Korean server: 3 double-elimination qualifiers,8 total spots (3-3-2) Qualifier #1 Day 1 Friday, Apr 24 10:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Saturday, Apr 25 7:00am GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 3 qualify* Qualifier #2 Thursday, Apr 30 7:00am GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 3 qualify* Qualifier #3 Thursday, May 07 7:00am GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 2 qualify
NA server: 3 double-elimination qualifiers,7 total spots (3-2-2) Qualifier #1 Day 1 Monday, Apr 27 9:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Tuesday, Apr 28 8:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 3 qualify* Qualifier #2 Day 1 Friday, May 01 9:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Saturday, May 02 8:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 2 qualify Qualifier #3 Day 1 Monday, May 04 9:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Tuesday, May 05 8:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 2 qualify
EU server: 2 double-elimination qualifiers,5 total spots (3-2) Qualifier #1 Day 1 Friday, Apr 24 5:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Saturday, Apr 25 2:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 3 qualify* Qualifier #2 Day 1 Friday, May 01 5:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) Day 2 Saturday, May 02 2:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00): Top 2 qualify
*The first place winner of the 3 spot qualifiers will receive a first round bye and join our four invited players in the second round.
On April 24 2020 20:42 NoS-Craig wrote: I think TY isn't playing. Wardii said he had scheduling issues or something. Might have to do with GSL. Wardii says TY forfeited.
He played his first matches, must be that he forfeited after the match vs Chance.
Yes apparently TY sent 2 players to the loser bracket and then realized this schedule doesn't work because he plays GSL tomorrow and forfeited his 3rd match.
On April 24 2020 20:50 Elentos wrote: Yes apparently TY sent 2 players to the loser bracket and then realized this schedule doesn't work because he plays GSL tomorrow and forfeited his 3rd match.
On April 24 2020 20:50 Elentos wrote: Yes apparently TY sent 2 players to the loser bracket and then realized this schedule doesn't work because he plays GSL tomorrow and forfeited his 3rd match.
That is brutal :D
Also potentially needlessly harsh cause he was 2 matches away from qualifying (and the qualifying matches are apparently today still) through the winner bracket at that point, could have beaten soO and then Hurricane//Patience and then forfeited the seeding matches for the top 3.
Also not sure what's going on with so many koreans forfeiting losers bracket, is there anything going on rn, i mean TY has a gsl grp tomorrow but others?
On April 24 2020 21:47 darklycid wrote: Also not sure what's going on with so many koreans forfeiting losers bracket, is there anything going on rn, i mean TY has a gsl grp tomorrow but others?
Seems like they can't be bothered? I dunno, guys like Dream or Solar aren't gonna have much of a shot to play the next qualifiers because of GTC. So I don't know why Dream would forfeit unless he just thinks it's too much work. It's a pretty big money tournament after all.
Hi guys, we've become aware of the scheduling conflict with GTC and are moving the remaining Korean qualifiers, while consolidating them into a single day to avoid the forfeits. That way all the players eliminated today will have two more chances to qualify and there won't be any confusion over whether matches need to be played on one day or another.
For the fun of it, I decided to sign up for the qualifier - as diamond 1player. Corona makes me bored and... well... why not just have a bit of fun? :-P
On April 25 2020 01:51 Mallyx wrote: For the fun of it, I decided to sign up for the qualifier - as diamond 1player. Corona makes me bored and... well... why not just have a bit of fun? :-P
Hey, maybe a good story will come out of it. I still tell people about the time I almost beat Daisy (Korean Protoss), because from watching games of him I knew what he was gonna do and I blind countered him. Still lost, but I felt like a GSL player for a few moments there. :D
TY ended up forfeiting because the qualifier was scheduled for 2 days and he couldn't have played tomorrow because of GSL. Maybe he'd have played to the end if he knew in advance it wouldn't go to the 2nd day.
Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is for this reason, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
That what I am thinking too but I am pretty sure he participed in some esl cups. And I am still wonder why he get this far before being stopped
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
That what I am thinking too but I am pretty sure he participed in some esl cups. And I am still wonder why he get this far before being stoppes.
Yeah it's definitely an oversight then. I may even be completely wrong about "needing to be 16+" but it's hard to say. I would look it up on the Liquipedia but didn't find anything right away.
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
That what I am thinking too but I am pretty sure he participed in some esl cups. And I am still wonder why he get this far before being stoppes.
Just checked on Aligulac, he did play cup 12 and cup 2
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
That what I am thinking too but I am pretty sure he participed in some esl cups. And I am still wonder why he get this far before being stoppes.
Yeah wouldn't he just not be eligible to get points? Doesn't seem like a reason to dq unless TSL itself has age rules.
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
I think they allow anyone non-Korean to play in both EU/AM quals, but there is a choice of going for Kr xor EU/AM quals, at least that's what Liquipedia says. So yes, an EU player appears to be allowed to try in the EU or AM quals. They just can't seemingly play in KR, and EU/AM.
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
On April 25 2020 06:14 Ej_ wrote: Got to cast some amazing games today shoutout to people watching the slideshow avilo vs Bee when we peaked with 13 viewers
I don't understand why Protoss players don't veto this map vs Zerg. Is Purity and Industry really so horrible to play on that THIS is preferable? I mean he held, but that was way harder than it needed to be.
On April 25 2020 06:25 ThePhan2m wrote: Could someone clarify one thing. Where does the invited players get their seed from into TSL5?
It's based on EPT ranking. We built two lists: one for Korean players, one for foreigners. Then we started at the top of the lists and worked ourselves down until we had two Koreans and two from the rest of the world.
On April 25 2020 06:23 Vindicare605 wrote: I don't understand why Protoss players don't veto this map vs Zerg. Is Purity and Industry really so horrible to play on that THIS is preferable? I mean he held, but that was way harder than it needed to be.
On April 25 2020 06:23 Vindicare605 wrote: I don't understand why Protoss players don't veto this map vs Zerg. Is Purity and Industry really so horrible to play on that THIS is preferable? I mean he held, but that was way harder than it needed to be.
On April 25 2020 06:23 Vindicare605 wrote: I don't understand why Protoss players don't veto this map vs Zerg. Is Purity and Industry really so horrible to play on that THIS is preferable? I mean he held, but that was way harder than it needed to be.
Which map were you talking about?
Drogo vs TLO on Zen.
Zen's one of Protoss' better maps. Yeah there's all-ins but they can be held or even sometimes blind countered. And the short rush distances means your attacks get there faster. It's the regular macro maps (Ever Dream, Simulacrum) where Protoss gets destroyed the hardest (though ofc Protoss isn't doing that well anywhere).
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
MaxPax was Streaming, he was contacted by admins then, Who told him, je has to be 16 to Play. I also saw Babymarine in the bracket, so they appearently didn t check for age in signups, wich looks kinda bad.. It s a shame, as MaxPax had an quite impressive run allready and while I doubt he had a Chance to qualify in the end it would have been a great way to expose himselfe as hes currently teamless, since he left Mkrs...
