|
+ Show Spoiler +On March 17 2019 21:51 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:48 Alejandrisha wrote:On March 17 2019 21:47 pvsnp wrote:On March 17 2019 21:39 Fango wrote:On March 17 2019 21:32 ubikz wrote:
As the ultimate Maru fanboy, I have never enjoyed Innovation playstyle so much. But dude. He was already battling Soulkey in 2013, and has been consistent through all sc2 years, and thats a bunch of time. He was a champion during the young days of the game, and continues defeating wonderkids like Maru or Serral. The GOAT imho. Crazy how Maru is considered a wonder kid still when he won his first tournament something like a month after INno did, and his first starleague over a year before. He's super young and cute tho, whereas Inno was being called Robogus in 2013. yes. it's like comparing a puppy to an automaton designed to look like a puppy (even though he has clear skin now thanks to proactiv [3 easy steps]) ![[image loading]](https://i.redd.it/ngtjji9g7om21.jpg)
omg i'm dead
i love this picture so much hahahaha
|
On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him?
He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way
|
On March 17 2019 21:52 Alejandrisha wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 17 2019 21:51 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:48 Alejandrisha wrote:On March 17 2019 21:47 pvsnp wrote:On March 17 2019 21:39 Fango wrote:On March 17 2019 21:32 ubikz wrote:
As the ultimate Maru fanboy, I have never enjoyed Innovation playstyle so much. But dude. He was already battling Soulkey in 2013, and has been consistent through all sc2 years, and thats a bunch of time. He was a champion during the young days of the game, and continues defeating wonderkids like Maru or Serral. The GOAT imho. Crazy how Maru is considered a wonder kid still when he won his first tournament something like a month after INno did, and his first starleague over a year before. He's super young and cute tho, whereas Inno was being called Robogus in 2013. yes. it's like comparing a puppy to an automaton designed to look like a puppy (even though he has clear skin now thanks to proactiv [3 easy steps]) omg i'm dead i love this picture so much hahahaha
Yeah this is great lol
|
On March 17 2019 21:51 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:48 Alejandrisha wrote:On March 17 2019 21:47 pvsnp wrote:On March 17 2019 21:39 Fango wrote:On March 17 2019 21:32 ubikz wrote:
As the ultimate Maru fanboy, I have never enjoyed Innovation playstyle so much. But dude. He was already battling Soulkey in 2013, and has been consistent through all sc2 years, and thats a bunch of time. He was a champion during the young days of the game, and continues defeating wonderkids like Maru or Serral. The GOAT imho. Crazy how Maru is considered a wonder kid still when he won his first tournament something like a month after INno did, and his first starleague over a year before. He's super young and cute tho, whereas Inno was being called Robogus in 2013. yes. it's like comparing a puppy to an automaton designed to look like a puppy (even though he has clear skin now thanks to proactiv [3 easy steps])
This picture sums up Maru and Inno perfectly.
|
On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him?
Inno didn't have the god-level micro of 2017, but he was pretty consistently keeping his minerals below 100 even on 5 bases, never got supply-blocked, and every attack he made seemed to hit at the exact moment his upgrades were finishing. Supercomputer Innovation was in the building. For that matter, even with a few micro mistakes his positioning and spreads were pretty dang good.
|
On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way
Yeah I don't know where this mythical perfect Serral came from, he dropped maps in every single one of his finals last year, to opponents that were mostly weaker than Inno. He's never been flawless.
The big difference was that I've never seen Serral flustered, today he looked downright panicky at times (though he did pull himself together near the end).
|
On March 17 2019 22:03 ScrappyRabbit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? Inno didn't have the god-level micro of 2017, but he was pretty consistently keeping his minerals below 100 even on 5 bases, never got supply-blocked, and every attack he made seemed to hit at the exact moment his upgrades were finishing. Supercomputer Innovation was in the building. For that matter, even with a few micro mistakes his positioning and spreads were pretty dang good.
