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On September 21 2011 21:43 Demonace34 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 21:41 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:40 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:39 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:38 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:37 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:35 Demonace34 wrote:2:10 Pool first from Zenio, Huk goes for nexus first. No gas from Zenio. 3:30 Forge and cannon come down for Huk. Zenio expansion finishes up. Huk adds on 2 gas and a gate. 5:00 Zenio takes quick 3rd base and droning hard. Huk chronoing wg research, not taking his expansion gases. 7:00 Huk throws down 5 more gates and a twilight council and two more gasses. Roach warren and +1 carapace coming up for Zenio. 9:00 Huk getting dark shrine +1 weapons and blink while getting up his 3rd base. Lair and ling speed coming up from Zenio. 10:45 Huk getting cannons at his 3rd, sending out a dt to deny the 4th of Zenio. Zenio getting spire, drops and overlord speed. 12:00 Roach speed and +2 carapace finishing for Zenio. Also melee +1. Huk getting robo bay up and +2 attack. Roach drop coming into the main of Huk.
14:10 Huk clears his main with good blinks and focusing on overlords. Zenio pressures at Huks 3rd but gets denied. Trades going on back and forth. +3 weapons and colossus and thermal lance on the way from Huk.
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HuK's build is really good, but i'm still afraid.. Please HuK. 
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Why does HuK keep blinking in like that :/
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On September 21 2011 21:44 izgodlee wrote:
perfect protoss play once again, zerg should be way behind, let see if huk loses
i can't tell if ur being serious or not
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Huk is so far behind... :-/
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I've seen enough ZvPs to know Zenio doesn't have a prayer.
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Wow, zenio just gets every single upgrade LOl.
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HuK playing this CombatEX style (yes, I dared!), interesting
It looks like it shouldn't work, but after a while the protoss gets an insane amounts of units, income, and production whereas the zerg can do nothing.
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Similar situation to Sase's earlier game. Roach drop in the main as cannons near completion with another attack at the the third base.
Except HuK splits very well.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES50601 Posts
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
On September 21 2011 21:43 mTw|NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 21:42 7mk wrote:On September 21 2011 21:39 HaruRH wrote:On September 21 2011 21:33 tomatriedes wrote:On September 21 2011 21:25 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 21 2011 21:23 tomatriedes wrote:On September 21 2011 21:18 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 21 2011 21:15 tomatriedes wrote:On September 21 2011 21:08 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 21 2011 21:06 Tenox wrote:
[quote]
Well your analysis is slightly incorrect, there was never a big enough window of time during the game where he could get out colossi safely, not even after he defended the first all-in...Even if he did another build it still wouldn't be possible vs these typ of all-ins.
I didn't say he needed a Colossus that game, I did name the counters to many marines. He didn't bring any of them or didn't control well enough, so he lost. Not saying its not easy to execute and strong for Terran, but calling it imbalanced or completely unbeatable is untrue. That asd guy even though playing against not the best Zerg (no offence to Zenio) is really good. Strong macro, continues to expand, good drops etc. Something doesn't have to be 'completely unbeatable' to be imbalanced. If it is far easier to execute than to defend that in itself is a problem. VR all-ins were never completely unbeatable either yet they were nerfed. But yeah, even if there no were no toss left in code S or A people like you would still be claiming there's no problem. I strongly disagree. In Broodwar there was Protoss Bulldog against Terran fast expansion. It was 3 gates + a robotics for shuttle to drop zealots on the high ground. It was INSANELY hard to defend and very basic to execute for a good player. Ofcourse I agree with you, that the 1-1-1 or any variation of the build is 'easy' but not as easy to execute as a lot of people might think. Ofcourse its still easier than the defence (far easier I'd even say). The thing is, that there is NOTHING TO NERF. Marines are not overpowered in itself, neither are tanks, medivacs or banshees. The combination of all those things make it very hard for Protoss. Barracks build time got nerfed and immortal range got buffed, I think this will lead to a more solid defence which could help out a lot, we will see. But "people like me" would still play and work on the game instead of wasting time complaining. BS. If Bulldog was as good as 1-1-1 is now pro BW toss players would have used it a lot more. And the last part is easy to say as a terran. Even pro terrans like Polt and MVP can admit there is something wrong, but go ahead and keep advocating for your race. It's pretty obvious how biased you are. They admit the combination is wrong and I agree, but its not solved by nerfing the individual units. MVP also said he wouldn't use it, because its overpowered and... wait. What did he do to HuK? A variation of it, IN EVERY GAME. And I don't know what level you are on in Broodwar, but Bulldog was definately a good build if executed well (aka do not let your opponent scout everything-_-) We're talking about pro level not ladder level. Bulldog does not get used at pro level because it's not difficult for them to stop it even though ladder players may struggle with it. 1-1-1 does get used at pro level and pros lose to it 90% of the time. Can you really not see the difference? None of us would care if only ladder players were losing to 1-1-1s but that's not the case as you well know. And as someone else pointed out you were a huge terran qqer before so basically you're being a huge hypocrite saying that toss should never complain about balance. NarutO is a pretty good PRO player. Grubby invited him because grubby recognized his talents. What about you? Why is it that you guys are nitpicking on someone's bad points from months ago? He could be a very bad Terran qqer a few months ago, but he is now a pro player himself. It shows that he improved and do not want to look back at his shortcomings anymore. Huk was a bmer last time. Why not hate on him? You're the hypocrite here. Your words seemed like it was spouted from an ignorant child 15-17 years old. Grow up and learn to see a wider perspective. Protoss players need to grow out of their old styles or else they (we) will fail. I'm not gonna get into the bulldog discussion, I dont know anything about BW PvT, but I'm just gonna say that Naruto being a pro (he isnt a pro any more than he was a few months ago. Except I guess that hes in GM league now) most definitely doesnt mean he cant be wrong about something. Pro players considerably better than him argue and contradict each other all the freakin time. I always was in the highest ladder. In the past and now I'm GM and I agree. That doesn't mean I am always right about the things I say. I respect other peoples opinion so.. to everyone its own. We don't need to discuss how awesome naruto is any further I think. End of discussion!
