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[IEM] World Championship Day 3 - Page 142

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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Poopi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
France12904 Posts
March 07 2013 16:22 GMT
#2821
On March 08 2013 01:18 Lysanias wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:16 jj33 wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:11 vthree wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:07 Lysanias wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:04 Poopi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:02 Redox wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:00 Weavel wrote:
On March 08 2013 00:59 sparklyresidue wrote:
Zerg winning = zerg hate, zerg losing = zerg hate. Seems like these threads have just become zerg bashing sprees over the last 6 mos.
Might have something to do with swarm of zergs balance whining. Reminds me of 2010 and early 2011 LR threads...

Terran hate back then has never been on the same level as zerg hate now. Although the Terran domination back then was way bigger then the Zerg one ever was.

How was zerg domination lower than terran's one?
Did you see foreign terrans beating top koreans zergs repeateadly?
Zerg got the most GSL wins and some absurd cash winning in 2012, it's not even funny.


To be honest though we don't have many "good" foreign terrans at the top level of play :p


And why is that? Are terrans inherently harder for foreigners to play?



Terran is harder to play at a pro level period. was the same in bw, same in sc2


Why do people still play terran then i wonder ? More easy to play other races after all in both games.

Because of Flash, MKP, Mvp, Fantasy, etc, etc?
WriterMaru
Necro)Phagist(
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada6660 Posts
March 07 2013 16:22 GMT
#2822
On March 08 2013 01:21 Boucot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:15 kyllinghest wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:14 StarVe wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:13 Boucot wrote:
What's the tech building required for Vipers ? Spire ?

Spire and hive, I think.

No spire, just hive required

But... normally each zerg unit needs a building tech to be produced, right ?

Hive is apparently the building tech for Vipers. No spire needed...
"Are you talking to me? Because your authority is not recognized in fort kick ass!"" ||Park Jung Suk|| |MC|HerO|HyuN|
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45051 Posts
March 07 2013 16:22 GMT
#2823
On March 08 2013 01:21 Mambo wrote:
MVP like a baws. Hope he takes the entire thing.


Why can't people just spell it correctly? It's not baws, it's not bouse, it's boss.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
paradoxOO9
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom1123 Posts
March 07 2013 16:22 GMT
#2824
What are Mutas like in TvZ? They would work with stopping the relentless drops
Gowerly
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United Kingdom916 Posts
March 07 2013 16:22 GMT
#2825
On March 08 2013 01:21 Boucot wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:15 kyllinghest wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:14 StarVe wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:13 Boucot wrote:
What's the tech building required for Vipers ? Spire ?

Spire and hive, I think.

No spire, just hive required

But... normally each zerg unit needs a building tech to be produced, right ?

Drones don't require a building.
I will reduce you to a series of numbers.
Azurues
Profile Joined March 2011
Malaysia5612 Posts
March 07 2013 16:23 GMT
#2826
apollo taking a jibe at the analyst :D
Necro)Phagist(
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada6660 Posts
March 07 2013 16:23 GMT
#2827
On March 08 2013 01:22 paradoxOO9 wrote:
What are Mutas like in TvZ? They would work with stopping the relentless drops

Depends... if the terran is prepared and has a few mines and a turret in mineral lines Mutas get shut down hard.
"Are you talking to me? Because your authority is not recognized in fort kick ass!"" ||Park Jung Suk|| |MC|HerO|HyuN|
Ketch
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands7285 Posts
March 07 2013 16:23 GMT
#2828
On March 08 2013 01:22 paradoxOO9 wrote:
What are Mutas like in TvZ? They would work with stopping the relentless drops


Sigh... widow mines
ramask2
Profile Joined June 2011
Thailand1024 Posts
March 07 2013 16:23 GMT
#2829
Oh Apollo, you know the analysts are going to get back at you for this...
sparklyresidue
Profile Joined August 2011
United States5523 Posts
March 07 2013 16:23 GMT
#2830
On March 08 2013 01:22 Hylirion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:18 Insoleet wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:17 vojnik wrote:
i feel that widow mines really shut down variety for zerg, at least attack vs air should be removed so that terran can not safely go 3 CC with minimal defenses


Reapers, hellions, mines harass would be strong, but no anti air. So, zerg could answer by going mutalisks and harass the hell out of the greedy terran.


Yeah because harrassing is cleary a greedy play...

