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Sooo I miss game 1 live? Do we need to buy a ticket to see the VODS? I can't remember... If we do thats super laaaame.
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On May 12 2011 11:30 crawlingchaos wrote:
Refreshed and see Grubby up 1-0...
Refreshed, and I've officially seen 4 times as many commercials as I have games...
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On May 12 2011 11:28 Exley wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:23 travis wrote:On May 12 2011 11:19 sAfuRos wrote:On May 12 2011 11:17 sermokala wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 12 2011 11:14 FuzzyJAM wrote:
Artosis is obviously better than most people posting. I don't think anyone would deny that.
However, considering his commentary on other players (e.g. 90% of Code A season one, most of whom I'd say showed better games than his NASL performance) I think he deserves some ribbing. It's almost all good natured; almost everyone making fun of him is a fan. You can't expect a player to play so badly (by pro standards, and this is supposed to be a pro league) and not have people comment on it. you hit it right on the head I think. Hes better then probably all the people in this thread its just he spends so much time with the pros and he wants to be a pro so we just bash him for it. and stream dies again ;( Yea no. He is not even top Masters, and ladder experience versus him tells me he is quite weak. There are plenty of casuals like myself who are flat out better than him. Whaaat? Artosis is too top masters, dunno what ur smoking. You must have improved for you to now be better than him. Eh, not really. His US account rank is pretty modest... something in the range of 950 Masters with 45% win rate. There are definitely plenty of casual Masters players who are just flat out better. This is disregarding tournament experience.
well 950 is top masters
anyways he is 972 with a 49.28% winrate.
it's #205 masters player
i actually thought he would be higher but I still consider that top masters
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ug if your gona lag at least start the stream where you left off.
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TLO should do all-in because he isn't going to beat Grubby at a macro game!
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Both times the stream crashed nobody in NASL thought to pause the broadcast? I've missed 2 games because of this. Disappointing.
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Son of a bitch, gonna have to imagine how game 1 went down. I'm sure it was carriers/archon/HT/DT vs BC/cloak banshees/ghosts with nukes/and offensive PFs..yeah, that's it.
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On May 12 2011 11:33 AimForTheBushes wrote:
Son of a bitch, gonna have to imagine how game 1 went down. I'm sure it was carriers/archon/HT/DT vs BC/cloak banshees/ghosts with nukes/and offensive PFs..yeah, that's it.
Sounds like an amazing game, would easily recommend it! I wish we had a slight idea as to what really happened.
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On May 12 2011 11:31 jdseemoreglass wrote:Refreshed, and I've officially seen 4 times as many commercials as I have games...
Isn't that how it is with justin.tv nowadays, everydays?
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United States7483 Posts
On May 12 2011 11:30 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:26 Whitewing wrote:On May 12 2011 11:21 Azarkon wrote:On May 12 2011 11:15 Whitewing wrote:On May 12 2011 11:13 Azarkon wrote:On May 12 2011 11:11 sermokala wrote:On May 12 2011 11:09 Azarkon wrote:
50 supply's worth of immortals would not kill 200/200 mech. I think Gretorp was exaggerating, and Idra just didn't want to argue. Although, mech is less viable after the patch due to thors being countered by HTs. If they where spaced out and there wasn't any ghosts out then yeah they would. but the problem is that there is and they never are. The counter to Mech is protoss air. You can't go wrong with 20 void rays and 3 carriers. Even then they wouldn't because Thors do relatively well vs. Immortals. 250mm pre-patch devastated Immortal groups. Protoss air is countered by vikings, so 200/200 mech should really be played with either marines or vikings. Not quite, carriers are actually cost effective against vikings, and your void rays can go in after the intercepters launch (get some phoenix too to tank/dps vikings and lift tanks). I've never seen carriers used effectively against mech. Yes it's possible, no I haven't seen it done. Theoretically speaking, if carriers counter vikings, then carrier colossi (or carrier HT) should ripe apart all Terran armies (since then the only tool Terran would have vs. carriers are marines) but I've never seen it work. Carriers don't really 'counter' vikings, they kill more vikings than their cost, but they build a hell of a lot slower. One carrier can take down 3 vikings for example, especially