EPTEvery single time, it's almost like people here honestly believe the game is perfectly balanced right now and never has GSL once exposed certain timings or builds that are simply a bit too powerful.
[GSL] S3 Ro32 Day 1 - Page 84
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Serpico
4285 Posts
Every single time, it's almost like people here honestly believe the game is perfectly balanced right now and never has GSL once exposed certain timings or builds that are simply a bit too powerful. | ||
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zivac
Croatia389 Posts
On November 27 2010 05:45 PanzerKing wrote: This "discussion" seems like a bunch of mindless whining about how Rain's push was "unstoppable even though scouted" when Genius made several big mistakes that cost him the game, which he should have won. Instead of just blindly assuming that Genius was the stronger player, which I really doubt given Rain's immaculate macro and micro, maybe people should be more critical of their hero Protoss. i completely agree with you on that one, but one thing is inevitable in recent tournaments and that is trend of tosses screwing things to easily which reflects on racial distribution overall from qualification rounds to near end of big tourneys. i know as a economist that representative sample is still too small that we can judge statistical results we got from first 3 seasons, but the problem is there wont be time for blizzard to wait for more highest end tournaments (with BO3,5,6,7, not ladder games) to figure out that maybe something is wrong and that is really ungratefull situation for them right now. | ||
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AlexDeLarge
Romania218 Posts
If he would have won game 1, it would be a totally different story i'm sure. His morale, confidence everything would have shifted towards the rest of the series. My guess is he let protoss UP discussions get into his head and didn't focus on winning regardless of balance. Or he just had a bad day. Sad though, wished for more protoss to advance. | ||
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positron.
634 Posts
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AndAgain
United States2621 Posts
On November 27 2010 00:00 Liquid`Jinro wrote: I asked oGsMC if he thought the build Rain used was imba, and said the TL forums were crying over it. He said "No, tell them to trust me on this one". Interestingly, MC lost to a banshee/marine/raven rush in GSL1. He didn't even have an expo. | ||
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Lush
United States657 Posts
As a random player, here is my opinion. Protoss has too little options. You need detection (robo) unless you want banshee's to rofl stomp all over you. Sure, there's forge and cannons, but then there's less army and a smart terran can expand and possibly out macro and out position with tanks. Terran has it easier in my opinion. Now I'm not saying it's imbalanced entirely, it's just easier, so lets not start a flamefest. But when I do this marine/tank/banshee/raven build, I beat players considerably better than me. When I have it done to me, it is incredibly hard to stop. Even when played correctly. Simply put, protoss needs better micro and macro in order to pull it off. It's really not that difficult to throw down some PDD and siege up tanks. Protoss must know exactly when to engage, micro well ...etc. Note Rain didn't even have cloak. With the cloaked banshees, this is way deadlier in my opinion. Marines and raven snipe obs, then it's auto win unless there's cannons. But again, cannons are immobile and they lead to a smaller ground force. Genius made many mistakes, even if he did not make them would he have won? We can't truly say yes or no. It would've been a challenge for both players. Instead, rain styled all over him. I really liked how rain brought his SCV's to buffer/repair/bunker, never seen that done with this strat. I do agree with some posters that it is getting a bit ridiculous how beneficial bring 12 SCV's to an attack can be (Medics for mech units/bunkers), but hey, we've seen players stop it. I really want to see this done against protoss in every TvP until I see someone rofl stomp it, not due to some idiotic mistake by terran either. Impressive play from rain, disappointing from genius. I expected better, especially in game one. | ||
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ooglyboogly
United States6 Posts
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Sabu113
United States11110 Posts
Just watching Jinro and Idraliska til the finals I think. edit: Semi excited for ret. Idk. He and Idraliska are similar macro zergs (as far as I can tell atm). Idra's won my heart with some ridiculously well timed defense. Ret's awesome. Just... eh >< | ||
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UltraVires
United States241 Posts
On November 27 2010 08:57 Sabu113 wrote: Tch. Less excited for the GSL. Hopefully MC shows us something. Not sold on Choya yet. Just watching Jinro and Idraliska til the finals I think. No <3 for ret? qq | ||
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Lush
United States657 Posts
