EPT
[WCS KR] Ro16 Group B Season 3 2013 - Page 30
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XtreMe_au
Australia412 Posts
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gobbledydook
Australia2593 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:38 DarkLordOlli wrote: PvP probably has the widest range of viable builds, strategies and tech routes out of any matchup. Every unit has a role in PvP. It's pretty cool. sad carrier is sad | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40186 Posts
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Dark.Carnival
United States5095 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:38 XtreMe_au wrote: Soul teamkill at least that means someone from Soul will be in the ro4, that's good for them as a team~ Unfortunately it is a team kill... and pvp... so those are going to be some interesting games | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40186 Posts
Grubby vs HasuObs. Grubby even managed to win that game. | ||
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vthree
Hong Kong8039 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:36 Dark.Carnival wrote: once again sOs and his shitty pvp control nets him another loss to Trap  it wasn't just the control. sOs forced Trap to go for a final engagement by killing his third but then forgets the make zealots/archons to tank. 6-8 zealot and an archon wins him that fight. | ||
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Huragius
Lithuania1506 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:38 DarkLordOlli wrote: PvP probably has the widest range of viable builds, strategies and tech routes out of any matchup. Every unit has a role in PvP. It's pretty cool. Mhm, TvT ? | ||
Olli
Austria24417 Posts
Hey even those are useful sometimes. Like in Grubby vs HasuObs :D | ||
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Nauseam
Sweden191 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:35 pookums wrote: Being controlled with the micro of a protoss player. Pretty obvious that he tried to right click a colossus and missed it and issued a move command instead. It can happen to anyone. However, it was pretty bad unit control all through the series. But I guess everything that isn't stutterstepping or splitting isn't micro in the eyes of Terrans like you. | ||
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Olli
Austria24417 Posts
Not really. In PvP you can open with every tech route, you can fast expand, you can do crazy cheese like cannon rushes, proxy gates, you can proxy pretty much everything, you can go every tech route and cheese with it, you can go every tech route and macro with it. TvT is either bio/tank or mech. PvP can be pretty much everything. Void ray compositions, mass phoenix, chargelot/archon/immortal, colossus compositions are all viable albeit not equally effective at every stage of the game and against everything. And those are just general unit compositions, there's about a million ways to play around with them and to get there. | ||
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mikedebo
Canada4341 Posts
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Huragius
Lithuania1506 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:42 DarkLordOlli wrote: Not really. In PvP you can open with every tech route, you can fast expand, you can do crazy cheese like cannon rushes, proxy gates, you can proxy pretty much everything, you can go every tech route and cheese with it, you can go every tech route and macro with it. TvT is either bio/tank or mech. You can not only open with all routes of tech in TvT, but you can do a lot of their variations as well, from gas first into fast starport, reactor hellion expand, reaper expand, 14 CC and etc. As well in TvT you can have have most interesting mid game compositions (Marine/Tank, Mass Hellion/Viking/Banshee, Pure Bio, Pure mech). Also, you can go either bio, mech or sky terran at later stages at the game. While compositions in PvP gets pretty stale and similar. And with that last sentence, you just sound like a blind protoss fan with not much of TvT knowledge. | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:42 DarkLordOlli wrote: Not really. In PvP you can open with every tech route, you can fast expand, you can do crazy cheese like cannon rushes, proxy gates, you can proxy pretty much everything, you can go every tech route and cheese with it, you can go every tech route and macro with it. TvT is either bio/tank or mech. PvP can be pretty much everything. Void ray compositions, mass phoenix, chargelot/archon/immortal, colossus compositions are all viable albeit not equally effective at every stage of the game and against everything. And those are just general unit compositions, there's about a million ways to play around with them and to get there. First, why are you arguing this here? I put the blame on you DLO for making an outlandish claim that works as trollbait. Second, bio/tank and mech cannot be compared to stargate or robo or twilight tech. When did you last see a protoss lategame army that does not consist of all of those? There might be a question whether to add stargate at all, but generally the idea is to try to get away for more teching without dying. This seems to be very different from the fundamental difference in style between bio, bio/tank and mech as those exclude each other. It does not make sense to say that the bio player teched up to mech. Or that the bio/tank player teched up to mech. That just does not happen. | ||
