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On April 24 2011 01:45 EmilA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:43 aScle wrote:On April 24 2011 01:38 KristianJS wrote:On April 24 2011 01:36 AxionSteel wrote:
I hate forcefields. Such a boring ability. Yeah, I really do agree. Good forcefields literally eliminate micro from battles...I mean why would Blizzard think that's a good idea? Please put your balance talk in the b.net forums. Also you realize that in that match forcefields never entirely eliminated all micro from battles as burrowed roaches are one of the few units that move through them. It wasn't a balance whine. Forcefields are just boring by design as they limit opponent's possibility of microing.
I call bullshit, I get that people love to hate whenever a toss wins, and when its with FF people direct their hate towards that, but I think its actually one of the more interesting abilities in the game and one with a high skill ceiling. If protoss were the UP race and MC barely managed to scrape a win with FFs then everyone would be talking about how sweet it is, people just hate everything that toss wins with atm.
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On April 24 2011 01:45 zeru wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:41 TYJ.Aoy wrote:On April 24 2011 01:40 Dante08 wrote:
Although Morrow lost, was anyone impressed with his macro? Especially in game 2 I felt he macroed so well, just that the strategy he chose was wrong.
Well he used to play bw so it isn't too surprising. According to tyler everything morrow did was bad, he knows, right? Yes, actually.
That's arguable. Just because he's a baller doesn't mean he is a God of sc2 strategies.
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On April 24 2011 01:44 massivez wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:38 NemEU wrote:
I keep hearing people on here bitching about ff or imbalance in this mu. I have no idea which series you guys were watching but MC is just absurdly good. At no point in any of the games he won was he remotely close to losing, he always had his units in the right place, never out of position, always the right units.
This attitude is poison in the Sc2 community people are more ready to choose imbalance as the reason for a players success over skill, which is just stupid. Zerg players are particuluarly guilty of this, and I think its due to a really vocal minority which since early in the beta have been hell bent on convincing the community that zerg is this shitty race that just somehow bizzarely happens to have all the best players top to bottom. The only reason they have any success is because they are the best, and if they played p/t they would never lose a game. Seriously even mediocre ladder players are possessed of this ridiculas notion.
MC is just that good. Its true that MC is good, and i think nobody is taking something away from him. But the thing still stands that no zerg atm is even getting close in too getting a shot for winning a major tournament. Also following you're logic, that means every zerg player is 2 steps down the rest of the races in terms of skill (wich is wrong).
I am not suggesting zerg players are a step down. But the game opperates in revolutions of strategy, just because a race is struggling right now it doesnt mean it is unbalanced, it means that right now players of the more successful race have a better grasp of how to play thier race / mu. There are strategies going around right now that dont involve roachs or hydras in any large number, the ling bling > infestor > ultra build. If played correctly is incredibly good pvz. This build is only just starting to gain momentum on the ladder and most players play it wrong but it is very powerful.
If a time comes when zerg is using this build pvz and winning a disproportionate amount of the time I will be the one who is experimenting with protoss styles, not complaining my race cant win.
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On April 24 2011 01:47 Morale wrote:
Khaldor dissing day9s skill omg!
What did he say ? I mute the stream and turn music on when there are pauses
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On April 24 2011 01:49 HuHEN wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:45 EmilA wrote:On April 24 2011 01:43 aScle wrote:On April 24 2011 01:38 KristianJS wrote:On April 24 2011 01:36 AxionSteel wrote:
I hate forcefields. Such a boring ability. Yeah, I really do agree. Good forcefields literally eliminate micro from battles...I mean why would Blizzard think that's a good idea? Please put your balance talk in the b.net forums. Also you realize that in that match forcefields never entirely eliminated all micro from battles as burrowed roaches are one of the few units that move through them. It wasn't a balance whine. Forcefields are just boring by design as they limit opponent's possibility of microing. I call bullshit, I get that people love to hate whenever a toss wins, and when its with FF people direct their hate towards that, but I think its actually one of the more interesting abilities in the game and one with a high skill ceiling. If protoss were the UP race and MC barely managed to scrape a win with FFs then everyone would be talking about how sweet it is, people just hate everything that toss wins with atm.
People have been complaining over how boring forcefields are since the beta when protoss was seen as a weaker race.