On April 25 2020 06:23 Vindicare605 wrote: I don't understand why Protoss players don't veto this map vs Zerg. Is Purity and Industry really so horrible to play on that THIS is preferable? I mean he held, but that was way harder than it needed to be.
Which map were you talking about?
Drogo vs TLO on Zen.
Zen's one of Protoss' better maps. Yeah there's all-ins but they can be held or even sometimes blind countered. And the short rush distances means your attacks get there faster. It's the regular macro maps (Ever Dream, Simulacrum) where Protoss gets destroyed the hardest (though ofc Protoss isn't doing that well anywhere).
And most likely the Zerg would veto Purity instead of the Protoss.
On April 25 2020 03:42 Nebuchad wrote: Denver vs Maxpax went 1-1 and then last match was not played. French casters said he (Maxpax) was disqualified and they don't know why. Reasons later I guess
Apparently, it's because he is too young, it's strange considering Life was finalist at 15 in the last tsl. If it is a case, what a mess after the korean qualifier debacle, dns who got eliminated by maxpax is fucked.
I think that's because this rewards the new WCS system points, for which you have to be 16+.
That what I am thinking too but I am pretty sure he participed in some esl cups. And I am still wonder why he get this far before being stoppes.
Yeah wouldn't he just not be eligible to get points? Doesn't seem like a reason to dq unless TSL itself has age rules.
Hi,
since i read the rules/rule books (for TSL5 and EPT Cups and EPT general rules) I can answer your question regarding the age restrictions (even though i am no admin for TSL5):
1. The EPT general rule book states that players of any age can compete as long as the events rules/rule book doesn’t state otherwise, BUT Players have to be at least 16 years and 24h old before the first match of the event starts to be able to earn points. Thats why MaxPax can compete in ESL Open Cups as long as he doesn’t violate his own national law. (Since EU cups end early enough its no problem.)
2. Like any bigger SC2 event TSL5 has to on top of EPT rules abide by the Blizzard rules for events of $10k+ prize pool. Hence the age eligibility is 16+. (Same was for IEM Katowice and will be for any DH Masters event.) This rule is in part due to some EU countries having youth protection laws that permit people under the age of 16 to compete in any competition after certain times (e.g. in Germany 10pm local time).
3. As for why it only was noticed „so late“: Admins in such events (open bracket with so many players) have lots of stuff to do (seeding, answering players, stating the essential rules over and over in the ingame chat, ...). So it can take some time until someone has enough time to check for age restrictions, especially as admins usually do not know the age of most of the participants. For MaxPax his LP page states he is born 2005, hence can’t be 16+. He confirmed not being 16 on stream and towards Traidos too. Btw. he wasn’t the only player that was „DQed“ because of age.
4. As the rule for the age restriction is only listed in the rule book (section 1.1.2. bullet point 2) and not in the quick info on the bracket overview pages its easy for players to overlook it too. (Most players do not read the rule books/full rules. Several do not read any rules and just go with it (and ask admins if there is something unclear).)
Hope this clarifies things a bit.
Btw. I also linked the Qualifier Rule book for TSL5 on every TSL5 Qualifier page on Liquipedia last night. It is linked in the official brackets in the rule tab as well (thats where i got it from).
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
its 3 na server qualifiers (7spots total) and 2 eu server qualifiers (5spots total)
every one beside koreans and players that participate in the kr qualifiers (aka currently scarlett and some chinese players) can participate in all na/eu server qualifiers
a question that would be interesting to get answered is: Can players that made 2nd/3rd place in the first kr qualifier/eu qualifier again compete in the 2nd korean/first na qualifier, so they can take a shot at the better seed for which you need to win one of the 3spot qualifiers. Would be unfair if not imo, as those players were able to qualify in the first try and hence should not be disadvantaged by that, compared to someone that only did make first place in their possibly second qualifier in which the top3 are not allowed to participate in.
EDIT: got an answer to that from julmust —> no the players that qualify via their first qualifier are not allowed to play in another qualifier
so this now can result in players who perform worse in the qualifiers getting a better seed, more prize money and EPT points from that ...
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
its 3 na server qualifiers (7spots total) and 2 eu server qualifiers (5spots total)
every one beside koreans and players that participate in the kr qualifiers (aka currently scarlett and some chinese players) can participate in all na/eu server qualifiers
To be honest it would have indeed made more sense to have 3 EU qualifiers and 2 NA, there are just more high level players from Europe.
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
its 3 na server qualifiers (7spots total) and 2 eu server qualifiers (5spots total)
every one beside koreans and players that participate in the kr qualifiers (aka currently scarlett and some chinese players) can participate in all na/eu server qualifiers
To be honest it would have indeed made more sense to have 3 EU qualifiers and 2 NA, there are just more high level players from Europe.
Of course, but I doubt they did it because they think NA deserves that many spots, rather it's they want a NA player to qualify. With 7 spots that should happen.
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
its 3 na server qualifiers (7spots total) and 2 eu server qualifiers (5spots total)
every one beside koreans and players that participate in the kr qualifiers (aka currently scarlett and some chinese players) can participate in all na/eu server qualifiers
To be honest it would have indeed made more sense to have 3 EU qualifiers and 2 NA, there are just more high level players from Europe.
Of course, but I doubt they did it because they think NA deserves that many spots, rather it's they want a NA player to qualify. With 7 spots that should happen.
There's also the fact that NA qualifiers are accessible for players from LatAm, SEA, Taiwan, China etc. for whom EU would be unplayable and KR hopeless. It's playable for far more regions (including EU) and no NA players got invited to the main tournament. Makes sense EU has less spots, no?
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
They are named "NA server" and "EU server" qualifiers respectively in the OP so clearly the names of the qualifiers were not the issue here.
On April 25 2020 04:50 M3t4PhYzX wrote: wait a second.. why are there only 5 spots for EU in this tournament? wut...?
Don't worry. I'm sure EU will take most of the spots from the AM server qualifier too.
can they play there even?
I mean.. such a stacked region only getting 5 places is kind of ridiculous to be honest..
EU players can play in the AM qualifiers and they also get 2 invite spots. Most of the player lineup for the main tournament will end up being KR and EU.
so what's the point with making separate EU/NA qualifiers anyways? just make 4 EU/NA qualifiers and host 2 on NA and 2 on EU servers. The names caught me off guard, thanks for clearing it up
its 3 na server qualifiers (7spots total) and 2 eu server qualifiers (5spots total)
every one beside koreans and players that participate in the kr qualifiers (aka currently scarlett and some chinese players) can participate in all na/eu server qualifiers
To be honest it would have indeed made more sense to have 3 EU qualifiers and 2 NA, there are just more high level players from Europe.