Yeah from what I saw his bio splits by and large were pretty on point
|
On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way
Well his 14-3 run at BlizzCon is the best ever and he was up 3-0 on Stats in the finals, that kind of qualifies for an almost flawless run.
I'm not speaking of dropping single maps in any of case, that can always happen in case of bo losses/unexpected strats; Serral was vulnerable between the first and second remax even at his top shape while looking unbeatable in both early and late game, he could lose games as he never really had the attitude of closing out series with a perfect scores dropping maps in every single one of his premier finals(even against Has or Mana).
What I am speaking of is the lack of gamebreaking errors and the incredibly solid decision making Serral had and seem to lacking as for now, he is sloppier with his mechanics too but those still shine in some games.
|
On March 17 2019 21:52 Alejandrisha wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 17 2019 21:51 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:48 Alejandrisha wrote:On March 17 2019 21:47 pvsnp wrote:On March 17 2019 21:39 Fango wrote:On March 17 2019 21:32 ubikz wrote:
As the ultimate Maru fanboy, I have never enjoyed Innovation playstyle so much. But dude. He was already battling Soulkey in 2013, and has been consistent through all sc2 years, and thats a bunch of time. He was a champion during the young days of the game, and continues defeating wonderkids like Maru or Serral. The GOAT imho. Crazy how Maru is considered a wonder kid still when he won his first tournament something like a month after INno did, and his first starleague over a year before. He's super young and cute tho, whereas Inno was being called Robogus in 2013. yes. it's like comparing a puppy to an automaton designed to look like a puppy (even though he has clear skin now thanks to proactiv [3 easy steps]) omg i'm dead i love this picture so much hahahaha
Ahahah this is amazing
|
his late game tvz was pretty trash in last 2 years i were so worry for him before playing vs good zerg players(dude even typing late game zerg OP alot despite his enormous 70% winnrate in online tournament) at that time.
glad to see the machine stepping up his weakness but i think he's getting used to mass ghosts strats tho
|
On March 17 2019 22:07 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way Well his 14-3 run at BlizzCon is the best ever and he was up 3-0 on Stats in the finals, that kind of qualifies for an almost flawless run. I'm not speaking of dropping single maps in any of case, that can always happen in case of bo losses/unexpected strats; Serral was vulnerable between the first and second remax even at his top shape while looking unbeatable in both early and late game, he could lose games as he never really had the attitude of closing out series with a perfect scores dropping maps in every single one of his premier finals(even against Has or Mana). What I am speaking of is the lack of gamebreaking errors and the incredibly solid decision making Serral had and seem to lacking as for now, he is sloppier with his mechanics too but those still shine in some games.
pretty sure I can point out similar mistakes in any of the maps he lost last year (throwing waves of low-tier Zerg armies into Stats' meatgrinder?). they just aren't as memorable because he still ended up winning the series
|
On March 17 2019 22:14 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 22:07 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way Well his 14-3 run at BlizzCon is the best ever and he was up 3-0 on Stats in the finals, that kind of qualifies for an almost flawless run. I'm not speaking of dropping single maps in any of case, that can always happen in case of bo losses/unexpected strats; Serral was vulnerable between the first and second remax even at his top shape while looking unbeatable in both early and late game, he could lose games as he never really had the attitude of closing out series with a perfect scores dropping maps in every single one of his premier finals(even against Has or Mana). What I am speaking of is the lack of gamebreaking errors and the incredibly solid decision making Serral had and seem to lacking as for now, he is sloppier with his mechanics too but those still shine in some games. pretty sure I can point out similar mistakes in any of the maps he lost last year (throwing waves of low-tier Zerg armies into Stats' meatgrinder?). they just aren't as memorable because he still ended up winning the series
So, you are convinced this version of Innovation was the strongest opponent Serral ever met and that's entirely why he lost? As were soO and Neeb? If you lose a game you commit errors, that's for sure; Serral used to make very few errors at his best and didn't gift his opponent games for free with gratuitous ones(or at least, those case were incredibly rare).