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lolfail9001
Russian Federation40186 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:50 Huragius wrote: You can not only open with all routes of tech in TvT, but you can do a lot of their variations as well, from gas first into fast starport, reactor hellion expand, reaper expand, 14 CC and etc. As well in TvT you can have have most interesting mid game compositions (Marine/Tank, Mass Hellion/Viking/Banshee, Pure Bio, Pure mech). Also, you can go either bio, mech or sky terran at later stages at the game. While compositions in PvP gets pretty stale and similar. And with that last sentence, you just sound like a blind protoss fan with not much of TvT knowledge. Tbh TvT only has 1 tech route so comparing it to PvP is incorrect. Granted both of those match-ups are pretty good to watch. | ||
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Papples
United States117 Posts
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Olli
Austria24417 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:50 Huragius wrote: You can not only open with all routes of tech in TvT, but you can do a lot of their variations as well, from gas first into fast starport, reactor hellion expand, reaper expand, 14 CC and etc. As well in TvT you can have have most interesting mid game compositions (Marine/Tank, Mass Hellion/Viking/Banshee, Pure Bio, Pure mech). Also, you can go either bio, mech or sky terran at later stages at the game. While compositions in PvP gets pretty stale and similar. And with that last sentence, you just sound like a blind protoss fan with not much of TvT knowledge. This has nothing to do with anything and is your opinion only. There are only two general tech routes though, mech and bio. You can open starport but you'll have to transition into either one of them immediately after or you lose. You can open hellion drop or proxy something, same story. In PvP you can either transition out or stay on that tech. You can switch anytime you see an opportunity whereas going from one to the other in TvT is impossible. PvP feels a lot more flexible than TvT. | ||
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mikedebo
Canada4341 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:54 Papples wrote: These soul players ruining my liquibets... Maybe you need to get on the SOUL TRAIN | ||
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-Celestial-
United Kingdom3867 Posts
On September 25 2013 21:36 Undead1993 wrote: oh come on artosis you got to be kidding me ._. "Immortals are good against zealots, believe it or not tasteless" 30 secs later 8 immortals die to zealots poor sosThe Artosis curse carrying over to units now?  | ||
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samurai80
Japan4225 Posts
On September 25 2013 22:04 -Celestial- wrote: The Artosis curse carrying over to units now? Yeah, I guess it is that strong :D And even when being ironic the Artosis curse works. | ||
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Huragius
Lithuania1506 Posts
On September 25 2013 22:02 DarkLordOlli wrote: This has nothing to do with anything and is your opinion only. There are only two general tech routes though, mech and bio. You can open starport but you'll have to transition into either or you lose. You can open hellion drop or proxy something, same story. In PvP you can either transition out or stay on that tech. You can switch anytime you see an opportunity whereas going from one to the other in TvT is impossible. PvP feels a lot more flexible than TvT. So my opinion is only my opinion, but yours' is an argument ?(Despite me pointing out reasons why I think so) Also, then what is a tech route ? You compare two fundamentally different races, but pick only those 'arguments' about tech choices that supports your opinion and dismiss others ? I can oversimplify protoss play style the same as you did with terrans: you either go gateway tech focused or robo focused. You can open with stargate to harass but transitioning to it during early game is impossible because you will die. Isn't the same with TvT? Having a raven, few banshees or some vikings is considered as a transitioning out of starport opening, but mixing in few voidrays or some phenixes is 'another available tech route in PvP'. And no, you can transition in TvT, and if you payed at least any attention to high level past-mid game TvTs you would have noticed smooth transitions to skyterran (from both meching player and bio player), bio with tank support (form bio player against meching player) and even raven viking (from bio player with a lot of spare gas). At later stages of the game, you will even see ghosts to EMP ravens and BC. Also- nukes. Your discussion skills and cherry picking is just silly. So what you feel doesn't mean a lot, and majority of people do agree that TvT still holds the title as most flexible and interesting match-up of all (however it must be played at korean level to be so). And you can notice that by reactions of viewers after every good TvT in any major tournament. Same can't be said about PvP. | ||
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