"Reynor thought he was prettier than he was, Reynor was like "Mirror my beautiful mirror tell me who is the most beautiful" and the mirror was like "It's Heromarine son of a biiiitch""
Wait a second. With soO dropping out because he does not care about seeding, doesn't that mean, a player that does and does well and expects an Opponent that just barely qualified has to play soO? Aren't there any pros that care at all about seeding? Cause if they exists, what soO did, would be terrible, no?
uThermal! Did really well last month v Clem and takes this TvT as well. Not the macro games I was hoping for, but with his control every build involving a lot of reapers does well I guess! GG
On April 26 2020 01:56 naughtDE wrote: Wait a second. With soO dropping out because he does not care about seeding, doesn't that mean, a player that does and does well and expects an Opponent that just barely qualified has to play soO? Aren't there any pros that care at all about seeding? Cause if they exists, what soO did, would be terrible, no?
"expects an Opponent that just barely qualified"
I mean only a single player per qualifier gets to Ro16 straight away. So no nobody who will qualifiy for this event will expect a easier opponent. Reynor will prob end up first and qualify for the ro16 straight away while uthermal and heromarine will get a ro24 spot even when they qualified first when all the top dogs were in it. Bit of a flaw in the system, but you will meet a top player either way
On April 26 2020 01:56 naughtDE wrote: Wait a second. With soO dropping out because he does not care about seeding, doesn't that mean, a player that does and does well and expects an Opponent that just barely qualified has to play soO? Aren't there any pros that care at all about seeding? Cause if they exists, what soO did, would be terrible, no?
"expects an Opponent that just barely qualified"
I mean only a single player per qualifier gets to Ro16 straight away. So no nobody who will qualifiy for this event will expect a easier opponent. Reynor will prob end up first and qualify for the ro16 straight away while uthermal and heromarine will get a ro24 spot even though they qualified first when all the top dogs were in it. Bit of a flaw in the system, but you will meet a top player either way
On April 26 2020 03:59 hjpalpha wrote: With a winners bracket advantage (that most double elim brackets have and imo should have) it would already have been the win.
I mean, Bo3 with advantage would be kind of ridiculous, and in a Bo5 with advantage you need to win two anyways, so I'd say that's alright.
On April 26 2020 03:59 hjpalpha wrote: With a winners bracket advantage (that most double elim brackets have and imo should have) it would already have been the win.
I mean, Bo3 with advantage would be kind of ridiculous, and in a Bo5 with advantage you need to win two anyways, so I'd say that's alright.
On April 26 2020 03:59 hjpalpha wrote: With a winners bracket advantage (that most double elim brackets have and imo should have) it would already have been the win.
For a qualification tournament since there are 3 winners you are right. But moot anyways.
On April 26 2020 01:56 naughtDE wrote: Wait a second. With soO dropping out because he does not care about seeding, doesn't that mean, a player that does and does well and expects an Opponent that just barely qualified has to play soO? Aren't there any pros that care at all about seeding? Cause if they exists, what soO did, would be terrible, no?
"expects an Opponent that just barely qualified"
I mean only a single player per qualifier gets to Ro16 straight away. So no nobody who will qualifiy for this event will expect a easier opponent. Reynor will prob end up first and qualify for the ro16 straight away while uthermal and heromarine will get a ro24 spot even when they qualified first when all the top dogs were in it. Bit of a flaw in the system, but you will meet a top player either way
Sure, the quality will be ridiculous, so it shouldn't matter. Therefor everyone that plays the qualifier to the end after they are qualified, just does it to entertain us. I just realized that if one player doesn't respect seeding, then it becomes meaningless for all players.
The only Player, who somewhat profits from the extra NA seeds compared to Eu is semingly Nice. Neeb would be able to get a spot on the Eu Server eventually as well and apart from them it s an EU fest over there...
On April 28 2020 18:11 stilt wrote: The winner of Clem/Elazer will got a free round while uthermy and Reynor who qualified before won't. What a nice format
Yeah, they probably didn t think that thru.. Also the times are still not realy EU friendly And I just noticed that the 2nd EU and NA qualifiers are scheduled for the same day, we might see another round of bys, skewing the competition in the 2nd NA qualifier there :/
On April 28 2020 18:11 stilt wrote: The winner of Clem/Elazer will got a free round while uthermy and Reynor who qualified before won't. What a nice format
Imagine if uThermal played Clem in a deciding match with uThermal already qualified. We'd get people complaining about competitive integrity immediately, and rightfully so. We've owned up to mistakes along the way already and will do so again if we must, but in this case there are very good arguments for what we've decided on. At least that's how I see it.
DRG is pretty close to qualifying, gogo DRG. (currently 1-0 up against Creator and viewable on HorussTV, don't know if anywhere else, last I checked the other streams showed different matches)
DRG vs Silky next, it's strange, but one of these two will quailify from what I understand.
On April 30 2020 18:18 HolydaKing wrote: DRG is pretty close to qualifying, gogo DRG. (currently 1-0 up against Creator and viewable on HorussTV, don't know if anywhere else, last I checked the other streams showed different matches)
DRG vs Silky next, it's strange, but one of these two will quailify from what I understand.
Yeah thanks to the Super Tournament not giving out Points, Hurricane had a higher seed than Trap and thus the upper breaket is a lot weaker than the bottom one.. That and the Upsetgalore there gave us Parting - Trap as qualifying match on the one hand and Silky - DRG on the other
Patience used to be very strong not long ago and Silky beat him, Taeja who didn't do terribly yesterday also lost to Silky. But sure, the lower part of the upper bracket had the stronger players overall.
How the hell did TaeJa lose to Silky? Doesn't look very impressive vs. Bunny at all. (Edit: G2 was much better than G1 at least. Still, kind of a let down.)
With Special participating in the EU Qualifier it d be funny, if after 3 EU players qualifieing at NA #1, now we get Neeb and Special in the EU Qualifier #2
On May 02 2020 02:17 dbRic1203 wrote: With Special participating in the EU Qualifier it d be funny, if after 3 EU players qualifieing at NA #1, now we get Neeb and Special in the EU Qualifier #2
On May 02 2020 02:17 dbRic1203 wrote: With Special participating in the EU Qualifier it d be funny, if after 3 EU players qualifieing at NA #1, now we get Neeb and Special in the EU Qualifier #2
Feel like Neeb is not in form though.
Hasnt been playing well in any tournament this year has he? Actually slightly favoured Denver beforehand which says a lot.. Aiai
On May 02 2020 06:30 ssg wrote: So we dont know who qualifies yet from EU but everyone is going to play in na meanwhile? Lol
I mean it's unnecessary but it's not like it's difficult to do, if you qualify in both the spot goes to whoever lost last in the bracket with possibly a tiebreak game
On May 02 2020 06:49 argonautdice wrote: This scheduling is really confusing. So a bunch of people get knocked out unnecessarily because everyone is playing in two qualifiers.
No just like all other qualies expect the KR ones, the qualy lasts a few hours and then they continue the next day. The eu one stopped just before the NA one
On May 02 2020 06:49 argonautdice wrote: This scheduling is really confusing. So a bunch of people get knocked out unnecessarily because everyone is playing in two qualifiers.