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5 Bases T_T plz do some damage soon
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On September 21 2011 21:44 izgodlee wrote:
perfect protoss play once again, zerg should be way behind, let see if huk loses
I don't understand why Zerg should be behind? Do you care to tell me? In my opinion as Terran he had a good read prepared his bases with spores and defended the DT harass very well. Huk took his third and is now catching up to the economy while his 3 bases are worth more than those of Zerg.
So.. I think the game is pretty even?
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On September 21 2011 21:44 Demonace34 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 21:43 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:41 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:40 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:39 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:38 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:37 Demonace34 wrote:On September 21 2011 21:35 Demonace34 wrote:2:10 Pool first from Zenio, Huk goes for nexus first. No gas from Zenio. 3:30 Forge and cannon come down for Huk. Zenio expansion finishes up. Huk adds on 2 gas and a gate. 5:00 Zenio takes quick 3rd base and droning hard. Huk chronoing wg research, not taking his expansion gases. 7:00 Huk throws down 5 more gates and a twilight council and two more gasses. Roach warren and +1 carapace coming up for Zenio. 9:00 Huk getting dark shrine +1 weapons and blink while getting up his 3rd base. Lair and ling speed coming up from Zenio. 10:45 Huk getting cannons at his 3rd, sending out a dt to deny the 4th of Zenio. Zenio getting spire, drops and overlord speed. 12:00 Roach speed and +2 carapace finishing for Zenio. Also melee +1. Huk getting robo bay up and +2 attack. Roach drop coming into the main of Huk. 14:10 Huk clears his main with good blinks and focusing on overlords. Zenio pressures at Huks 3rd but gets denied. Trades going on back and forth. +3 weapons and colossus and thermal lance on the way from Huk.
16:30 Hive on the way for Zenio, bane speed +2 melee +1 ranged attack. Another robo coming down for Huk.
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5 base vs 3 base toss -"-
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On September 21 2011 21:45 BFD wrote:
HuK playing this CombatEX style (yes, I dared!), interesting
It looks like it shouldn't work, but after a while the protoss gets an insane amounts of units, income, and production whereas the zerg can do nothing.
Man, HuK been studying those CombatEx coaching vids man
Late at night in the OGS house, when the lights are out...
"HITHISISCOMBATEXRECORDINGANOTHERFPVOD"
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Zenio didn't even kill the shrine. ;__;
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On September 21 2011 21:32 MrProb wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2011 21:29 La1 wrote:
I am at work so please take this post with a pinch of salt.. (not seen game)
i am highish masters and have faced both the 3rax marine tank and the 1-1-1 build and the problem i find is from the time you see a bunker (i assume he made a bunker and huk scouted it) from the time until you get an observer out you actually have no idea what form of 1 base all in is comming,
I have actually faced the 3rax marine tank build 3-4 times on ladder and lost every time because ive been preparing for a 1-1-1 and by the time ive seen the 3rax etc its too late to get collosus and the first push just crushes me, ive actually had a game where i got the collsus but as other users have stated the range 6 collosus doesnt save you vs heavy marine with tanks, the tanks can focus the collosus and its basically gg from there..
I feel the second you scout this builld with an observer you need to trap them in there base with sentrys otherwise your as good as dead..
Like i said at the start i have NOT seen the game so please just take this as my personnal pov in relation to the two builds people have talked about and not specifics of the game.
cant trap medivac =(
as far as i recall 3 rax marine tank doesnt have medivacs, if you delays them by forcing ramp they either need to wait for seige, which still means it can be slowed, or they have to build medivacs and then you may have time to get collosus out, Ill try and find time to watch the games later tonight but if its the 3rax marine tank ive seen its very difficult to stop simply because marine deps owns gateway stuff and tanks just own any armour units
i personally think the protoss tech tree is far to long to get things.
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EPT
