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Some people act like there were groups full of foreigners and that's why they reached top 8. They are blind to the fact that their precious Korean gods actually did lose matches against those scrub foreigners.
Showtime, Elazer and Neeblet had to beat top level Koreans in order to get here. There were even Korean champions among their victims. These three ambitious players fought their way to the top 8. The logical conclusion is that top foreigners represent skill level similar to the best Koreans and if any of them reaches finals, it would be fully deservedly.
I don't get the "foreigner in the final would be bad, lol" attitude. Yes, the drawing is a bit lucky for them, but if Koreans are really that much superior to them, then there should be no foreigner in RO8 at all.
We are going to have amazingly high level finals and I can't wait 
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On November 01 2016 18:28 YamiRi wrote:
I don't know why people didn't appreciate non-korean players' play..
I just followed sc2 scene since 2015.. and comparing of 2015 and 2016 plays, I think some non-korean actually produced great storyline, tactics, mindgames, and interesting styles
Koreans got similar playstyles so it is boring to see all korean vs korean in Blisscon
Adding foreigners' unique style actually make this blisscon more hyped than in 2015
Ehh, you has only been following since 2015, thats why you dont know that in fact foreigner were copying Korean's style all the time before 2016, there were hell a lot of Korean pros who play very creative like SOS,Rogue,Life,Gumiho,Dark... and of course before they slumped. Blizzcon 2015 was the best Blizzcon ever in terms of skill wise and strategy. Believe me or not, this 2016 Blizzcon is actually the worst Blizzcon regarding games' quality  . That's because the Koreans in this tournament are much worse than they were before (even though the foreigners have improved a lot). Koreans stopped creating and improving at the beginning of season 2 this year and this is the reason foreigners now can put up good fights against them. They has been dominating Starcraft for 18 years and it's true to say Korean = Starcraft, if you see Korean lose a lot, that means SC is declining.
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France12771 Posts
On November 01 2016 18:28 YamiRi wrote:
I don't know why people didn't appreciate non-korean players' play..
I just followed sc2 scene since 2015.. and comparing of 2015 and 2016 plays, I think some non-korean actually produced great storyline, tactics, mindgames, and interesting styles
Koreans got similar playstyles so it is boring to see all korean vs korean in Blisscon
Adding foreigners' unique style actually make this blisscon more hyped than in 2015
KR don't have similar playstyles at all.
Just for the terrans for example, ByuN got a "in your face" style with strong timing attacks that can often end the game / do game ending damage as we have seen against Dear. He goes for the kill fast.
On the other hand, TY is the type of player who'll never really commit. He'll take a lead and could finish the game but he'll go back and just go to the lategame with his lead, as shown in his series against Nerchio here or in the GSL finals against Zest, and probably in many other series as well.
But those on TL who didn't appreciate non-korean players' play are mostly just trolling / mad that the expected amount of foreigners qualified.
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On November 01 2016 18:28 YamiRi wrote:
I don't know why people didn't appreciate non-korean players' play..
I just followed sc2 scene since 2015.. and comparing of 2015 and 2016 plays, I think some non-korean actually produced great storyline, tactics, mindgames, and interesting styles
Koreans got similar playstyles so it is boring to see all korean vs korean in Blisscon
Adding foreigners' unique style actually make this blisscon more hyped than in 2015
Koreans have similar playstyles? Go on please explain.
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On November 01 2016 19:20 Cinek357 wrote:Some people act like there were groups full of foreigners and that's why they reached top 8. They are blind to the fact that their precious Korean gods actually did lose matches against those scrub foreigners. Showtime, Elazer and Neeblet had to beat top level Koreans in order to get here. There were even Korean champions among their victims. These three ambitious players fought their way to the top 8. The logical conclusion is that top foreigners represent skill level similar to the best Koreans and if any of them reaches finals, it would be fully deservedly. I don't get the "foreigner in the final would be bad, lol" attitude. Yes, the drawing is a bit lucky for them, but if Koreans are really that much superior to them, then there should be no foreigner in RO8 at all. We are going to have amazingly high level finals and I can't wait
Technically there would be most likely no foreigner in Blizzcon besides Showtime. What with region-lock being a thing and the 8 welfare spots, but that's discussion for a different thread.
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It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then.