No just like all other qualies expect the KR ones, the qualy lasts a few hours and then they continue the next day. The eu one stopped just before the NA one
Players in the EU qualifier are playing in the NA qualifier. Which means that if they qualify they'll drop out of the other qualifier after having knocked out some other players on the way there.
On May 02 2020 06:49 argonautdice wrote: This scheduling is really confusing. So a bunch of people get knocked out unnecessarily because everyone is playing in two qualifiers.
No just like all other qualies expect the KR ones, the qualy lasts a few hours and then they continue the next day. The eu one stopped just before the NA one
Players in the EU qualifier are playing in the NA qualifier. Which means that if they qualify they'll drop out of the other qualifier after having knocked out some other players on the way there.
Special is playing both EU and AM qualifiers today. Isn't he already qualified in the EU?
On May 02 2020 06:49 argonautdice wrote: This scheduling is really confusing. So a bunch of people get knocked out unnecessarily because everyone is playing in two qualifiers.
No just like all other qualies expect the KR ones, the qualy lasts a few hours and then they continue the next day. The eu one stopped just before the NA one
Players in the EU qualifier are playing in the NA qualifier. Which means that if they qualify they'll drop out of the other qualifier after having knocked out some other players on the way there.
Special is playing both EU and AM qualifiers today. Isn't he already qualified in the EU?
On May 02 2020 06:49 argonautdice wrote: This scheduling is really confusing. So a bunch of people get knocked out unnecessarily because everyone is playing in two qualifiers.
No just like all other qualies expect the KR ones, the qualy lasts a few hours and then they continue the next day. The eu one stopped just before the NA one
Players in the EU qualifier are playing in the NA qualifier. Which means that if they qualify they'll drop out of the other qualifier after having knocked out some other players on the way there.
Special is playing both EU and AM qualifiers today. Isn't he already qualified in the EU?
Nope, only 2 spots in the second EU qualifier.
Oh, ok. Well that makes sense. No. It doesn't. This entire qualifier so far is a farce. We've got a lot of good games, but the organization is just so poor.
It feels like Neeb's response to mech hasn't really changed over the years. Against uThermal two years ago he had a similar 3 robo response. That's probably not a bad thing tbh. At least he has a plan mapped out vs mech and isn't winging as it feels some Protosses do.
If SpeCial and Lambo are the two finalists for the AM qualifier in addition to being the two finalists of the EU qualifer that would really do a good job of underlining what a shitshow this is.
It would make the series between them entirely meaningless for one.
edit: Ok so they're both through now given that the loser in EU will just automatically qualify through NA.
On May 02 2020 09:51 ZigguratOfUr wrote: If SpeCial and Lambo are the two finalists for the AM qualifier in addition to being the two finalists of the EU qualifer that would really do a good job of underlining what a shitshow this is.
It would make the series between them entirely meaningless for one.
Gotta clarify if Lambo qualifies directly from AM after he loses to Special in EU, causes that has implications for the third place match. Either he gets the spot directly from AM and the third place in EU qualifies, or he qualifies as second place in EU and the third and fourth of NA qualify.
On May 02 2020 09:51 ZigguratOfUr wrote: If SpeCial and Lambo are the two finalists for the AM qualifier in addition to being the two finalists of the EU qualifer that would really do a good job of underlining what a shitshow this is.
It would make the series between them entirely meaningless for one.
Gotta clarify if Lambo qualifies directly from AM after he loses to Special in EU, causes that has implications for the third place match. Either he gets the spot directly from AM and the third place in EU qualifies, or he qualifies as second place in EU and the third and fourth of NA qualify.
Depends on the players. If they apply the rules consistently (which isn't a given) the loser of the EU winner's bracket finals would have the option to play in the EU loser's bracket. They can try to win the second seed in EU with the knowledge that if they lose they're going to qualify through NA. Why would they do that? Maybe to try to play kingmaker and help some of their friends qualify (i.e watch who gets to the Loser's Finals in EU and forfeit if they're your buddy, and beat them to open up an extra spot in NA if they aren't).
But the most likely scenario is that SpeCiaL is just going to forfeit the EU winner's finals and the EU loser's bracket and automatically qualify through NA.
Wardii said that both Lambo and Special are Qualified and will not be playing the winners bracket matches. the remaining spots will be given to the winners of the loser brackets.
why the fuk would Special and Lambo participate in the NA Qualifier if they made the final in the EU one? I don't wanna sound rude but that's just pathetic, like quit hogging all the qualifier space and let others qualify for crying out loud Especially since Special had already qualified for the EU qualifier finals one before NA qualifiers even started, he could have dropped out, but decided to fuk up the NA seeding by running a qualifier he had no reason to run. This is why EU qualifiers and NA qualifiers should not overlap in either a) schedule date (not Special or Lambo's fault) or b) EU guys in EU qualifiers only, NA guys in NA qualifiers only
He did not qualify for EU because 2 spots in this qualifier, and he could be eliminated by losing to Lambo and then in the losers bracket, that is why he participated in NA, same for Lambo.
On May 02 2020 10:41 DiMano wrote: He did not qualify for EU because 2 spots in this qualifier, and he could be eliminated by losing to Lambo and then in the losers bracket, that is why he participated in NA, same for Lambo.
Amazing to wake up to this shitshow I m glad Special and Lambo got to both winner finals, to Show how bad that scheduling was. Also can someone from TL please comment on the rumor about forcing NA Server? What is that supposed to do? EU allready has way more good Players AND less qualifying spots. They allready gave NA more spots to give South East Asia and Ozeanian Players a Chance to compete at reasonable ping. Edit:
Vanya, Mana, Skillous all had to play NA, wich is obviously bad for Mana but horribly worse for the 2 Russians. Would have liked to see some sportsmanship out of Special there after arguments in Pro chat to say, he s playing EU Obviously can t blame him to take the advantage, but would have been a nice move
Vanya, Mana and Skillous should be given a chance to play on the EU server. Correct this and replay the matches in that order before the AM qualifier continues. With any luck it brings back some excitement also to both qualifiers day 2. There is still time to fix this.
On May 02 2020 14:59 BaneRiders wrote: Vanya, Mana and Skillous should be given a chance to play on the EU server. Correct this and replay the matches in that order before the AM qualifier continues. With any luck it brings back some excitement also to both qualifiers day 2. There is still time to fix this.
Appearently Lambo and Special were told allready that they re both qualified..
On May 02 2020 14:59 BaneRiders wrote: Vanya, Mana and Skillous should be given a chance to play on the EU server. Correct this and replay the matches in that order before the AM qualifier continues. With any luck it brings back some excitement also to both qualifiers day 2. There is still time to fix this.
Appearently Lambo and Special were told allready that they re both qualified..
Tough luck for them I would say. I think they should still have to play for it according to the rules. They are both in a terrific spot to qualify.
