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Wow!!! Gratz Liquid and gratz Taeja for the allkill!!!!!!!!!!
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opterown
Australia54784 Posts
On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team.
It's difficult to really consider either a foreign team now though when most of their notable wins are from their korean players haha
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On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team.
Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team.
Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down.
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On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down.
Taeja missed the first set in the GSTL, but in the second set, Hero/Taeja/Zenio were complete. :-)
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well done Taeja, those were some impressive games.
Liquid top 8 at least now.
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On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down.
Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined.
Then again, how do we define what is a foreign team anymore? Is a team like Complexity, led by a Korean lineup of Killer, Ganzi, and Heart, still considered foreign? How about Fnatic? Nowadays, there just isn't a definitive way to define a foreign team anymore.
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Really nicely done by TaeJa.
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On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined.
I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide.
On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight.
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On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight.
I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world.
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On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. Then again, how do we define what is a foreign team anymore? Is a team like Complexity, led by a Korean lineup of Killer, Ganzi, and Heart, still considered foreign? How about Fnatic? Nowadays, there just isn't a definitive way to define a foreign team anymore.
Well for starter. Liquid is not a full foreign team but they used to be.
All foreign team are not " foreign " anymore with the exception of a few team(mousports,etc).
I find it funny some people in this thread claimed that Liquid is the best foreign team when all the notable wins come from their Korean counterpart.
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On June 27 2012 23:21 Bagration wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight. I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world.
LG-IM, TSL, NSH, MVP, Fnatic, Mouz, ZeNEX, FXO, Empire, EG, Prime, Startale, Quantic, SlayerS
I don't know mate, cutting it close. HerO and Taeja are top notch players, but beyond that...
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wow taeja really brought it. wish i didnt stop watching
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On June 27 2012 23:31 polyphonyEX wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 23:21 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight. I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world. LG-IM, TSL, NSH, MVP, Fnatic, Mouz, ZeNEX, FXO, Empire, EG, Prime, Startale, Quantic, SlayerS I don't know mate, cutting it close. HerO and Taeja are top notch players, but beyond that...
Take away Zenex, Empire, Quantic and Fnatic that have no business being on any list of that sort and it's much less close.
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korean vs korean is boring,
does not matter if he plays for mouz, EG, TL, whoever
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On June 27 2012 23:37 furo wrote:
korean vs korean is boring,
does not matter if he plays for mouz, EG, TL, whoever
you are boring
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On June 27 2012 23:31 polyphonyEX wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 23:21 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight. I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world. LG-IM, TSL, NSH, MVP, Fnatic, Mouz, ZeNEX, FXO, Empire, EG, Prime, Startale, Quantic, SlayerS I don't know mate, cutting it close. HerO and Taeja are top notch players, but beyond that...
Ret's not bad, pretty solid player by foreigner standards. Liquid has done pretty well in some of the foreign online teamleagues, and sometimes when it comes to individual tournaments you only need 1 or 2 really solid players (IM with MVP and Nestea).
On June 27 2012 23:36 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 23:31 polyphonyEX wrote:On June 27 2012 23:21 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight. I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world. LG-IM, TSL, NSH, MVP, Fnatic, Mouz, ZeNEX, FXO, Empire, EG, Prime, Startale, Quantic, SlayerS I don't know mate, cutting it close. HerO and Taeja are top notch players, but beyond that... Take away Zenex, Empire, Quantic and Fnatic that have no business being on any list of that sort and it's much less close.
If those teams have no business being on a list of top teams, it would be hard to make a similar case for Liquid :p
Zenex did beat Liquid 5-1 convincingly, and they are a solid, if underrepresented and a bit inconsistent of a team.
Empire is a very solid team, especially after they got Violet and Vines.
Quantic is another strong team with Naniwa, Sase, Illusion, TheSTC.
Fnatic is doing very well in the GSTL, and their roster is pretty solid.
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On June 27 2012 23:30 FakeDeath wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. Then again, how do we define what is a foreign team anymore? Is a team like Complexity, led by a Korean lineup of Killer, Ganzi, and Heart, still considered foreign? How about Fnatic? Nowadays, there just isn't a definitive way to define a foreign team anymore. Well for starter. Liquid is not a full foreign team but they used to be. All foreign team are not " foreign " anymore with the exception of a few team(mousports,etc). I find it funny some people in this thread claimed that Liquid is the best foreign team when all the notable wins come from their Korean counterpart.
So, if we follow your logic, Real Madrid is not a spanish team, because the most important players in the team are not spanish...
The team is foreign cuz its management is foreign.
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Really surprised that Taeja beat out MKP, but congrats to him 
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On June 27 2012 23:51 Bagration wrote:
If those teams have no business being on a list of top teams, it would be hard to make a similar case for Liquid :p
Not so hard if one can actually count.
Zenex might have beaten TL half of TL once, but TL is outperforming them in GSL in the last few seasons, which I would say is quite impressive given that Zenex is fully based in Korea and all their players have constant access to KR ladder, qualifiers, and all that stuff.
The other 3 teams are quite solid, but their collective results are merely a dip in the ocean (notable results in one, maybe two events during their entire SC2 history). Liquid has 2+ years of consistent top placements and GSL results. Liquid could disband today and it would take like a year for some of these teams to catch up.
If you're predicting the future team performances based on perceived strength of the team, that's an entirely different discussion.
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On June 27 2012 23:31 polyphonyEX wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2012 23:21 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 23:11 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 21:27 Bagration wrote:On June 27 2012 20:26 Talin wrote:On June 27 2012 20:01 Megiddosc wrote:On June 27 2012 15:02 USvBleakill wrote:
Awesome to see that Liquid is clearly the best foreign team. With a little luck, which is always a factor (look at GSTL Finals with the MKP thing) they can beat every team. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you don't watch/follow GSTL? Because Liquid got embarrassed this season. They were horrible. Fnatic looks like a much a stronger team. Don't be silly. Playing with only half a team, without 2 or 3 of your top players, in the biggest team league in the world basically means you're going to lose terribly, whoever you are (even more so if you're a tiny team to begin with). You can blame the management for that fiasco (I do), but GSTL definitely didn't reflect the quality of the whole team. Also, GSTL isn't the only event in the world (or in Korea). Liquid has the best overall performance and results in Korea out of all foreign teams combined. Unless you want to count FXO, in which case yeah, they top this category hands down. Definitely don't think Liquid is doing that well among the foreign teams. They may be the best, but they aren't doing better than all the other foreign teams combined. I said in Korea specifically Liquid's better than all the other foreign teams combined (including Fnatic and coL). That's obviously no longer the case when you add in results in tournaments worldwide. On the other hand, Korean leagues are still the premier proving grounds in Starcraft, so that little bit of data still carries some weight. I will say this: Liquid has gone a long way over the past few months, and they are looking good. I still think that they lack depth still, but they are a very strong team now, I'd say top 10 in the world. LG-IM, TSL, NSH, MVP, Fnatic, Mouz, ZeNEX, FXO, Empire, EG, Prime, Startale, Quantic, SlayerS I don't know mate, cutting it close. HerO and Taeja are top notch players, but beyond that...
I would say Liquid tops Zenex, Mouz, and maaaaaaaybe Fnatic
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EPT