If your harassing army is your entire army and you've got 3 CCs at 7:00, it's greedy.
Like Tinkerbelle, I leave behind a sparkly residue.
The_Darkness
Profile Joined December 2011
United States910 Posts
March 07 2013 16:24 GMT
#2831
On March 08 2013 01:04 Poopi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:02 Redox wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:00 Weavel wrote:
On March 08 2013 00:59 sparklyresidue wrote:
Zerg winning = zerg hate, zerg losing = zerg hate. Seems like these threads have just become zerg bashing sprees over the last 6 mos.
Might have something to do with swarm of zergs balance whining. Reminds me of 2010 and early 2011 LR threads...

Terran hate back then has never been on the same level as zerg hate now. Although the Terran domination back then was way bigger then the Zerg one ever was.

How was zerg domination lower than terran's one?
Did you see foreign terrans beating top koreans zergs repeateadly?
Zerg got the most GSL wins and some absurd cash winning in 2012, it's not even funny.


I followed the period of Terran domination pretty closely. At one point on the KR GM ladder, 19 of the top 20 players were Terran based on win %. I don't have the GSL stats handy but at the height of Terran dominance 6 of 8 quarterfinal spots were Terran and Terran players were so dominant that, even in this period of Zerg domination, Terran players still manage to be well represented in Code S (said another way, there were so many previously that it has taken quite a while to thin their numbers). Based on Elo almost all of the top players were Terran, even after the nerf to ghosts. What obviously changed this was the queen and to a much lesser extent overlord buffs. By, I'm guessing and I would bet, most statistical measures, Terran domination at the highest levels of play was more thorough than the current Zerg domination in WOL.
To be is to be the value of a bound variable.
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23576 Posts
March 07 2013 16:24 GMT
#2832
On March 08 2013 01:22 Gowerly wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:21 Boucot wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:15 kyllinghest wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:14 StarVe wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:13 Boucot wrote:
What's the tech building required for Vipers ? Spire ?

Spire and hive, I think.

No spire, just hive required

But... normally each zerg unit needs a building tech to be produced, right ?

Drones don't require a building.


Yep, but don't worry I played zerg 3 months in the beta, till I figured out that I don't need a spire for Vipers :D.
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
Lukeeze[zR]
Profile Joined February 2006
Switzerland6838 Posts
March 07 2013 16:24 GMT
#2833
Damn these old maps need to disappear
Terran & Potato Salad.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
March 07 2013 16:24 GMT
#2834
On March 08 2013 01:22 TimENT wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:21 DarkLordOlli wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:19 Bagi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:15 DarkLordOlli wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:14 Bagi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:11 DarkLordOlli wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:09 Bagi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:07 DarkLordOlli wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:05 Fragile51 wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:04 DarkLordOlli wrote:
[quote]

You could maybe. Not saying that skytoss is balanced. What's your point?


His point is that you shouldn't make claims without evidence that contribute literally nothing to anything aside from pissing people off.


Take Yoda's opening vs Ret as evidence. Maybe stop arguing with me just because you feel like it.

As evidence of what? That certain strategies can win games?

Once again, thanks for that nugget of wisdom. Terran has ways to beat zerg. Amazing.


As evidence that some openings and overall playstyles are extremely strong vs current standard zerg? Which was my point in the first place. It will win in the hands of good players. Whether or not that's a balance issue or zerg just has to play differently remains to be explored.

You're really not reading this too well.

If you wanna call it overpowered, just say its overpowered. No need for this circling around the issue, "oh I could beat zerg by doing this and that with terran".

I'm reading it all too well, Its just that thinly veiled balance whining annoys me.


Lol. I'm protoss, I don't really care about TvZ balance. It's too strong vs current standard zerg. That's what I'm saying. That and nothing else. You're a terrible reader.

If you don't care about the balance, why are you here commenting? You're saying its too strong, you're saying its overpowered, you are balance whining. Stop with this bullshit about "terrible readers", there is nothing subtle about your posts.


Rofl. Go back and read what I said. It's too strong vs current standard zerg for that current standard to be viable. There might be other standard-capable openings for zerg.

Putting it into the most simple words for you so you don't have to think:
Current terran openings > current standard opening.
Current zerg opening might have to be changed by zerg.

How the flying f- is that balance whine.


You are the sole reason people hate LR threads. Always arguing about pointless bullshit and starting more bullshit arguments.