I mean, this is the first non-ESL tourney with EPT points right? And they can't even follow their own rules in the qualifiers? Is this the standard we should expect from all tourneys now, that they tweak the rules as they see fit to benefit certain players over others? Because in the end, this is what happened as far as I can tell. And that sucks.
What a mess. TSL competing for the title of worst tournament organisation. Particularly funny to see considering Koreans can only play in their own server qualifier, too. Wonder why the same doesn't apply to NA and EU players?
Yeah TSL is an organizational catastrophe to such extent that this thing giving out EPT points would be criminal at this point. It's getting worse with every passing qualifier.
On May 02 2020 15:28 BaneRiders wrote: I mean, this is the first non-ESL tourney with EPT points right? And they can't even follow their own rules in the qualifiers? Is this the standard we should expect from all tourneys now, that they tweak the rules as they see fit to benefit certain players over others? Because in the end, this is what happened as far as I can tell. And that sucks.
StayAtHSC gave EPT points, I think. It had its share of faux-pas, but nowhere near this level.
On May 02 2020 15:28 BaneRiders wrote: I mean, this is the first non-ESL tourney with EPT points right? And they can't even follow their own rules in the qualifiers? Is this the standard we should expect from all tourneys now, that they tweak the rules as they see fit to benefit certain players over others? Because in the end, this is what happened as far as I can tell. And that sucks.
StayAtHSC gave EPT points, I think. It had its share of faux-pas, but nowhere near this level.
Looking at the loser Bracket in EU and NA - it is almost the same players remainig in both, just in a different order. And beside Neeb in EU and Astrea in NA, only EU Players playing it out.
I will never stop being amazed how tournament organizers all over the world can keep fucking up structures this badly.
Some person who was any idea about incentives should write a guide with a few rules to stick too to fight this. I will start with a few rules I see broken again and again.
1. I don't see any reason to make a tournament structure that does not have a field size that is a power of 2. As soon as you deviate from that you will always have weird seeding issues arising or horrible group stages (e.g. the 2016 football european championships)
2. This is especially true if the qualification round/ group stage that decides the seeding can not be played simultanously. This leads to situations like in the TSL where Clem ends up improving his seeding by losing the first EU qualifier.
3. Avoid matches without meaning at all costs. Professional players are hyper competitive and hate matches without any incentive, especially after they played through a taxing qualifier for multiple hours. Removing a winners bracket advantage for the final made the winners bracket final itself almost meaningless, once againg giving an incentive to pass on it or not take it seriously.
4. Be as clear about the rules as possible, before the tournament starts. Issues like which server the matches will be played on have to be written in stone, so there is not even the possiblity of discussion coming up. Obviously playin an EU qualifier on NA is dumb as fuck, but if it was known before players knew what they were getting into. This way it's just plain unfair and even worse if they were not consistent with forcing maps on NA.
Those are the ones I find most important and keep seeing violated even for organizers who have been following the scene for years. I'm sure there are more, feel free to add.
But taking away the EPT points now would make it even worse. Some players already in might pull out, and the system of giving points would be compromised further. It's all so sad. I'm not saying SKillous should beat Special, but the way you arrive at the predictable result should matter. Otherwise we might as well run tournaments on Aligulac and save the bother.
On May 02 2020 17:59 Gina wrote: But taking away the EPT points now would make it even worse. Some players already in might pull out, and the system of giving points would be compromised further. It's all so sad. I'm not saying SKillous should beat Special, but the way you arrive at the predictable result should matter. Otherwise we might as well run tournaments on Aligulac and save the bother.
While that's certainly true, having a tournament that has this many fuck ups in the qualifier phase affect the global ranking for the world championship at the end of the season is hardly ideal either. We can only hope that other events further down the line work out better and are held to a higher standard so that ultimately TSL didn't affect anyone too negatively.
On May 02 2020 17:59 Gina wrote: But taking away the EPT points now would make it even worse. Some players already in might pull out, and the system of giving points would be compromised further. It's all so sad. I'm not saying SKillous should beat Special, but the way you arrive at the predictable result should matter. Otherwise we might as well run tournaments on Aligulac and save the bother.
No need to take away the points, just play the games again that weren't played according to the rules (if the disadvantaged players are up for it). The bracket may end up looking identical for all we know.
I can only assume ESL allowed this tournament to have points because it approved of the rules beforehand. Changing the rules in the middle of the tournament should probably require an additional approval of ESL before any points can be handed out. Breaking the rules deliberately should be reason enough for ESL to say it is a breech of our contract, no EPT points will be awarded.
Having a EU qualifier where neither the players are restricted geographically, nor the games are restricted serverwise is just weird. Why bother calling it EU qualifier to begin with?
On May 02 2020 18:38 JustPassingBy wrote: Having a EU qualifier where neither the players are restricted geographically, nor the games are restricted serverwise is just weird. Why bother calling it EU qualifier to begin with?
Again, the servers are restricted according to the rules:
On May 02 2020 18:38 JustPassingBy wrote: Having a EU qualifier where neither the players are restricted geographically, nor the games are restricted serverwise is just weird. Why bother calling it EU qualifier to begin with?
Again, the servers are restricted according to the rules:
On May 02 2020 18:38 JustPassingBy wrote: Having a EU qualifier where neither the players are restricted geographically, nor the games are restricted serverwise is just weird. Why bother calling it EU qualifier to begin with?
Again, the servers are restricted according to the rules:
Yes, but rules don't matter if they are broken by the tournament admins.
Precisely! Imagine a scenario where Special now earns some EPT points in this tourney and qualifies for the grand final because of it at the cost of someone else. Much as I like Special I would hate that to happen, because we would all know that the EPT point system had been compromised due to TSL 5 breaking its own rules. If I were Apollo I would do some calls right now, there is lots at stake here.
The worst part is that the admins broke the rules deliberately and not out of ignorance. According to SKillous there were a lot of discussions in the TSL chat and Vanya, Mana argued with the admins before the games were played on NA.
On May 02 2020 19:44 Olli wrote: Just want to drop in and say we're working on figuring this out. Sorry for the mess, hope we can find a way to fix as much of this as possible.
On May 02 2020 19:44 Olli wrote: Just want to drop in and say we're working on figuring this out. Sorry for the mess, hope we can find a way to fix as much of this as possible.
Respecfully pointing out existing problems is one thing, recklessly barking accuses is another; be thankful that we were gifted anothers TSL first, these qualifiers were flawed for sure but by no means "catastrophic", "the worst ever" as someone would deduct judging by the comments seen here.
On May 02 2020 16:16 Durnuu wrote: What a mess. TSL competing for the title of worst tournament organisation. Particularly funny to see considering Koreans can only play in their own server qualifier, too. Wonder why the same doesn't apply to NA and EU players?
On May 02 2020 16:20 Ej_ wrote: This is embarassing and pathetic.