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On April 24 2011 01:47 Morale wrote:
Khaldor dissing day9s skill omg!
He must be publicly hung.
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You know, if zerg's experiment with going lair with the first hundred gas, alot of timings and option open up z v p :D, it works on a master level :D
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I tell you, Gruby is gonna take this, goin to surprize everybody and take the deal.
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United Kingdom38257 Posts
On April 24 2011 01:48 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:45 Azarkon wrote:On April 24 2011 01:42 TT1 wrote:On April 24 2011 01:28 Numy wrote:On April 24 2011 01:27 TT1 wrote:On April 24 2011 01:25 Lennon wrote:On April 24 2011 01:21 nam nam wrote:On April 24 2011 01:19 FarbrorAbavna wrote:On April 24 2011 01:17 epoc wrote:
Funny how cheesing is the only way morrow even stands a chance against mc. dont judge an entire race based on one persons play Name me one foreign zerg that would stand a good chance against MC in a bo5. Morrow might not be on the top of his game, but most zergs would look bad against MC. Dimaga sen actually I thought Sheth also is meant to have a really sick ZvP? yea sheth is good.. but sen is really really really good : D he plays/thinks like an sc1 zerg and has the most diverse style of any of the foreigner z's, he understands every mu so well and has so many builds which in turn makes him really unpredictable because he adapts his style given wat situation hes in and understands how to optimize his style to the fullest vs w/e his opponent is doing basically he has the same level of execution as any of the top foreigner z's but his understanding of the game is above all the other zerg users imo Wonder who TT1 loses to in practice matches  : D but i swear my opinion is truly honest and unbiased
Sen is amazing, anyone who doesn't understand how amazing needs to watch him play vs Nani in the GCPL finals ace match =)
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I really hope Kas wins here because I'd love to see a Kas vs MC finals, but then Kas vs MC in the finals would be a must watch and the finals will probably overlap with the TSL T__T
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TLO must go back to random, it just so much more entertaining.
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On April 24 2011 01:33 Lennon wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:29 sinii wrote:On April 24 2011 01:28 Lennon wrote:On April 24 2011 01:25 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On April 24 2011 01:23 Lennon wrote:Lose with a standard strategy: He sucks. What the fuck is he doing? Win with a risky all-in strategy: He's a genious! he lost because he played bad in the first two games. micro macro build order tactics strategy. style has nothing to do with it. it looked like he wanted to play a style like this http://www.gomtv.net/2011gslsponsors3/vod/65005 but is really really bad at it, cutting back on the effectiveness of attacking head on for investments that end up not helping at all with anything I was poking fun at the comments in this thread as opposed to the actual games. I still agree though. You have been whining about Zerg for the past few comments, don't change your tune when a pro shuts you down. Change my tune? I wasn't even whining.
Im not going to go back and quote your posts, but essentially the thread something like:
thread: "omg morrow use something other then Roaches"
Lennon: "there is no alternative to Roaches"
thread: "Your kidding ain't you? he didn't even try to use infestors/broods"
Lennon: "Theres no viable alternative, it's either this or mutas and lose"
Tyler: "Morrow just played bad"
Lennon: "Oh yeh i was just poking fun at all these posters lol"
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On April 24 2011 01:50 n00b3rt wrote:What did he say ? I mute the stream and turn music on when there are pauses
He didnt diss him he just said these players are better than day9 at playing.
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On April 24 2011 01:42 TT1 wrote:
yea sheth is good.. but sen is really really really good : D he plays/thinks like an sc1 zerg and has the most diverse style of any of the foreigner z's, he understands every mu so well and has so many builds which in turn makes him really unpredictable because he adapts his style given wat situation hes in and understands how to optimize his style to the fullest vs w/e his opponent is doing
basically he has the same level of execution as any of the top foreigner z's but his understanding of the game is above all the other zerg users imo
Ah that's good to know. I've always thought Sen was a cut above the rest.
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On April 24 2011 01:38 NemEU wrote:
I keep hearing people on here bitching about ff or imbalance in this mu. I have no idea which series you guys were watching but MC is just absurdly good. At no point in any of the games he won was he remotely close to losing, he always had his units in the right place, never out of position, always the right units.
