morbidius wrote:
Terrans saying the balance is good for Terran=Game more imbalanced than WoL, Protoss and Zergs run for the hills. Can you point out the moments where you defended T/P during the zerg heavy years we just had? Just being curious where your standards were then. Can you point out how something that was wrong in the past can justify something that is wrong now? I'm not advocating for that, I am advocating for the fact that many people are not for balance. We had 2 unbalanced years and many were silent while they're just now woken up and have to say - wait, not now. Also if Zergs had their reign, why not terrans for a while. We had unbalaned years since the beginning of SC as there will never be perfect balance. However, attacking people that speak up now for not having done so earlier seems silly.
well, it's not. In my view they were fine with zergs being strong while other races were not. Now the card flips and they're in uproar. It;s hypocritical imo nad I don't like it./
Also if 2019 tought us something, iot's that heavy racial inbalance in 1 tourney isn't a reason to change balance - e.g. ST1 with so many protosses.
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the 71%WR vs toss, good luck parting
I wanna cheer for parting because hes the big boy obviously but I want 4 Terrans in the RO4 for the meme (and the dumb reddit posts). such a dilemma
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On May 20 2020 19:44 stilt wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:35 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:34 looken wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:29 Morbidius wrote:
Terrans saying the balance is good for Terran=Game more imbalanced than WoL, Protoss and Zergs run for the hills. Can you point out the moments where you defended T/P during the zerg heavy years we just had? Just being curious where your standards were then. Can you point out how something that was wrong in the past can justify something that is wrong now? I'm not advocating for that, I am advocating for the fact that many people are not for balance. We had 2 unbalanced years and many were silent while they're just now woken up and have to say - wait, not now. Also if Zergs had their reign, why not terrans for a while. You're just contradicting yourself.
Yeah his argument is stupid. Goal should be to keep the game relatively balanced, not to give each race their time to shine.
There have been issues in PvZ consistently for awhile now, it needs to be fixed. Terran has been looking strong since the map changes, worth keeping an eye on but since it's relatively recent and there's no dominant strategy that seems game breaking I think it's better to not have a huge knee jerk reaction right now, but definitely keep watching it.
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On May 20 2020 19:42 Morbidius wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:40 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:36 DieuCure wrote:On May 20 2020 19:33 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 DieuCure wrote:TY lost to Elazer 2-0 yesterday. That's why Aligulac is a terrible metric. How should that show that Aligulac is a terrible metric? It might show that online tournaments played right before important offline events are a terrible metric. It favors online tournament heroes, Zest out of the top 10 is just how bad it is. That's another discussion, and Zest is ALSO an online hero. Most sucessful and consistent Protoss in SC2 history is now an ''online hero''.
I think it's fair to say since Zest plays a lot of online these days. I do think Aligulac favours online heroes in general but there are always exceptions to any rule. For example, INnoVation and Cure probably have been ranked higher than their true rank for multiple months (although now, I do think their aligulac rank closely corresponds to actual rank). There were also times where Showtime, Uthermal and Solar had very high elo but it did not really materialize into great results.
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On May 20 2020 19:46 Andi_Goldberger wrote:
the 71%WR vs toss, good luck parting
Maru won most of his GSLs on the back of Protoss butchering.
Maru got 1st map pick because he finished 2nd in his group. As if he needed the advantage
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I love how Parting has a big speech for what his chances today are, while Maru is like ''He's doable',''
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will we see at least one maxpax?
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On May 20 2020 19:48 fLyiNgDroNe wrote:
will we see at least one maxpax?
would be disappointing if not
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Czech Republic12134 Posts
On May 20 2020 19:48 Pursuit_ wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:44 stilt wrote:On May 20 2020 19:35 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:34 looken wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 deacon.frost wrote:On May 20 2020 19:29 Morbidius wrote:
Terrans saying the balance is good for Terran=Game more imbalanced than WoL, Protoss and Zergs run for the hills. Can you point out the moments where you defended T/P during the zerg heavy years we just had? Just being curious where your standards were then. Can you point out how something that was wrong in the past can justify something that is wrong now? I'm not advocating for that, I am advocating for the fact that many people are not for balance. We had 2 unbalanced years and many were silent while they're just now woken up and have to say - wait, not now. Also if Zergs had their reign, why not terrans for a while. You're just contradicting yourself. Yeah his argument is stupid. Goal should be to keep the game relatively balanced, not to give each race their time to shine. There have been issues in PvZ consistently for awhile now, it needs to be fixed. Terran has been looking strong since the map changes, worth keeping an eye on but since it's relatively recent and there's no dominant strategy that seems game breaking I think it's better to not have a huge knee jerk reaction right now, but definitely keep watching it.
OK, so let's talk abalnce.
Point out where WC Dark lost to a balance issue
Point out where WC Rogue lost to a balance issue
Point out where the upcoming changes would make it worse for both reinging world champions.
Bonus points for pointing these things out on soO's games.
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On May 20 2020 19:44 sneakyfox wrote:
It's a bit sad to have all this balance talk on top such great play from TY rather than just enjoying the games (unless you're a Dark fan, that is understandable). Dark didn't lose because of balance, he lost because of TY playing amazing and Dark not having a good day.
According to aligulac, TvZ has been perfectly balanced for the last three months. So yeah we can definitely discuss the upcoming balance patch but today was not about balance.
yeah there wasn't very much that was super new in terms of meta that TY did in the series.
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On May 20 2020 19:48 Morbidius wrote:
I love how Parting has a big speech for what his chances today are, while Maru is like ''He's doable',''
Parting is extremely "doable" if you catch my drift
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TY got build order wins/ big advantages in every game. You could argue that its because T favored meta is making Dark play extra risky or safe, but i don't see that going anywhere.
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Not Aligulac's fault that there are separate player pools, every rating system would suffer from that (and even without region lock the covid online era would still be problematic in that regard).
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On May 20 2020 19:51 Schelim wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:48 Morbidius wrote:
I love how Parting has a big speech for what his chances today are, while Maru is like ''He's doable','' Parting is extremely "doable" if you catch my drift
What are you on about? You trying to make him pull out his ruler again?
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On May 20 2020 19:45 Morbidius wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2020 19:43 atrox_ wrote:On May 20 2020 19:42 Morbidius wrote:On May 20 2020 19:40 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:36 DieuCure wrote:On May 20 2020 19:33 Xain0n wrote:On May 20 2020 19:31 DieuCure wrote:TY lost to Elazer 2-0 yesterday. That's why Aligulac is a terrible metric. How should that show that Aligulac is a terrible metric? It might show that online tournaments played right before important offline events are a terrible metric. It favors online tournament heroes, Zest out of the top 10 is just how bad it is. That's another discussion, and Zest is ALSO an online hero. Most sucessful and consistent Protoss in SC2 history is now an ''online hero''. Not sure consistent is a word I'd use to describe zest He's consistent like Innovation is consistent, sure he has embarassing moments and big slumps, but its someone we know can bounce back to the top at any time.
Since 2018, Zest has been winning a lot of online events while not doing great offline. This year he looked very strong again(except that in the last week) but a lot of his Aligulac points come from online tournaments.
This statement has nothing to do with how relevant or successful Zest's career has been.
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EPT