On May 02 2020 17:04 Elentos wrote: Yeah TSL is an organizational catastrophe to such extent that this thing giving out EPT points would be criminal at this point. It's getting worse with every passing qualifier.
You guys got it out of your system yet? Or do you need a couple more pages to score points with each other?
Obviously today did not go as smoothly as we had hoped for, but we are all here working hard to get the TSL going. There are lot of groups involved, and a lot of moving parts, so that sometimes leads to misunderstandings. But at the end of the day, all of us want a positive and fair result. I would imagine that goes the same for you.
As Olli said, we will let you know once it is sorted out, so save your armchair analysis until then. Just remember, what you type affects other people.
On May 02 2020 19:40 JustPassingBy wrote: The worst part is that the admins broke the rules deliberately and not out of ignorance.
And this is the most insulting thing of all. If that is really what you think, then see you later.
What a strange game between MaNa and souL. MaNa loses scores of workers to mines, but then wins every engagement due to souL attacking into awful position after awful position playing like he'd already won the game.
What a choke by soul - felt like he tunnel visioned into liberators when Vikings might have been better against tempest colossi. Plus fell apart against the zealot harass. Good comeback by Mana tho
On May 03 2020 01:58 Bagration wrote: What a choke by soul - felt like he tunnel visioned into liberators when Vikings might have been better against tempest colossi. Plus fell apart against the zealot harass. Good comeback by Mana tho
I think his composition was fine--anything would have done with that advantage. But doing stuff like pushing into the natural through the choke where your army gets stormed to death if they try to protect the very forward placed libs from all the tempest, and just letting the ghosts fight the colossi straight up is going to throw away any advantage. Props to MaNa for playing it very cool in those situations, and just zoning the army while picking away at the lib.
Just Harstem and Tlo to qualify for the full Liquid lineup. Harstem has a good shot as well considering how deep he is in the lower bracket. Man that last qualifier is going to be intense.
On May 03 2020 02:36 JustPassingBy wrote: Congrats to Mana for qualifying! And congrats to Bly, Astrea, Neeb and Kelazhur, who just advanced another round in the AM qualifiers!
? NA qualifiers havnt begun yet. They ended yesterday and will start again soon
On May 03 2020 02:36 JustPassingBy wrote: Congrats to Mana for qualifying! And congrats to Bly, Astrea, Neeb and Kelazhur, who just advanced another round in the AM qualifiers!
? NA qualifiers havnt begun yet. They ended yesterday and will start again soon
I think what they meant was that the winner of the Bly/Astrea/Neeb/Kelazhur part of the bracket automatically advances an extra round because MaNa drops out of NA by qualifying through EU.
I mean if Bly could of killed the batteries.. But Neeb could of just sat on it with 2 archons who would be invinsible.. And send the others out, but I guess if Bly catched those other archons out on the map then he can build a hatchery and mine again while neeb is stuck.. So eh Bly had a solid chance actually.. Yikes
On May 03 2020 06:35 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: AAAARGH BLY FORGOT TO BUILD
To be fair with where the drones were at the point when Neeb was killing the last extractor, all Bly could have made was a hatchery literally in the middle of the map.
On May 03 2020 06:35 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: AAAARGH BLY FORGOT TO BUILD
To be fair with where the drones were at the point when Neeb was killing the last extractor, all Bly could have made was a hatchery literally in the middle of the map.
On May 03 2020 06:35 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: AAAARGH BLY FORGOT TO BUILD
To be fair with where the drones were at the point when Neeb was killing the last extractor, all Bly could have made was a hatchery literally in the middle of the map.
If anyone's going to make a hatch literally in the middle of the map it's going to be Bly
Special and Lambo already got qualifying spots so they didn't play any more games, thus walkovers. It was a bit of a mix up because of the qualifying schedules. Because both Lambo and Special where to face of against each other in both the NA and EU qualifying finals.
That is very confusing lol why bother giving it EU and AM labels if the same players are playing the same formatted tournaments (i understand its because of the servers)
On May 03 2020 07:45 vult wrote: That is very confusing lol why bother giving it EU and AM labels if the same players are playing the same formatted tournaments (i understand its because of the servers)
On May 03 2020 07:43 NoS-Craig wrote: Special and Lambo already got qualifying spots so they didn't play any more games, thus walkovers. It was a bit of a mix up because of the qualifying schedules. Because both Lambo and Special where to face of against each other in both the NA and EU qualifying finals.
No I don't think there was any mix up with qualifying schedules. The EU and AM qualifiers were played exactly as planned.
On May 03 2020 17:19 Geo.Rion wrote: What's up with Neeb's PvP, he keeps getting knocked out by eu protoss in the deciding match. Ptitdrogo, Mana and now Harstem
On May 03 2020 17:19 Geo.Rion wrote: What's up with Neeb's PvP, he keeps getting knocked out by eu protoss in the deciding match. Ptitdrogo, Mana and now Harstem
We're also a week removed from Neeb getting 2-0'd by Rotti.
So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
Hmmm. From a talent level perspective this is pretty cool, the best in Europe vs some of the best in Korea (minus Rogue, Dark and Maru) is going to make for some high level games.
But the fact that we had 3 "American" qualifiers and aside from Special all of the players to qualify from them were Europeans. does leave a bit of a sour taste in my mouth.
I know this tournament had open qualifiers for every region so every player could play in every qualifier, but isn't the entire reason we started doing regionlocked tournaments is to avoid this very exact scenario? If this becomes the norm doesn't that mean that regionlocking needs to be reevaluated again?
Everyone freaked out when WCS America was just Korean players, this doesn't seem to be inciting that same reaction, why not?
Like I said, for just one tournament this doesn't really mean that much, but if we're going to have anti-Korean regionlocking, for other tournaments then EU conquests of the other regions should be a focus as well.
On May 03 2020 17:34 Vindicare605 wrote: So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
To be fair Scarlett and the top Chinese players have chosen to play KR qualifiers so they're not allowed to play NA. Which doesn't really make sense but those are the rules everyone agreed to.
But yeah with it being Nice vs the entirety of Europe, there's no real chance for Asian qualification through NA.
On May 03 2020 17:34 Vindicare605 wrote: So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
To be fair Scarlett and the top Chinese players have chosen to play KR qualifiers so they're not allowed to play NA. Which doesn't really make sense but those are the rules everyone agreed to.
Still, it would be nice for once to have a Korean qualifier, a Chinese qualifier, an American qualifier and a European qualifier (including those that have chosen to live in a different region, but no participation in multiple qualifiers allowed). Aussies and people of other nations can play where they want, but only select one.
On May 03 2020 17:34 Vindicare605 wrote: So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
Hmmm. From a talent level perspective this is pretty cool, the best in Europe vs some of the best in Korea (minus Rogue, Dark and Maru) is going to make for some high level games.
But the fact that we had 3 "American" qualifiers and aside from Special all of the players to qualify from them were Europeans. does leave a bit of a sour taste in my mouth.