with upgrades, but a reactored starport will pump them so much faster. You don't see it often because marines destroy interceptors, carriers take ages to build and are expensive (combination meaning that you're out 350/250 for a ridiculously long time before you get the damn unit), and very rarely do terrans go for a 200/200 mech ball where protoss recognizes it early enough to get carriers out. I've seen White-Ra demolish some terran mech players with it on his stream. Carriers are actually extremely powerful units, the problem is that their build time is absurdly long, they're expensive, they're very hard to tech too while staying alive, and players don't really do large mech builds most of the time. Well then that's the problem. Late-game build time is as important as cost effectiveness especially if the Terran can just keep trading his vikings for your carriers and then punishing the rest of your army. Marines aren't too big of a deal because Protoss has plenty of solutions against Marines - both Colossi and HTs flat out destroy them. But getting a carrier + anything death ball up is really hard because of carrier build times. This made Terran mech a viable route at least until the last patch.
Yeah, I've been playing around with them a lot lately, because if you can manage to get a large amount of carriers out, the only thing terran can do to stop you, literally, is somehow get a bunch of battlecruisers out, and somehow manage to get yamato cannon shots off without getting hit by feedbacks from the HT support.
I've been experimenting with a mid-game heavy gateway style with 2-3 warp prisms with speed upgrade flying around the map at the same time warping in units at multiple locations at once for harass damage and pinning my enemy, which I find to be very effective (my win rate against terran and zerg has jumped to 90% since I started doing this), and then I do a transition into carriers. You can support 3 stargate carrier EASILY on 3 bases for example.
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On May 12 2011 11:28 sAfuRos wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:23 travis wrote:
Whaaat?
Artosis is too top masters, dunno what ur smoking. You must have improved for you to now be better than him. Improved by what standard and what? How would you know what my play was ever like? On that note i've been pretty consistently rank 200-300 in NA ever since release, and still am. I've played Artosis 4 times on the ladder, and won every time. Granted these games were all over 2 weeks ago, but its not exactly like Artosis has improved much in the last 2 weeks in the NASL is any indication. His inability to show results versus ANYONE is also a big indicator. I can play toe to toe with people like vibe. This isn't a "look how good i am" thing. This is a "Artosis is not better than a ton of people" thing.
well I played you 4 or 5 times (months ago, though). and i have also played artosis. but if you consistently beat him then this is probably just a good example of how I(and everyone else) shouldn't try to base too much off of small sample sizes.
and 400 americans isn't really a ton, that's pretty few people in the grand scheme of things. it probably means he is better than 99% of the people watching this stream. but if your argument is that he shouldn't be in NASL I would have snap-agreed with that lol
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On May 12 2011 11:21 TheHova wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:18 travis wrote:On May 12 2011 11:14 FuzzyJAM wrote:On May 12 2011 11:09 travis wrote:On May 12 2011 11:07 TheHova wrote:On May 12 2011 11:05 travis wrote:Understand that every player in the NASL is quite good, it's not like you guys would ever have a chance vs them. So Artosis gets owned over and over, he'd still crush anyone making comments about his skill level  (or almost anyone) I'm in grandmaster O_O. (I know this doesn't mean i'm better than Artosis btw and ladder doesn't really mean much) sure it means plenty and im sure some players in here are better than him but as i expected, you haven't made any comments like I was talking about Artosis is obviously better than most people posting. I don't think anyone would deny that. However, considering his commentary on other players (e.g. 90% of Code A season one, most of whom I'd say showed better games than his NASL performance) I think he deserves some ribbing. It's almost all good natured; almost everyone making fun of him is a fan. You can't expect a player to play so badly (by pro standards, and this is supposed to be a pro league) and not have people comment on it. I absolutely think that's fair. I just think there is a line between "ribbing" and stupid comments, sometimes people say things and I have to say to myself "do you actually believe that?" Couldn't agree more. The comments like 'Artosis plays like a platinum level player' and things like that really irritate me. The same can be said when Grubby loses too. The guy took 3rd at Copenhagen ffs.
