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On December 07 2010 00:52 Random() wrote:
Disappointing quality of games to be honest. GomTv needs to fix the map situation asap.
I really hate when people say this to be honest. On larger maps you'll never see a terran win against top zergs. Why do people keep pushing for larger maps when the heart of the problem (T's early game vs Z's late game) hasn't been addressed yet?
What people should be asking for is a minor Marine Nerf, a decent Mutalisk Nerf making Banelings light armored and putting tanks back to how they were prior. This would fix pretty much all the problems in the game right now. Terran simply cannot deal with Zerg if they do not win early, if they fall behind for even a second Zerg can expand all over the map and it's insta GG.
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On December 07 2010 07:03 mango_destroyer wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 06:27 bokeevboke wrote:
No matter what excuses you find, current games are very bad for viewers. As a viewer I don't care about prize money, all i need is a show. which is not happening most of the time. The best gamees were at R64 (leenock-clide)!!!. If it goes in same way sc2 will just fail as an esports. LOL. If you cannot accept the fact you are watching a tournament with 90k on the line, you HAVE to expect players to do whatever they can to win it. No one is there to please the viewers...I repeat...it is a competitive TOURNAMENT. If you cannot appreciate that simple fact, I don`t think watching GSL is the right thing for you. Blame Blizzard? They designed the game to be competitive in mind first and foremost. I`d rather Blizzard keep focusing on more important things than make it more pleasing to watch for viewers(what ever that means).
Of course they are there to please the viewers. E-sport, aswell as regular sport, is there to entertain, if it isn't entertaining, none except the players would be intersted in it, and you wouldn't have a tournament with 90k on the line.
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On December 07 2010 07:41 Figgy20000 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 00:52 Random() wrote:
Disappointing quality of games to be honest. GomTv needs to fix the map situation asap. I really hate when people say this to be honest. On larger maps you'll never see a terran win against top zergs. Why do people keep pushing for larger maps when the heart of the problem (T's early game vs Z's late game) hasn't been addressed yet? What people should be asking for is a minor Marine Nerf, a decent Mutalisk Nerf making Banelings light armored and putting tanks back to how they were prior. This would fix pretty much all the problems in the game right now. Terran simply cannot deal with Zerg if they do not win early, if they fall behind for even a second Zerg can expand all over the map and it's insta GG.
How do you nerf the marine without screwing up tvp or tvt?
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It looks like Fruitdeal did a lot of all-ins , do you think that it's because he was afraid of the new protoss end game style, with a lot of air and some colossus(i think)? Apparently it's the new big thing on the korean ladder in PvZ and Idra was getting raped by this on his stream ... It might explain such a strange playstyle by fruitdealer.
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On December 07 2010 07:41 Figgy20000 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 00:52 Random() wrote:
Disappointing quality of games to be honest. GomTv needs to fix the map situation asap. I really hate when people say this to be honest. On larger maps you'll never see a terran win against top zergs. Why do people keep pushing for larger maps when the heart of the problem (T's early game vs Z's late game) hasn't been addressed yet? What people should be asking for is a minor Marine Nerf, a decent Mutalisk Nerf making Banelings light armored and putting tanks back to how they were prior. This would fix pretty much all the problems in the game right now. Terran simply cannot deal with Zerg if they do not win early, if they fall behind for even a second Zerg can expand all over the map and it's insta GG.
The problem is, if you keep balancing for small maps then you will always have this problem. You can't balance for maps. You have to use maps to balance. So by going bigger they can then fix those late game issues and work out most issue.
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On December 07 2010 07:46 darmousseh wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 07:41 Figgy20000 wrote:On December 07 2010 00:52 Random() wrote:
Disappointing quality of games to be honest. GomTv needs to fix the map situation asap. I really hate when people say this to be honest. On larger maps you'll never see a terran win against top zergs. Why do people keep pushing for larger maps when the heart of the problem (T's early game vs Z's late game) hasn't been addressed yet? What people should be asking for is a minor Marine Nerf, a decent Mutalisk Nerf making Banelings light armored and putting tanks back to how they were prior. This would fix pretty much all the problems in the game right now. Terran simply cannot deal with Zerg if they do not win early, if they fall behind for even a second Zerg can expand all over the map and it's insta GG. How do you nerf the marine without screwing up tvp or tvt?
probably by increasing the windup time but leaving the fire rate the same, so that shuffling would be nerfed but overall dps would not experience a noticeable change.