On November 27 2010 08:53 ooglyboogly wrote: For the Protoss being forced to go robo against the threat of Banhees... would it be too overpowering for sentries being able to hallucinate observers and those observers being able to detect? Cool idea actually. I love it. Personally I hate that terran can have observation anytime anywhere providing they save up their energy correctly (ok, so it's not anytime.) This could buffer protoss detection I suppose... may still have same problem of marines/raven obliterating it within seconds by target firing. | ||
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AlexDeLarge
Romania218 Posts
On November 27 2010 09:17 Lush wrote: Cool idea actually. I love it. Personally I hate that terran can have observation anytime anywhere providing they save up their energy correctly (ok, so it's not anytime.) This could buffer protoss detection I suppose... may still have same problem of marines/raven obliterating it within seconds by target firing. But it would make 0 logical sense though. And i don't think they will implement radical changes like this until the expansion. | ||
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gozima
Canada602 Posts
On the bright side, at least another  made it through. | ||
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dongfeng
731 Posts
but if cloak forces robo, wats wrong with getting a forge? cannons cost no gas, and if u do want to go robo its not being used to pump obs reminds me of bw PvT in that T has to get ebay and turrets pretty much any early game vs P due to the multitude of options (reaver, dt, bulldog etc) | ||
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Heen
Korea (South)2178 Posts
 Did people really not understand what was going on in game 1 of the PvZ? I thought it was rather obvious... Z prepared a proxy hatch strat. Z needs to build something in his main if he hasn't taken his nat. Now this is ofc my theory but it's the only possible explanation.. he builds an evo chamber because 1) it's cheaper (he hatched first, doesnt have $ for pool at the time) 2) hopes P will assume that it's a pool since that's the only thing he should expect 3) shows him canceling the evo which might make the P go for a greedy FE (nexus before gateway), but that's far fetched since he had to cancel the evo at some point anyway which leads to possibly later core for P -> more successful queen rush for the Genius game 2, I think he should've realized that cloak wasn't gonna happen since he saw double tech labs on the fac/starport and kept better tabs on T's unit composition.. and stalkers are terrible vs that composition. go Squirtle! #1 in my division! | ||
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summerloud
Austria1201 Posts
about g2 and protoss detection problems - i dont like the idea of hallucinated observers being able to detect, since it makes absolutely no sense. it would be way better to just make robos cheaper but robotic support bays more expensive. this would also help against early marauder pushes, since immos would be out sooner. also i never understood why observers cost 100 gas now compared to 75 in bw, they should change that back imho i hope something like this will balance out the incoming storm nerf, im pretty sure they will put storm to 100 mana, making it do even less dmg would be pretty ridiculous i also hope they make carriers viable. more hp and/or armor for interceptors should do the trick, they are doing enough damage as it is | ||
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Array
Canada46 Posts
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fellcrow
United States288 Posts
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Lockindal
United States73 Posts
what was up with that awesome rush?? if he used his lings on the buildings and waited for the queen it would have worked. i thought the evo was to throw off the protoss so he wouldnt make more units | ||
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singularity14
44 Posts
On November 27 2010 11:27 fellcrow wrote: So, where do I get the vods for GSL if I don't make the live show and don't have a premium account? have a friend tape the live show for you | ||
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AndAgain
United States2621 Posts
On November 27 2010 06:37 AlexDeLarge wrote: Why is everybody talking about game 2 only? It was game 1 that Genius should have won after scouting proxy. But he had horrible micro, and got caught with his stalkers in 2 places by the marine/scv push. Normally if you scout that as toss its 90% win. He also got probes out in the fight way too late, after most of his stalkers died. If he would have won game 1, it would be a totally different story i'm sure. His morale, confidence everything would have shifted towards the rest of the series. My guess is he let protoss UP discussions get into his head and didn't focus on winning regardless of balance. Or he just had a bad day. Sad though, wished for more protoss to advance. The thing about game 1 is that it's really difficult to go against marine+SCV. Correct me I'm wrong, but I think SCVs can take 5 stalker shots, 3 zealot shots, and 9 sentry shots. Plus they build/repair bunkers. Marines have a high DPS, but low HP. The SCV tank nullifies their low HP. It was really weird when Rain was coming with all those marines and SCV and Tastosis were saying how Genius was in a good position while he only had 2 stalkers. It's obvious that they know relatively little about how protoss works. | ||
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