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On November 01 2016 03:37 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2016 03:22 HugoBallzak wrote:On November 01 2016 02:47 Poopi wrote:On November 01 2016 01:40 HugoBallzak wrote:
How is this bracket decided upon? Two things that stand out to me. 3 foreigners packed into 1 side means 75% chance of foreigner in the final or something. Also, neeb somehow avoiding terran players completely until the final or possibly the entire event? Why would a foreigner in the finals a bad thing? I mean there has been not so deserving KR players in Blizzcon finals in the past as well iirc. Plus they would have to beat Dark or the man who beat Dark to get there so it's not free at all. However if Neeb beats Dark he has a free semi, except if ShoWTimE can beat him which is possible. It isn't a bad thing. I just wanna make sure that the bracket process was fair and decided upon before the players qualified. Seems to me like a system where each player who makes it out of the group knows exactly where they go in a bracket based on their group placing makes the most sense. 3 foreigners on a single side just APPEARS to be a little lucky IMO. A system like that encourages players to throw since being second is sometimes better than being first. Also people are awful at probability, and always think brackets are rigged. 3 foreigners on a single side had 2/9 chances of happening. What always surprises me is which brackets elicit community scrutiny. I've seen many more accusations of rigging against Dreamhack's brackets where fan favourite repeatedly eliminate each other in the early rounds (something undesirable to the organizers), than against the KeSPA cup brackets which have consistently had the minimal number of mirror match-up in the opening rounds, a much more unlikely event.
While your point is correct that if the bracket draw is already known, the players will most likely pick the games to win and lose to determine their Ro8 opponent. However, in this situation it looks like Blizzard have purposefully placed the majority of foreigners on one side of the bracket to have the greatest chance of a foreigner advancing deep. We all know ( well as far as I can discern from TL and reddit) that foreigners playing in the later rounds of a tournament = more viewers.
Given that the format this year was changed to a GSL style group stage Bo3, which coincidentally offers the greatest chance for upsets than a single Bo5 like the last 3 years, it looks like Blizz are doing all they can to ensure the success of foreigners at Blizzcon.
While it will be a tremendous achievement for a foreigner to finally get to a Blizzcon final or even possibly win it, let's not beat around the bush on the fact that Blizz have stacked the odds so heavily in foreigners hands this year. First the 8 welfare spots, then a more amiable Bo3 format and finally what looks like a foreigner-favoured playoff draw.
Wouldn't be surprised if Blizz ban Koreans from Blizzcon next year the way things are going.
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I'm usually not a fan of foreigners because of the irregularity of their games.
But they brought some damn good show this week end. So I just can't wait to see what everyone got for the next one.
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On November 01 2016 20:21 Elentos wrote:
It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then.
I don't think I'd want to see Elazer against TY, Byun or Zest. Against the two terrans he'd be destroyed IMO.
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On November 01 2016 20:28 Biscuittzz wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2016 20:21 Elentos wrote:
It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then. I don't think I'd want to see Elazer against TY, Byun or Zest. Against the two terrans he'd be destroyed IMO.
The way the bracket is made, he wouldn't be able to play against the Terrans anyway. TY was in his group and ByuN got second place just like Elazer
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On November 01 2016 20:28 Biscuittzz wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2016 20:21 Elentos wrote:
It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then. I don't think I'd want to see Elazer against TY, Byun or Zest. Against the two terrans he'd be destroyed IMO.
I want to see him try. I want him to show people why he thinks he's the best in Europe against TY's style. I want to see him go against top Koreans in non-mirrors to try and show people he's not just a 1-match-up wonder. And if he gets stomped, that's okay, too. I just feel like players like Elazer deserve a chance to prove themselves in a longer match against high-level players they don't compete with all year long and whose tendencies they know by heart just from ladder alone.
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On November 01 2016 20:39 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2016 20:28 Biscuittzz wrote:On November 01 2016 20:21 Elentos wrote:
It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then. I don't think I'd want to see Elazer against TY, Byun or Zest. Against the two terrans he'd be destroyed IMO. I want to see him try. I want him to show people why he thinks he's the best in Europe against TY's style. I want to see him go against top Koreans in non-mirrors to try and show people he's not just a 1-match-up wonder. And if he gets stomped, that's okay, too. I just feel like players like Elazer deserve a chance to prove themselves in a longer match against high-level players they don't compete with all year long and whose tendencies they know by heart just from ladder alone.
he just threw away his chance to play macro game vs TY, maybe because he thought he would have chance to win TY by cheese.
https://twitter.com/ElazerSC2/status/792451087349321728?lang=vi
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On November 01 2016 18:28 YamiRi wrote:
I don't know why people didn't appreciate non-korean players' play..