I know this tournament had open qualifiers for every region so every player could play in every qualifier, but isn't the entire reason we started doing regionlocked tournaments is to avoid this very exact scenario? If this becomes the norm doesn't that mean that regionlocking needs to be reevaluated again?
Everyone freaked out when WCS America was just Korean players, this doesn't seem to be inciting that same reaction, why not?
Like I said, for just one tournament this doesn't really mean that much, but if we're going to have anti-Korean regionlocking, for other tournaments then EU conquests of the other regions should be a focus as well.
these are the rules of 1 specific tournament, and its qualifiers arent gonna be the golden standard for future tournaments I should think. And btw there are 7 spots from the "American" qualifiers, so far it's 1 NA, 4 EU, with 2 more undecided. I dont think i can name 7 NA players with realistic chance to take a map from the top competitors. I understand it's confusing that they re called NA qualifiers but still
On May 03 2020 17:34 Vindicare605 wrote: So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
Hmmm. From a talent level perspective this is pretty cool, the best in Europe vs some of the best in Korea (minus Rogue, Dark and Maru) is going to make for some high level games.
But the fact that we had 3 "American" qualifiers and aside from Special all of the players to qualify from them were Europeans. does leave a bit of a sour taste in my mouth.
I know this tournament had open qualifiers for every region so every player could play in every qualifier, but isn't the entire reason we started doing regionlocked tournaments is to avoid this very exact scenario? If this becomes the norm doesn't that mean that regionlocking needs to be reevaluated again?
Everyone freaked out when WCS America was just Korean players, this doesn't seem to be inciting that same reaction, why not?
Like I said, for just one tournament this doesn't really mean that much, but if we're going to have anti-Korean regionlocking, for other tournaments then EU conquests of the other regions should be a focus as well.
these are the rules of 1 specific tournament, and its qualifiers arent gonna be the golden standard for future tournaments I should think.
And I say as much in my post, but I just want to make it known that I think the qualifiers for this tournament especially when you consider it STARTED with giving seemingly 4 random invites out, has been a bit of a mess. In the future if they wanna do qualifiers either separate it by region properly and include a Chinese qualifier or make a series of truly open qualifiers so that anyone from any region can play in all of them.
The way this tournament did it seems like the worst of both options. And I get it, having to do the whole thing online is probably not what TL wanted to do originally so some sacrifices for COVID have to be made but still.
Once we're past how weird these qualifiers have been, now I just hope we get good games. We have a very strong pool of players here talent wise, so I want to see some good matches out of them.
On May 03 2020 17:19 Geo.Rion wrote: What's up with Neeb's PvP, he keeps getting knocked out by eu protoss in the deciding match. Ptitdrogo, Mana and now Harstem
TBH, as an american who always roots for neeb, I think neeb's tendency to be greedy, especially against players he assumes he is better than, is coming back to haunt him in the modern pvp, which is a coinflip-y matchup where anyone can win regardless of "skill"
ptitdrog, mana, and harstem, while on paper might be less talented than neeb, are certainly NOT pushovers, extremely talented players and students of the game. Neeb might not be taking them seriously or something imo
just my take
this is also why you see Neeb's PvZ fluctuate between extremely good against the best zergs in the world, and shaky against "lesser" zerg players
On May 03 2020 17:34 Vindicare605 wrote: So we have 1 player from either of the Americas and no Chinese players.
Hmmm. From a talent level perspective this is pretty cool, the best in Europe vs some of the best in Korea (minus Rogue, Dark and Maru) is going to make for some high level games.
But the fact that we had 3 "American" qualifiers and aside from Special all of the players to qualify from them were Europeans. does leave a bit of a sour taste in my mouth.
I know this tournament had open qualifiers for every region so every player could play in every qualifier, but isn't the entire reason we started doing regionlocked tournaments is to avoid this very exact scenario? If this becomes the norm doesn't that mean that regionlocking needs to be reevaluated again?
Everyone freaked out when WCS America was just Korean players, this doesn't seem to be inciting that same reaction, why not?
Like I said, for just one tournament this doesn't really mean that much, but if we're going to have anti-Korean regionlocking, for other tournaments then EU conquests of the other regions should be a focus as well.
these are the rules of 1 specific tournament, and its qualifiers arent gonna be the golden standard for future tournaments I should think.
And I say as much in my post, but I just want to make it known that I think the qualifiers for this tournament especially when you consider it STARTED with giving seemingly 4 random invites out
Inviting the top 2 from each the Korean EPL standings and the non-Korean standings is hardly random. Just a series of declined invites left the Korean side with Zest-Inno.
Neeb mmr seems to have significantly dropped on mmr eu server and I guess it shows in his results. Btw I hope TIME will go through the third kor qualifier, he should have opted for na despite the ping :/
On May 06 2020 05:44 Elentos wrote: Considering the amount of chances available, TSL without Neeb just sounds really strange. He's really not doing too well atm.
If there's a silver lining it's that he got his revenge against Rotterdam.
As a Neeb fan I am kinda sad in the fact that he couldn't qualify once after the likes of Reynor, Elazer and Showtime are already in the tourney. especially because he's losing to Rotterdam, Future and Vanya... 4 chances and he blows it all... Don't get me wrong, the guys i listed above are good players, but this is Neeb we're talking about.... he really shouldn't lose to those guys sad
This is like koreans taking spots on other servers, its just the europeans are doing it now. I love to watch the na qualifiers with their rising talents but if this is going to be the case then i'd watch or do something else.
On May 06 2020 07:35 ssg wrote: Denver GGs up over 30 supply lol? Did he not realize he killed 31 Scvs on that run by? That's not idra levels bad, but play that out...
Well, he had no fighting units. However, he could have held pretty easily with some drone pulls to help the mutas fight the cyclones. I suppose he thought Future was ahead so he didn't bother trying.
I feel like we don't get enough biased casts in English. It's so fun when the caster is explicitly rooting for one of the players; makes it way more emotional win or lose. Even if you're rooting for the other guy because then you're mad at the caster.
On May 06 2020 07:53 AzAlexZ wrote: if one Protoss and one Terran qualify through the KR qualifier then we will have 8 of each race, the pinnacle of racial balance
Then we can bring back HotS swarm hosts and the game will finally be perfect
On May 06 2020 07:53 AzAlexZ wrote: if one Protoss and one Terran qualify through the KR qualifier then we will have 8 of each race, the pinnacle of racial balance
Then we can bring back HotS swarm hosts and the game will finally be perfect
yes and bring back 1 supply roach please oh oh and permanently cloacked widow mines on second thought add 13 range tempests back too
On May 06 2020 07:53 AzAlexZ wrote: if one Protoss and one Terran qualify through the KR qualifier then we will have 8 of each race, the pinnacle of racial balance
Then we can bring back HotS swarm hosts and the game will finally be perfect
yes and bring back 1 supply roach please oh oh and permanently cloacked widow mines on second thought add 13 range tempests back too
Bring back the OG 22 range tempest.