This attitude is poison in the Sc2 community people are more ready to choose imbalance as the reason for a players success over skill, which is just stupid. Zerg players are particuluarly guilty of this, and I think its due to a really vocal minority which since early in the beta have been hell bent on convincing the community that zerg is this shitty race that just somehow bizzarely happens to have all the best players top to bottom. The only reason they have any success is because they are the best, and if they played p/t they would never lose a game. Seriously even mediocre ladder players are possessed of this ridiculas notion.
MC is just that good.
What kills my enjoyment and probably many others is when I see zergs constantly losing to protoss. This is not a question of imbalance, recently... it's just a simple matter of statistics.
I also can't believe people are giving morrow advice. Just like he said, in practice he's been trying every single style, and he found that the roach(hydra) overpowering is the most effective strategy in the long run. I'm not saying he's right by any means, I'm not qualified to make that judgement. But I give pro players lots of credibility because they train really hard and come to their own conclusions.
Nevertheless, MC is probably the better player in this case. But for me, this matchup is becoming unbearable to watch.
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Please greet the PINOY COMMUNITY watching the stream! -YEL
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On April 24 2011 01:42 TT1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:28 Numy wrote:On April 24 2011 01:27 TT1 wrote:On April 24 2011 01:25 Lennon wrote:On April 24 2011 01:21 nam nam wrote:On April 24 2011 01:19 FarbrorAbavna wrote:On April 24 2011 01:17 epoc wrote:
Funny how cheesing is the only way morrow even stands a chance against mc. dont judge an entire race based on one persons play Name me one foreign zerg that would stand a good chance against MC in a bo5. Morrow might not be on the top of his game, but most zergs would look bad against MC. Dimaga sen actually I thought Sheth also is meant to have a really sick ZvP? yea sheth is good.. but sen is really really really good : D he plays/thinks like an sc1 zerg and has the most diverse style of any of the foreigner z's, he understands every mu so well and has so many builds which in turn makes him really unpredictable because he adapts his style given to wat situation hes in and understands how to optimize his style to the fullest vs w/e his opponent is doing basically he has the same level of execution as any of the top foreigner z's but his understanding of the game is above all the other zerg users imo
I kind of agree. In the foreign scene, he is the only one who impressed me with his ZvP.
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On April 24 2011 01:42 StUfF wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:36 Orome wrote:
Holy shit MC. Of course you can point out MC's initial sentry zealot attack not being safe at all, but at the end of the day MC executes whatever he decides to do 2 levels above every other P atm. I feel like it's pretty safe, but pretty reliant on FF placement/control. Especially on a map with lots of walls to keep up against, and fairly short walk distance and centralised xel naga towers. Forcefields lets you retreat from non-speed roaches. Zealots+Sentries kill lings dead with good FF/control. Only thing would be mass speed lings might be dangerous but Morrow has been playing greedy all day + speed ling isn't really a good response after he scouted expand. Killing the Queen/forcing roaches made his stargate follow up so much better.
It gets destroyed if Morrow has some lings out already and starts making roaches slightly earlier (which he would if he'd had lings to spot the army moving out). Lings stop units from retreating, roaches destroy zealot sentry. And the point is MC doesn't know what Morrow has at that point, so he's guessing. I don't really like that attack, but holy shit was it well-executed.
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On April 24 2011 01:45 EmilA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 24 2011 01:43 aScle wrote:On April 24 2011 01:38 KristianJS wrote:On April 24 2011 01:36 AxionSteel wrote:
I hate forcefields. Such a boring ability. Yeah, I really do agree. Good forcefields literally eliminate micro from battles...I mean why would Blizzard think that's a good idea? Please put your balance talk in the b.net forums. Also you realize that in that match forcefields never entirely eliminated all micro from battles as burrowed roaches are one of the few units that move through them. It wasn't a balance whine. Forcefields are just boring by design as they limit opponent's possibility of microing.
Was stasis boring in BW? It's hardly a new concept...
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On April 24 2011 01:50 RedDragon571 wrote:
You know, if zerg's experiment with going lair with the first hundred gas, alot of timings and option open up z v p :D, it works on a master level :D
Good troll. Protoss scouts, sees early undefended tech, 4 gate all-in, wins game.
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EPT