Both Grubby and Artosis are 0-4 before today but Grubby has at least won a few games and showed much better skills than artosis.
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On May 12 2011 11:21 jdseemoreglass wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:14 Sight- wrote:On May 12 2011 11:12 jdseemoreglass wrote:On May 12 2011 11:10 Kisra wrote:On May 12 2011 11:09 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On May 12 2011 11:08 Zooper31 wrote:On May 12 2011 11:07 DaCruise wrote:
Time for the popularity contest: TLO vs Grubby!..who the hell do I cheer for? Where do you think you're posting? TLO of course! Grubby's overhyped imo. Great WC3 player but this isn't WC3. He hasn't showed many (any?) results so far in SC2. And TLO is awesome ^^ 3rd place in Copenhagen was a pretty big result. He's inconsistant, not bad. There is a difference. The fact that everyone keeps pointing to a third place finish as evidence of his skill is pretty telling. I know, I know... It was such a "huge, tough!" tournament, like gsl... Yeah, because of the huge amount of people with better places in more prestigious tournaments, it's awful that anyone thinks of grubby as good. I'm not denying he is a good player. But too many people are giving him credit for a completely different game. So far he has placed third in a single tournament. I've never even seen him play until NASL, and he goes 0-4. This is not WC3....
2 months ago he was going 50/50 against mid-master nobodies on his stream. Now he's up near the top of Grandmasters and taking games off some of the best players in Europe in competition.
His rate of improvement has been tremendous and if he keeps it up there's no reason to believe he won't be one of the very best players outside of Korea fairly soon, particularly when you see how well other WC3 pros have transitioned to SC2 (and few if any were as good as Grubby is now within 2 months of switching).
Anyway, it's an inevitability that any BW or WC3 pro will make an excellent SC2 player if they put in the time and effort, which Grubby is doing. I could have told you 3 months ago that Thorzain would become one of the best SC2 players in Europe, just based on his WC3 skill.
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On May 12 2011 11:35 Whitewing wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:30 Azarkon wrote:On May 12 2011 11:26 Whitewing wrote:On May 12 2011 11:21 Azarkon wrote:On May 12 2011 11:15 Whitewing wrote:On May 12 2011 11:13 Azarkon wrote:On May 12 2011 11:11 sermokala wrote:On May 12 2011 11:09 Azarkon wrote:
50 supply's worth of immortals would not kill 200/200 mech. I think Gretorp was exaggerating, and Idra just didn't want to argue. Although, mech is less viable after the patch due to thors being countered by HTs. If they where spaced out and there wasn't any ghosts out then yeah they would. but the problem is that there is and they never are. The counter to Mech is protoss air. You can't go wrong with 20 void rays and 3 carriers. Even then they wouldn't because Thors do relatively well vs. Immortals. 250mm pre-patch devastated Immortal groups. Protoss air is countered by vikings, so 200/200 mech should really be played with either marines or vikings. Not quite, carriers are actually cost effective against vikings, and your void rays can go in after the intercepters launch (get some phoenix too to tank/dps vikings and lift tanks). I've never seen carriers used effectively against mech. Yes it's possible, no I haven't seen it done. Theoretically speaking, if carriers counter vikings, then carrier colossi (or carrier HT) should ripe apart all Terran armies (since then the only tool Terran would have vs. carriers are marines) but I've never seen it work. Carriers don't really 'counter' vikings, they kill more vikings than their cost, but they build a hell of a lot slower. One carrier can take down 3 vikings for example, especially with upgrades, but a reactored starport will pump them so much faster. You don't see it often because marines destroy interceptors, carriers take ages to build and are expensive (combination meaning that you're out 350/250 for a ridiculously long time before you get the damn unit), and very rarely do terrans go for a 200/200 mech ball where protoss recognizes it early enough to get carriers out. I've seen White-Ra demolish some terran mech players with it on his stream. Carriers are actually extremely powerful