The game really lacks a unit with the range of a Xel'Naga Tower.
On May 06 2020 07:53 AzAlexZ wrote: if one Protoss and one Terran qualify through the KR qualifier then we will have 8 of each race, the pinnacle of racial balance
Then we can bring back HotS swarm hosts and the game will finally be perfect
yes and bring back 1 supply roach please oh oh and permanently cloacked widow mines on second thought add 13 range tempests back too
Bring back the OG 22 range tempest.
The game really lacks a unit with the range of a Xel'Naga Tower.
22 range tempest which dealt cupcake damage against all units
I do have a lot of good memories about that period of SC2. Even with swarm hosts, it was such a liberating feeling after a year and a half of having to fight infestor broodlord every PvZ and getting 4 gated every PvP, having a unit introduced just to shoot broodlords (and colossi) and being able to turn my nexus into a giant photon cannon. Also proxy nex lmao
Akilon Wastes and Yeonsu were also beautiful maps so at least I'd have something nice to look at when I'd get hit with another round of swarm hosts/blink stalkers.
On May 06 2020 07:54 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I feel like we don't get enough biased casts in English. It's so fun when the caster is explicitly rooting for one of the players; makes it way more emotional win or lose. Even if you're rooting for the other guy because then you're mad at the caster.
I enjoyed special's cast because I think it's funny and I always root for the American guys first, and then NA players like Special and Scarlett so I'm usually gonna be rooting for Special and Future, but biased casting would be pretty bad if it were a regular thing lol, at least if it were the main cast and not a side cast like this was (wardi was main cast)
On May 06 2020 07:53 AzAlexZ wrote: if one Protoss and one Terran qualify through the KR qualifier then we will have 8 of each race, the pinnacle of racial balance
Gogogo Hurricane and Ty then :D
Edit: On the Neeb Topic, he played in 4 out of the 5 Qualifiers, skipping the 1st EU one. The only player he lost against, who didn t qualify himselve in the end was Denver. Let s hope he can recover from that. But the lack of points is realy starting to hurt him now allready, as he ll get a worse seeding, wich means harder opponents with every player overtaking him in the standing.
On May 06 2020 07:54 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I feel like we don't get enough biased casts in English. It's so fun when the caster is explicitly rooting for one of the players; makes it way more emotional win or lose. Even if you're rooting for the other guy because then you're mad at the caster.
I enjoyed special's cast because I think it's funny and I always root for the American guys first, and then NA players like Special and Scarlett so I'm usually gonna be rooting for Special and Future, but biased casting would be pretty bad if it were a regular thing lol, at least if it were the main cast and not a side cast like this was (wardi was main cast)
He was funnier here than he was yesterday with Catz, and I'd argue that has to do with how openly he wanted Future to win
On May 07 2020 16:07 TheOneAboveU wrote: Still so many cool names I'd like to see qualified... Scarlett, Dream, TIME, RagnaroK, TY.
Sure top 8 seeds are still extremly good and promise exciting games Just wondering why for example Teaja, who also doesn t need to hide anything for gsl anymore isn t playing, while he tried in an earlier round...
On May 07 2020 16:07 TheOneAboveU wrote: Still so many cool names I'd like to see qualified... Scarlett, Dream, TIME, RagnaroK, TY.
Sure top 8 seeds are still extremly good and promise exciting games Just wondering why for example Teaja, who also doesn t need to hide anything for gsl anymore isn t playing, while he tried in an earlier round...
Afaik he has a scheduled hospital visit for his wrists that he didn't want to miss
On May 07 2020 16:07 TheOneAboveU wrote: Still so many cool names I'd like to see qualified... Scarlett, Dream, TIME, RagnaroK, TY.
Sure top 8 seeds are still extremly good and promise exciting games Just wondering why for example Teaja, who also doesn t need to hide anything for gsl anymore isn t playing, while he tried in an earlier round...
Afaik he has a scheduled hospital visit for his wrists that he didn't want to miss
Damn, that s unfortunate.. But I gues this was a better date for him than potentially missing out GSL.. Even thoug I remember that someone (maybe Impact?) once requested to be not picked in a specific group during group nominations, as he wouldn t be able to attend that one and the other pros helped him work around that
On May 07 2020 17:47 iMrising wrote: can someone explain why koreans drop out of the lower bracket for the last few qualis? I've been out of the loop
No idear either it s been so many walkovers in all 3 KR Qualifiers allready. The 1st one was due to a scheduling conflict, wich got resolved for the 2nd and 3rd one, so no idear, why this is still happening
On May 07 2020 17:47 iMrising wrote: can someone explain why koreans drop out of the lower bracket for the last few qualis? I've been out of the loop
Many reasons, some just don't want to go through the lengthy bracket and some can't be helped (ex. zoun's keyboard broke, ragnarok is super sick)
That doesn t sound good He was looking good a couple of days ago at group nominations, I hope he gets better soon. Would be a shame if his GSL matches would be affected by that as well
On May 07 2020 19:07 TheOneAboveU wrote: I will never understand how Patience wins games. How does his 'do random shit and get a 3rd behind it' always end up with him being ahead?
Patience is like a Cowboy Protoss or something
He is skilled enough to get away with crazy things but is often times done in by making questionable decisions (in my humble opinion)
Like in G2 vs Time, personally, I don't know why he felt like he had to be so aggressive when he was so ahead instead of banking splash damage to defend against time's push.
Dude Patience is always so underrated. The fact he always is able to at the same time keep up with the absolute best while looking like a complete doofus while doing it, is pretty incredible.
On May 07 2020 17:47 iMrising wrote: can someone explain why koreans drop out of the lower bracket for the last few qualis? I've been out of the loop
Many reasons, some just don't want to go through the lengthy bracket and some can't be helped (ex. zoun's keyboard broke, ragnarok is super sick)
Holy shit, zoun's only got one keyboard?
Not wanting to go through a lengthy bracket seems like the worst excuse ever. lmao "Oh damn, I have to play games to qualify?? Nope, not gonna happen, I've got better things to do..."
Hope Ragnarok gets well soon. If he still feels bad, maybe he can lend zoun his keyboard, like over the weekend?
On May 07 2020 17:47 iMrising wrote: can someone explain why koreans drop out of the lower bracket for the last few qualis? I've been out of the loop
Many reasons, some just don't want to go through the lengthy bracket and some can't be helped (ex. zoun's keyboard broke, ragnarok is super sick)
Holy shit, zoun's only got one keyboard?
Not wanting to go through a lengthy bracket seems like the worst excuse ever. lmao "Oh damn, I have to play games to qualify?? Nope, not gonna happen, I've got better things to do..."
Hope Ragnarok gets well soon. If he still feels bad, maybe he can lend zoun his keyboard, like over the weekend?
Someone should Show them the Eu qualifiers for pretty much every tournament there is atm
EPT