Don't read my posts if you feel that way. I don't care about your opinion on whether or not I'm "contributing correctly" at all.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
March 07 2013 16:24 GMT
#2835
Need more Queens. Immortal against Bio and perfect at keeping their health care low. With enough health care Marauders don't care if the look like a hedgehog.

On the other hand Terrans shouldn't use Siege Tanks past Hive.

I don't mind Zergs trying to force Hydras to work though. I really miss TvTs and the last year of WoL didn't allowed for many.
paradoxOO9
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom1123 Posts
March 07 2013 16:25 GMT
#2836
On March 08 2013 01:23 Ketch wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:22 paradoxOO9 wrote:
What are Mutas like in TvZ? They would work with stopping the relentless drops


Sigh... widow mines

Forgot about Widow Mines. Poor Zerg :/
Lysanias
Profile Joined March 2011
Netherlands8351 Posts
March 07 2013 16:25 GMT
#2837
On March 08 2013 01:22 Poopi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:18 Lysanias wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:16 jj33 wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:11 vthree wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:07 Lysanias wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:04 Poopi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:02 Redox wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:00 Weavel wrote:
On March 08 2013 00:59 sparklyresidue wrote:
Zerg winning = zerg hate, zerg losing = zerg hate. Seems like these threads have just become zerg bashing sprees over the last 6 mos.
Might have something to do with swarm of zergs balance whining. Reminds me of 2010 and early 2011 LR threads...

Terran hate back then has never been on the same level as zerg hate now. Although the Terran domination back then was way bigger then the Zerg one ever was.

How was zerg domination lower than terran's one?
Did you see foreign terrans beating top koreans zergs repeateadly?
Zerg got the most GSL wins and some absurd cash winning in 2012, it's not even funny.


To be honest though we don't have many "good" foreign terrans at the top level of play :p


And why is that? Are terrans inherently harder for foreigners to play?



Terran is harder to play at a pro level period. was the same in bw, same in sc2


Why do people still play terran then i wonder ? More easy to play other races after all in both games.

Because of Flash, MKP, Mvp, Fantasy, etc, etc?


that is perhaps how you would start yeah by trying to play like your hero's but if other races are clearly more easy people who wanted to make money should all change races rather then keeping a silly dream up.
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12023 Posts
March 07 2013 16:25 GMT
#2838
On March 08 2013 01:22 Poopi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:18 Lysanias wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:16 jj33 wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:11 vthree wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:07 Lysanias wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:04 Poopi wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:02 Redox wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:00 Weavel wrote:
On March 08 2013 00:59 sparklyresidue wrote:
Zerg winning = zerg hate, zerg losing = zerg hate. Seems like these threads have just become zerg bashing sprees over the last 6 mos.
Might have something to do with swarm of zergs balance whining. Reminds me of 2010 and early 2011 LR threads...

Terran hate back then has never been on the same level as zerg hate now. Although the Terran domination back then was way bigger then the Zerg one ever was.

How was zerg domination lower than terran's one?
Did you see foreign terrans beating top koreans zergs repeateadly?
Zerg got the most GSL wins and some absurd cash winning in 2012, it's not even funny.


To be honest though we don't have many "good" foreign terrans at the top level of play :p


And why is that? Are terrans inherently harder for foreigners to play?



Terran is harder to play at a pro level period. was the same in bw, same in sc2


Why do people still play terran then i wonder ? More easy to play other races after all in both games.

Because of Flash, MKP, Mvp, Fantasy, etc, etc?


I only started playing Terran in BW (I started watching before I played) because of Flash :D
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
m0ck
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
4194 Posts
March 07 2013 16:25 GMT
#2839
Dream with the completely wrong reaction
Skron
Profile Joined March 2012
Canada19 Posts
March 07 2013 16:25 GMT
#2840
On March 08 2013 01:22 BronzeKnee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:21 furo wrote:
stephano should try ling bane into ultra, macro games with roach infesters are pretty meh vs 3+ base terran...


I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure Lings and Banes are dead in ZvT because of Widow Mines... Mines are too good versus Lings and Banes for those units to be viable.



I think it just makes ling bane muta a lot more micro intensive, you always have to be scouting with a few lings ahead of the main army, as well as having a few overseers with the mutas. With 10 mutas you can snipe a mine before it goes off
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