His decision making was surely more on point, as well.
On a side note, Liquipedia lists Inno as #2 and Serral as #3 top earners, while it's the opposite on Aligulac.
|
Happy Scarlett ended up losing - although overall I would say Im a fan of Scarlett but holy cow not accepting the draw in game one when Scarlett had no Corruptors is one of the most disgraceful moments of unsportmanship that comes to mind - very disappointing
|
On March 17 2019 22:21 Xain0n wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 22:14 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 22:07 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way Well his 14-3 run at BlizzCon is the best ever and he was up 3-0 on Stats in the finals, that kind of qualifies for an almost flawless run. I'm not speaking of dropping single maps in any of case, that can always happen in case of bo losses/unexpected strats; Serral was vulnerable between the first and second remax even at his top shape while looking unbeatable in both early and late game, he could lose games as he never really had the attitude of closing out series with a perfect scores dropping maps in every single one of his premier finals(even against Has or Mana). What I am speaking of is the lack of gamebreaking errors and the incredibly solid decision making Serral had and seem to lacking as for now, he is sloppier with his mechanics too but those still shine in some games. pretty sure I can point out similar mistakes in any of the maps he lost last year (throwing waves of low-tier Zerg armies into Stats' meatgrinder?). they just aren't as memorable because he still ended up winning the series So, you are convinced this version of Innovation was the strongest opponent Serral ever met and that's entirely why he lost? As were soO and Neeb?
No? as already said he wasn't totally invincible last year either and had multiple close series that could have gone either way (vs Scarlett, Reynor, Stats, TaeJa and Inno himself).
Now those games just happen to fall in favor of Serral's opponents.
|
On March 17 2019 21:51 seemsgood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 21:48 Alejandrisha wrote:On March 17 2019 21:47 pvsnp wrote:On March 17 2019 21:39 Fango wrote:On March 17 2019 21:32 ubikz wrote:
As the ultimate Maru fanboy, I have never enjoyed Innovation playstyle so much. But dude. He was already battling Soulkey in 2013, and has been consistent through all sc2 years, and thats a bunch of time. He was a champion during the young days of the game, and continues defeating wonderkids like Maru or Serral. The GOAT imho. Crazy how Maru is considered a wonder kid still when he won his first tournament something like a month after INno did, and his first starleague over a year before. He's super young and cute tho, whereas Inno was being called Robogus in 2013. yes. it's like comparing a puppy to an automaton designed to look like a puppy (even though he has clear skin now thanks to proactiv [3 easy steps])
that pic is pleasing
|
"A pretty even 4-3 final between 2 elite players"
"Time to shit on the loser and call them bad"
Some people's posts here are too much.
|
On March 17 2019 22:31 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2019 22:21 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 22:14 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 22:07 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 22:01 starkiller123 wrote:On March 17 2019 21:52 Xain0n wrote:On March 17 2019 21:43 Charoisaur wrote:On March 17 2019 21:38 Xain0n wrote:
Wp to Inno, he's looking more like the GOAT to me now that he won a Premier tournament in 2019; he should be #4 or #3 in the top earnings list, Serral is now #2 while Maru is still #1.
On the other hand, how can you guys be so corrosive and biased every time after every kind of result Serral has? He wins, salty; he loses, salty. Losing 3-4 in his worst matchup didn't really made him look especially weak, especially after he showed he CAN actually beat Terran in the lategame. He may have actually tricked himself today into trying to allin at least one game more than necessary after his losses at IEM; no sweep happened, nobody was destroyed, Inno and Serral played seven games out of seven and the one who was better today took the trophy, as simple as that.
Inno was not perfect yet he looked calm and convincing, he's not at his all time apex but he definitely looks like a top Terran again; on the other hand, did you actually look at Serral? Not even mentioning he looked sick(we knew that ten days ago already), have you seen that g6 broodlord engagement? Or another casual amove(after g2's vs soO) into losing roaches for free in g7? How sloppy he was at surrounding a tank with lings in a previous game? His overall indecisiveness?
