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Razer King of the Beta by Day[9] - Page 154

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
3775 CommentsPost a Reply
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jamesr12
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States1549 Posts
July 26 2010 03:24 GMT
#3061
On July 26 2010 12:21 HaVoX wrote:
The finals look awesome, but I don't know why they would start just before 12pm, many people will be out at midnight releases and that means I would have to be up at 3am to watch


O idk the huge event day9 is hosting? O yeah I think that may be the reason
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=306479
ROOTdrewbie
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada1392 Posts
July 26 2010 03:26 GMT
#3062
On July 26 2010 07:34 Pandain wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 07:23 Surrealz wrote:
I am shocked that QXC is in the finals and white-ra is not. Perhaps it was White-Ra's lack of play in phase 2, but still, I feel like whitera is a whole tier above qxc.. probably terran imba


Qxc reallly suprised me this game. I've said this before, but I really believe it: I think QXC is the future of SC2. Do you see his micro? He's livening things up in ways unbelieved. Dang, I can't believe it, I'm actually becoming a true fan of someone haha.

qxc's worst match up is tvp and he doesn't have much confidence in it, he was trying some new builds that he doesn't usually do as well, which didnt work out too well ;(
www.root-gaming.com
Mjolnir
Profile Joined January 2009
912 Posts
July 26 2010 03:40 GMT
#3063
On July 25 2010 23:30 EnderCN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 25 2010 21:08 Subversion wrote:
On July 25 2010 19:36 Pulimuli wrote:
On July 25 2010 15:06 Subversion wrote:
I think everyone who said 12 second NP wasn't much of a nerf needs to watch IdrA v TLO.


He could've easily killed those BC's, NP -> Attack them with his hydras = dead BC's, but he didnt.

Dont blame the NP nerf for that


yeah, sure, but with the old way he would've been able to np them, kill the other BCs, then bring them back and kill with hydra.


he also could have kept them there to defend against TLO's backup BCs that rolled in like 5 secs later.

also, in the very next game TLO says to idra that 12 sec NP sucks ass. you gonna say u know better than TLO now as well? lolz


Which is why it was nerfed because that would be overpowered, the ability isn't meant to be able to kill off half the enemy army and then kill the other half at your leisure. Just because they are pros doesn't mean they are perfect. IdrA could have done a lot more damage with those NP than he did and the ability is still very viable at 12 seconds. I know I was screaming at the screen to kill the NP BCs too.


It's not overpowered considering how freaking weak Infestors are, especially vs. BCs. The Infestors didn't even threaten TLO, he didn't even bother targeting them - he didn't have to. There's a cost to going for Infestors, they should be a threat, and at this point they just aren't.

Note that IdrA actually lost that battle - a battle he could have won (at a cost) if NP were as it was prior to phase 2. The fact that NP was nerfed cost him that battle and perhaps the game from that point on.

What I don't get is why they changed it. Nobody bitched about NP prior, it wasn't OP - it was a threat. Christ, Infestors die so easily it's a joke. Now they've lost a lot of their versatility and effectiveness.

brain_
Profile Joined June 2010
United States812 Posts
July 26 2010 04:45 GMT
#3064
On July 26 2010 12:40 Mjolnir wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 25 2010 23:30 EnderCN wrote:
On July 25 2010 21:08 Subversion wrote:
On July 25 2010 19:36 Pulimuli wrote:
On July 25 2010 15:06 Subversion wrote:
I think everyone who said 12 second NP wasn't much of a nerf needs to watch IdrA v TLO.


He could've easily killed those BC's, NP -> Attack them with his hydras = dead BC's, but he didnt.

Dont blame the NP nerf for that


yeah, sure, but with the old way he would've been able to np them, kill the other BCs, then bring them back and kill with hydra.


he also could have kept them there to defend against TLO's backup BCs that rolled in like 5 secs later.

also, in the very next game TLO says to idra that 12 sec NP sucks ass. you gonna say u know better than TLO now as well? lolz


Which is why it was nerfed because that would be overpowered, the ability isn't meant to be able to kill off half the enemy army and then kill the other half at your leisure. Just because they are pros doesn't mean they are perfect. IdrA could have done a lot more damage with those NP than he did and the ability is still very viable at 12 seconds. I know I was screaming at the screen to kill the NP BCs too.


It's not overpowered considering how freaking weak Infestors are, especially vs. BCs. The Infestors didn't even threaten TLO, he didn't even bother targeting them - he didn't have to. There's a cost to going for Infestors, they should be a threat, and at this point they just aren't.

Note that IdrA actually lost that battle - a battle he could have won (at a cost) if NP were as it was prior to phase 2. The fact that NP was nerfed cost him that battle and perhaps the game from that point on.