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On December 07 2010 00:31 Mise wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 00:29 hmunkey wrote:
Well shit. This sucks. How many of the T and P wins were all-in moves? For Rain all 3 of them. For HongUn only the last one.
First game with the cannon rush into void ray into 4 warp gate wasnt cheese?
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I am definitely looking forward to watching some TvP games. They've been pretty short in this GSL, but hopefully we can see at least one epic game — a la Jinro v Socke at MLG. Speaking of which, maybe they need to bring Desert Oasis back into the map pool — games on that map are always pretty entertaining to watch.
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On December 07 2010 07:52 Darhaja wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 00:31 Mise wrote:On December 07 2010 00:29 hmunkey wrote:
Well shit. This sucks. How many of the T and P wins were all-in moves? For Rain all 3 of them. For HongUn only the last one. First game with the cannon rush into void ray into 4 warp gate wasnt cheese?
It was cheese, but it wasn't a win. None of HongUn's wins came from cheese.
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HongUn is a new hero of mine. I don't care if some of the other koreans don't rate him or if IdrA said he was bad.
Now all we need is for MC to get through tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
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I watched the FD game and i dont know what FD was thinking. He 1 base all ind so many times
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The amusing thing is, if FD had 1 based on the final game he would of won I think and people would be celebrating his courageous playstyle :p
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Wow Jinro has a legitimate chance to take it all now. His TvP looked pretty solid and his TvT is great. I don't see Foxer or Rain out TvTing him.
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Kinda shocked that nestea lost against such a mediocre player. Oh and fruitdealers performance was very bad too. All in all by far the most boring/worst day of any gsl.
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On December 07 2010 07:41 Figgy20000 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 07 2010 00:52 Random() wrote:
Disappointing quality of games to be honest. GomTv needs to fix the map situation asap. I really hate when people say this to be honest. On larger maps you'll never see a terran win against top zergs. Why do people keep pushing for larger maps when the heart of the problem (T's early game vs Z's late game) hasn't been addressed yet? What people should be asking for is a minor Marine Nerf, a decent Mutalisk Nerf making Banelings light armored and putting tanks back to how they were prior. This would fix pretty much all the problems in the game right now. Terran simply cannot deal with Zerg if they do not win early, if they fall behind for even a second Zerg can expand all over the map and it's insta GG.
Except the heart of the problem IS the maps. Without decent maps, trying to balance the game is futile. You cannot accurately gauge how severe a possible marine/scv/mule nerf needs to be (or if it's even needed at all) when ridiculous maps like SoW, JB, LT, DQ and close position Metal are a part of the pool.
Edit: From Rain's interview:
Q. Terrans are doing a lot of cheese recently.
A. That depends on the map and how close we are. There are maps where it's possible to block them, and maps where it is not possible to.
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That reply by Rain that he intended to play macro but didn't have practice time was pretty baller. I couldn't practice anything fancy so I had to kill him the easy way ("him" referring to the reigning champion). This kind of rehabilitates him in my mind where I had already ticked him off as another one of those lame Terran lamepants lamers.
But yeah, one has to admit that both zerg's performance was a little underwhelming as well. Anyways, looking forward to some Jinrownage now!
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On December 07 2010 08:38 vrok wrote:
Except the heart of the problem IS the maps. Without decent maps, trying to balance the game is futile.
Actually, the game can be balanced around any type of map Blizzard chooses.
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On December 07 2010 08:38 FrogOfWar wrote:
That reply by Rain that he intended to play macro but didn't have practice time was pretty baller. I couldn't practice anything fancy so I had to kill him the easy way ("him" referring to the reigning champion). This kind of rehabilitates him in my mind where I had already ticked him off as another one of those lame Terran lamepants lamers.
But yeah, one has to admit that both zerg's performance was a little underwhelming as well. Anyways, looking forward to some Jinrownage now!
Lol i liked it too. Its like he's saying "if i practiced, i would have pwned him even harder." lol what a nice way to diss tthe reigning champ.
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Although i play zerg, i am not automatically hating rain for all inning on steppes and blistering. He did what he had to do to win, and Nestea also did not defend those rushes in the most effective way.
I am however disappointed in fruitdealer's play, although i don't blame him to losing to dts in the last game, as it is extremely hard to scout that out if the protoss does not want you to.
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Watch the game. Fruit had to all in, because that's the only thing that will work against a canon expand or canon contain. He had no choice, the clock was ticking.
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EPT