I just followed sc2 scene since 2015.. and comparing of 2015 and 2016 plays, I think some non-korean actually produced great storyline, tactics, mindgames, and interesting styles
Koreans got similar playstyles so it is boring to see all korean vs korean in Blisscon
Adding foreigners' unique style actually make this blisscon more hyped than in 2015
For me personally, SC2 has always been about playing at the highest level. It's meant to be a spectator sport. Koreans play the game better than anyone. Therefore you get the best games. It's also stranges you say koreans are similar/ boring. sOs, Parting, MC, Rain. The first is one of the most inventive players ever. The second is a seasoned micro god and terran slayer. The third has the ability to pull off kills with units in ways that seem unimaginable. The fourth was the epitome of Macro and defense. Just these four alone hold more diversity than 80% of foreigners
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Loving the games so far and that bracket is stacked with anticipation!
TY vs ByuN is too bad as I always root for the Terrans, but either way that should be an awesome series.
Looking forward to see Elazer play, as well as Showtime
Having the weekend off is just an added bonus <3
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On November 01 2016 00:15 Nakajin wrote: ShoWTimE 3-1  ElazerDark 3-0 NeebZest 3-2 StatsTY-3-1  ByuNI don't think Neeb stand a chance, on the biggest stage against the best ZvP player I think he will lose the first map in a close game and then crumble and get destroy in game 2 and 3. Showtime-Dark would be a lot more interesting in my oppinion.
Burn the Heretic! All aboard the Neeb[let] train! CHOO CHOO mother truckers!
I think he has more chance than you are giving him credit. What sucks is that all 3 foreigners are on the same side of the bracket. A bit sad that Elazer got through, sine he's already shown his intent to throw ZvTs.
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Canada8157 Posts
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Can't wait!
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On November 01 2016 20:39 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2016 20:28 Biscuittzz wrote:On November 01 2016 20:21 Elentos wrote:
It's still kinda sad there's a foreigner vs foreigner Ro8 match. Spend all year waiting for BO5+ matches between foreigners and Koreans and then at Blizzcon all 3 foreigners are in the same half of the bracket. I wanted to see Elazer play a legit series against a Korean in a non-mirror but it doesn't seem likely I'll get the chance now with this bracket.
Well, maybe at Homestory Cup then. I don't think I'd want to see Elazer against TY, Byun or Zest. Against the two terrans he'd be destroyed IMO. I want to see him try. I want him to show people why he thinks he's the best in Europe against TY's style. I want to see him go against top Koreans in non-mirrors to try and show people he's not just a 1-match-up wonder. And if he gets stomped, that's okay, too. I just feel like players like Elazer deserve a chance to prove themselves in a longer match against high-level players they don't compete with all year long and whose tendencies they know by heart just from ladder alone.
I'm curious as to why he said that (I know nothing about him before Blizzcon). Although if he himself had such little faith in his macro game that he risked it all with proxy hatches and such, I can't really believe it's something amazing.
For results:
I feel like Neeb's PvZ is simply not on point, or hasn't been for a while now with so many losses. And I'd be suprised if Dark hasn't learnt to hold of Adepts by now. It will most likely be a 3-0
ShoWtimE might be the best EU player (emphasis on "might") and if anyone has a shot at beating Dark it's him, although I do think a 3-0/3-1 will be the outcome.
I sound pretty anti-foriegner (as apprently I do 90% of the time haha) but I think only TY or maybe Zest has a shot of beating Dark. And I only say Zest because he looks on fire so far and we haven't really seen him PvZ much this year (he's only played bo1 or bo3s). Maybe if he goes godmode like he has in PvT.
TY will destroy ByuN I have no doubt, people forget he's undefeated in TvT series in LoTV. Zest/Stats is a toss up
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Well, I don't think Neeblet beats Dark... Quite frankly Dark is guaranteed a spot in the Finals I think...
The lower half...
Stats probably beats Zest just because it's a teamkill, and TY could beat Byun, but I think that the winner of that series goes to the finals and looses to Dark 4-2.
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On November 02 2016 00:57 Fango wrote:
TY will destroy ByuN I have no doubt
I think it's gonna be closer than most of TY's TvT series, ByuN is one of the only Koreans who I see on a similar TvT level to TY.
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EPT