What I don't get is why they changed it. Nobody bitched about NP prior, it wasn't OP - it was a threat. Christ, Infestors die so easily it's a joke. Now they've lost a lot of their versatility and effectiveness.




Seriously. It sucked to watch a unit composition of upgraded anti-air troops and heavily microed spellcasters lose to a single spammed unit type (BCs) because of a nonsensical nerf.
goswser
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States3548 Posts
July 26 2010 04:55 GMT
#3065
On July 26 2010 13:45 brain_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 12:40 Mjolnir wrote:
On July 25 2010 23:30 EnderCN wrote:
On July 25 2010 21:08 Subversion wrote:
On July 25 2010 19:36 Pulimuli wrote:
On July 25 2010 15:06 Subversion wrote:
I think everyone who said 12 second NP wasn't much of a nerf needs to watch IdrA v TLO.


He could've easily killed those BC's, NP -> Attack them with his hydras = dead BC's, but he didnt.

Dont blame the NP nerf for that


yeah, sure, but with the old way he would've been able to np them, kill the other BCs, then bring them back and kill with hydra.


he also could have kept them there to defend against TLO's backup BCs that rolled in like 5 secs later.

also, in the very next game TLO says to idra that 12 sec NP sucks ass. you gonna say u know better than TLO now as well? lolz


Which is why it was nerfed because that would be overpowered, the ability isn't meant to be able to kill off half the enemy army and then kill the other half at your leisure. Just because they are pros doesn't mean they are perfect. IdrA could have done a lot more damage with those NP than he did and the ability is still very viable at 12 seconds. I know I was screaming at the screen to kill the NP BCs too.


It's not overpowered considering how freaking weak Infestors are, especially vs. BCs. The Infestors didn't even threaten TLO, he didn't even bother targeting them - he didn't have to. There's a cost to going for Infestors, they should be a threat, and at this point they just aren't.

Note that IdrA actually lost that battle - a battle he could have won (at a cost) if NP were as it was prior to phase 2. The fact that NP was nerfed cost him that battle and perhaps the game from that point on.

What I don't get is why they changed it. Nobody bitched about NP prior, it wasn't OP - it was a threat. Christ, Infestors die so easily it's a joke. Now they've lost a lot of their versatility and effectiveness.




Seriously. It sucked to watch a unit composition of upgraded anti-air troops and heavily microed spellcasters lose to a single spammed unit type (BCs) because of a nonsensical nerf.

Don't know why everyone is complaining that NP is underpowered now....besides idra not using the NPed cruisers to attack each other, all he had to do was NP half the cruisers and then kill the NPed cruisers with his hydras. Although hydras are a terrible choice against cruisers, if he had scouted the BCs and went mass corrupters he'd have been fine.
say you were born into a jungle indian tribe where food was scarce...would you run around from teepee to teepee stealing meat scraps after a day lazying around doing nothing except warming urself by a fire that you didn't even make yourself? -rekrul
iEchoic
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1776 Posts
July 26 2010 05:10 GMT
#3066
On July 26 2010 13:45 brain_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 12:40 Mjolnir wrote:
On July 25 2010 23:30 EnderCN wrote:
On July 25 2010 21:08 Subversion wrote:
On July 25 2010 19:36 Pulimuli wrote:
On July 25 2010 15:06 Subversion wrote:
I think everyone who said 12 second NP wasn't much of a nerf needs to watch IdrA v TLO.


He could've easily killed those BC's, NP -> Attack them with his hydras = dead BC's, but he didnt.

Dont blame the NP nerf for that


yeah, sure, but with the old way he would've been able to np them, kill the other BCs, then bring them back and kill with hydra.


he also could have kept them there to defend against TLO's backup BCs that rolled in like 5 secs later.

also, in the very next game TLO says to idra that 12 sec NP sucks ass. you gonna say u know better than TLO now as well? lolz


Which is why it was nerfed because that would be overpowered, the ability isn't meant to be able to kill off half the enemy army and then kill the other half at your leisure. Just because they are pros doesn't mean they are perfect. IdrA could have done a lot more damage with those NP than he did and the ability is still very viable at 12 seconds. I know I was screaming at the screen to kill the NP BCs too.


It's not overpowered considering how freaking weak Infestors are, especially vs. BCs. The Infestors didn't even threaten TLO, he didn't even bother targeting them - he didn't have to. There's a cost to going for Infestors, they should be a threat, and at this point they just aren't.

Note that IdrA actually lost that battle - a battle he could have won (at a cost) if NP were as it was prior to phase 2. The fact that NP was nerfed cost him that battle and perhaps the game from that point on.

What I don't get is why they changed it. Nobody bitched about NP prior, it wasn't OP - it was a threat. Christ, Infestors die so easily it's a joke. Now they've lost a lot of their versatility and effectiveness.




Seriously. It sucked to watch a unit composition of upgraded anti-air troops and heavily microed spellcasters lose to a single spammed unit type (BCs) because of a nonsensical nerf.