units, the problem is that their build time is absurdly long, they're expensive, they're very hard to tech too while staying alive, and players don't really do large mech builds most of the time. Well then that's the problem. Late-game build time is as important as cost effectiveness especially if the Terran can just keep trading his vikings for your carriers and then punishing the rest of your army. Marines aren't too big of a deal because Protoss has plenty of solutions against Marines - both Colossi and HTs flat out destroy them. But getting a carrier + anything death ball up is really hard because of carrier build times. This made Terran mech a viable route at least until the last patch. Yeah, I've been playing around with them a lot lately, because if you can manage to get a large amount of carriers out, the only thing terran can do to stop you, literally, is somehow get a bunch of battlecruisers out, and somehow manage to get yamato cannon shots off without getting hit by feedbacks from the HT support. I've been experimenting with a mid-game heavy gateway style with 2-3 warp prisms with speed upgrade flying around the map at the same time warping in units at multiple locations at once for harass damage and pinning my enemy, which I find to be very effective (my win rate against terran and zerg has jumped to 90% since I started doing this), and then I do a transition into carriers. You can support 3 stargate carrier EASILY on 3 bases for example.
Heh, that's a pretty cool composition. Think I'll start playing around with it, especially after they buffed Archons 
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On May 12 2011 11:32 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2011 11:28 Exley wrote:On May 12 2011 11:23 travis wrote:On May 12 2011 11:19 sAfuRos wrote:On May 12 2011 11:17 sermokala wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On May 12 2011 11:14 FuzzyJAM wrote:
Artosis is obviously better than most people posting. I don't think anyone would deny that.
However, considering his commentary on other players (e.g. 90% of Code A season one, most of whom I'd say showed better games than his NASL performance) I think he deserves some ribbing. It's almost all good natured; almost everyone making fun of him is a fan. You can't expect a player to play so badly (by pro standards, and this is supposed to be a pro league) and not have people comment on it. you hit it right on the head I think. Hes better then probably all the people in this thread its just he spends so much time with the pros and he wants to be a pro so we just bash him for it. and stream dies again ;( Yea no. He is not even top Masters, and ladder experience versus him tells me he is quite weak. There are plenty of casuals like myself who are flat out better than him. Whaaat? Artosis is too top masters, dunno what ur smoking. You must have improved for you to now be better than him. Eh, not really. His US account rank is pretty modest... something in the range of 950 Masters with 45% win rate. There are definitely plenty of casual Masters players who are just flat out better. This is disregarding tournament experience. well 950 is top masters anyways he is 972 with a 49.28% winrate. it's #205 masters player i actually thought he would be higher but I still consider that top masters
He customs a fair bit on the KR server with some Zerg and plays on there too. Might be why it is lower. And didn't he recently go on a massive tilt on ladder anyway? Ladder doesn't really count for much tbh. I have like 1 runners up in Go4SC2 and got in Grandmaster while there's players i practice with who are better than me and in Masters.
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United States7483 Posts
Ouch, Grubby should have known immediately he couldn't take that.
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That engagement from Grubby was quite irrational. He just took his second expo and teched quickly.
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What is your name? I don't ever remember playing you.
Regardless i was at 80% and rank 3 in the world masters about 2 weeks ago at 1230 points. Currently i'm down after going on a huge losing streak and tilting hard for the first time since this season started but still at about 1150 with about a 74% w/r
Compare that to Artosis with a sub 50% w/r and sub 1000 points.
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EPT
