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starckr
26 Posts
I don't even understand this at all. You think people with a macro/defensive style can't win? Have you heard of Savior or Flash? Yeah, both of whom I seem to remember harassing quite a bit. Jinro will have a game won and still allow himself to be run around the map playing defensively. He lacks any decisiveness. Just watch how long he let Moon's mutas run him around. | ||
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starckr
26 Posts
You sir, are an idiot. What's with the ad hominem? | ||
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zerglingsfolife
United States1694 Posts
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starckr
26 Posts
You have some serious analytical issues. Jinro had a lead in the Moon game after his original harassment was so successful. Then he played defensively and macroed. AKA played safe. Attacking an enemy while you are ahead is one of the few ways to throw the game away. I agree to an extent, but Moon had nothing but a muta ball running around. All Jinro really needed to do was send a portion of his army in and use some of it to chase the muta ball away. He instead dragged his entire army across the map running after the muta ball. Honestly I thought that style of play (allowing tons of units to be picked off everywhere) was more likely to lose him the game than just pushing and ending it. To me, it demonstrated a fatal flaw in Jinro's style, i.e., he is overly defensive to the point of it being a liability. (Of course, he was so far ahead in that game that it really did not matter, and it was, as you said, the better alternative to accidentally losing his entire army.) | ||
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Tisp
Canada209 Posts
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Vari
United States532 Posts
he was ahead the entire game and pushed that advantage. did you see him constantly deny expos? without ever leaving himself too exposed. | ||
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Krigwin
1130 Posts
On December 02 2010 13:07 starckr wrote: I agree to an extent, but Moon had nothing but a muta ball running around. All Jinro really needed to do was send a portion of his army in and use some of it to chase the muta ball away. He instead dragged his entire army across the map running after the muta ball. Honestly I thought that style of play (allowing tons of units to be picked off everywhere) was more likely to lose him the game than just pushing and ending it. To me, it demonstrated a fatal flaw in Jinro's style, i.e., he is overly defensive to the point of it being a liability. (Of course, he was so far ahead in that game that it really did not matter, and it was, as you said, the better alternative to accidentally losing his entire army.) I don't think so, he was only playing that defensively after taking out Moon's expansions. Everytime an expansion was up, he was ready to go and pushed out and took it out. When it was necessary, he sacrificed units with multi-pronged attacks. He only went full-on defensive mode after completely starving out Moon, which is the smarter thing to do - let Moon bleed to death trying to harass, rather than maybe make a misstep, lose your army, let Moon get expansions back, and maybe make a comeback. If you look at his previous game as well, Jinro was actively pushing the entire game. He's not defensive, he just knows when not to attack, which is really, really refreshing to see after so many games of SCV all-ins. Jinro's really kind of playing the game how it's meant to be played here, using Terran's innate defensive and range advantages (especially on these maps) to his advantage, blocking Zerg from being able to exploit their racial advantages (having an economic edge), knowing when to hold back, and when to go for the kill. It's really impressive and I think really the only major thing he could improve on is his reaction speed. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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konaman
Australia283 Posts
Couldn't watch the games live but watched all of the vods today, good to see Jinro get through, his play is very solid, but Moon was kinda underwhelming. For a war 3 legend surprisingly his micro was generally bad, and his macro and economy very good, whilst understandably his game sense and decision making was particularly mediocre. He was particularly inept at picking tanks off in very vulnerable areas, despite having muta mobility. Jinro looks like he has improved a lot though and has the style to be relatively consistent, though perhaps not a contender for the top few spots. | ||
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adeezy
United States1428 Posts
On December 02 2010 15:32 konaman wrote: Unlucky Idra had to come up against a powerhouse like mvp. Couldn't watch the games live but watched all of the vods today, good to see Jinro get through, his play is very solid, but Moon was kinda underwhelming. For a war 3 legend surprisingly his micro was generally bad, and his macro and economy very good, whilst understandably his game sense and decision making was particularly mediocre. He was particularly inept at picking tanks off in very vulnerable areas, despite having muta mobility. Jinro looks like he has improved a lot though and has the style to be relatively consistent, though perhaps not a contender for the top few spots. I can see why you would say that. But honestly I thought his micro was good, especially his muta micro (i didnt see him lose TOO many irresponsibly. And if you look closely at game 2 he really did pick off a lot of tanks and did a lot of harass to delay his loss. However the problem was his decision making, in BOTH games he tried to push with banelings and speedlings very agressively but both times it just fell short. | ||
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Wings
United States999 Posts
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escobari
Finland192 Posts
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Douillos
France3195 Posts
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Hot_Bid
Braavos36387 Posts
He's calling you an idiot because you said Jinro's "style is weak and he will never win anything" and Jinro has already won a major tournament, MLG National Championships in Dallas. In those games he did several well-executed 1-base builds against Protoss, so trying to box his style into "overly defensive" off of one Ro16 series against one player is inaccurate as well. | ||
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Deadeight
United Kingdom1629 Posts
That wasn't ad hominem. | ||
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FearDarkness
United States519 Posts
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Kinky
United States4126 Posts
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Xxavi
United States1248 Posts
It's passive defensive game from Top, that allowed Fruitdealer to come back. If he wants to keep improving, he needs to be more decisive and know the right times to attack and finish off a zerg. Because a better Zerg (eg FD) might have got his economy right and came back to game. | ||
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