Did you really see that player last year? I didn't, you delude yourself if you think Serral is nowhere close to his best shape.
TvZ isn't even the problem, here; it is Serral's worst matchup and there is a lack of serious opponents on EU, that's true. Recently, tho, Serral lost as well in ZvZ against soO(even if he still looks good in the matchup) and against Neeb in PvZ(he loooked even more mortal at that matchup judging by his not exciting series against MaNa).
It simply appears Serral in 2019 has regressed as a player, downscaling from nigh unbeatable godlike global dominator to "just" a top player in a stacked pack of high level koreans.
He still seems very consistent and strong enough to potentially win one international tournament(one game isn't that much, don't you agree?) but he's downright more mortal and beatable.
It would be very hard to pick a "best" player in the world right now: soO won IEM then went out of Code S, Inno did bad at IEM before winning WESG, Maru disappointed and it's not in contention for the title atm, Serral did not bad but failed to secure a top spot; sc2 in 2019 is looking fairly exciting and uncertain.
As a Serral fan, I'd like to nevertheless thank him and wish him to rest and prepare well; I'm still convinced he has the potential to absolutely crush the scene again were him to to get his best shape back. I'd love to see him dominate but defeats happen; what is effectively a slump for him still involves top placements in the hardest tournaments. or it's just that other players caught up/figured him out? If you play vs better opponents you look worse yourself. Are you convinced of that? He has been recently making errors even when he was not under critical pressure(amove into gg...) along with those forced by hard situations(Ragnarok's baneling), compare that to his flawless defenses or crisp decision making he had the last year. I'd have no problems to admit there is someone playing way better than Serral who makes him look not as good but that's not what I see in all honesty; coming to these last games, did it seem to you Inno had flawless mechanics and execution inducing Serral to play worse than we are used to see from him? He didn’t have perfect series last year either, he had a bunch of close series that really could have gone either way Well his 14-3 run at BlizzCon is the best ever and he was up 3-0 on Stats in the finals, that kind of qualifies for an almost flawless run. I'm not speaking of dropping single maps in any of case, that can always happen in case of bo losses/unexpected strats; Serral was vulnerable between the first and second remax even at his top shape while looking unbeatable in both early and late game, he could lose games as he never really had the attitude of closing out series with a perfect scores dropping maps in every single one of his premier finals(even against Has or Mana). What I am speaking of is the lack of gamebreaking errors and the incredibly solid decision making Serral had and seem to lacking as for now, he is sloppier with his mechanics too but those still shine in some games. pretty sure I can point out similar mistakes in any of the maps he lost last year (throwing waves of low-tier Zerg armies into Stats' meatgrinder?). they just aren't as memorable because he still ended up winning the series So, you are convinced this version of Innovation was the strongest opponent Serral ever met and that's entirely why he lost? As were soO and Neeb? No? as already said he wasn't totally invincible last year either and had multiple close series that could have gone either way (vs Scarlett, Reynor, Stats, TaeJa and Inno himself). Now those games just happen to fall in favor of Serral's opponents.
Yeah and I will admit that Serral probably showed his best form ever at Blizzcon, but he definitely came extremely close to losing vs both Reynor and Lambo earlier in the year and other players have had similar spells of extremely good form at weekenders like Blizzcon
|
Anyways congrats to INno for a great tournament, hope he has a good GSL run so he can rack up some points for Blizzcon
|
Great series. I think the Innovation-Serral rivalry will go on to be like Dark-Stats rivalry. They are so evenly matched.
Also, I think people underrate Serral's ZvT. I would say it's 3rd best in the world and sometimes 2nd best (occasionally Rogue's ZvT looks weak for some reason but usually he plays ZvT really well). I agree he doesn't look like 100% in form like late 2018 but he still looks like he's at least operating at 90% imo.
|
It was a good series. Gratz to Inno and gg to both players
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