IdrA would have won if he had simply attacked the BCs he NPed.

I hate that every time I see Terran beat a Zerg player in a vod I inevitably come to the thread and see Zerg players claiming imba.
vileEchoic -- clanvile.com
brain_
Profile Joined June 2010
United States812 Posts
July 26 2010 05:25 GMT
#3067
He still would have lost that game if he had won that battle- it was clear that Hydra/Infestor simply was not a cost efficient composition against mass BCs, post-nerf.

Not to mention that TLO wasn't even bothering to target fire the Infestors. He was just a-moving the BCs in.
lim1017
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada1278 Posts
July 26 2010 05:34 GMT
#3068
apparently a bc can kill 5 hydras in open ground, with cliff advantages theres no way hydras counter bcs
supersoft
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany3729 Posts
July 26 2010 07:32 GMT
#3069
Idra microed so, so bad.
There were several scenes where he could have taken out some more BCs.
At 12min Idra should have attack more agressive hydras are much faster than BCs on creep.
and at 15.30min he wastes so many hydralisks...
And at the end, it wasnt necessary to attack. He just could have taken his expos back and defend. TLO would not have been able to defend his bases with the slow BCs to fast runby attacks.

BCs are not imba. I never lost to BCs as a protoss. Feedback and some stalkers/archons kill them pretty fast if you focusfire. And as we saw, NP+hydras kill them even better if you micro properly. Just attack them and let them attack each other.
+ BCs are so slow...
Tempora
Profile Joined July 2010
United States78 Posts
July 26 2010 08:40 GMT
#3070
On July 26 2010 14:10 iEchoic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 13:45 brain_ wrote:
On July 26 2010 12:40 Mjolnir wrote:
On July 25 2010 23:30 EnderCN wrote:
On July 25 2010 21:08 Subversion wrote:
On July 25 2010 19:36 Pulimuli wrote:
On July 25 2010 15:06 Subversion wrote:
I think everyone who said 12 second NP wasn't much of a nerf needs to watch IdrA v TLO.


He could've easily killed those BC's, NP -> Attack them with his hydras = dead BC's, but he didnt.

Dont blame the NP nerf for that


yeah, sure, but with the old way he would've been able to np them, kill the other BCs, then bring them back and kill with hydra.


he also could have kept them there to defend against TLO's backup BCs that rolled in like 5 secs later.

also, in the very next game TLO says to idra that 12 sec NP sucks ass. you gonna say u know better than TLO now as well? lolz


Which is why it was nerfed because that would be overpowered, the ability isn't meant to be able to kill off half the enemy army and then kill the other half at your leisure. Just because they are pros doesn't mean they are perfect. IdrA could have done a lot more damage with those NP than he did and the ability is still very viable at 12 seconds. I know I was screaming at the screen to kill the NP BCs too.


It's not overpowered considering how freaking weak Infestors are, especially vs. BCs. The Infestors didn't even threaten TLO, he didn't even bother targeting them - he didn't have to. There's a cost to going for Infestors, they should be a threat, and at this point they just aren't.

Note that IdrA actually lost that battle - a battle he could have won (at a cost) if NP were as it was prior to phase 2. The fact that NP was nerfed cost him that battle and perhaps the game from that point on.

What I don't get is why they changed it. Nobody bitched about NP prior, it wasn't OP - it was a threat. Christ, Infestors die so easily it's a joke. Now they've lost a lot of their versatility and effectiveness.




Seriously. It sucked to watch a unit composition of upgraded anti-air troops and heavily microed spellcasters lose to a single spammed unit type (BCs) because of a nonsensical nerf.


IdrA would have won if he had simply attacked the BCs he NPed.

I hate that every time I see Terran beat a Zerg player in a vod I inevitably come to the thread and see Zerg players claiming imba.


yes, but when a terran beats a protoss, i feel its justified.
who macro's? real men 6 pool.
Raevin
Profile Joined July 2010
246 Posts
July 26 2010 08:58 GMT
#3071
TLO didnt lose the third game, Idra won it

TheLittleOne did alot of things right, his harass was very sucessfull and his "final" attack came at the right time before Idra managed to recover: if you paused the game at that point and asked all TL members who they thought would end up winning it, im sure 85% would say TLO, he just looked in far better position than Idra.

The very attack is what turned it upside its own head, Idra pulled his Drones out which drew tank fire and allowed the Roaches to get extra damage in, and just barely managed to defend something that in retrospect he never should have been able to, yet he did it.

I know TLO is well liked, he is well spoken, nice guy and he is European which means alot of players from Europe cheered on for him, while Idra sort of has the villain image here, he "raged" in a few replays which made people think perhaps less off him, all that aside, Idra played well and deserves to go through and some respect, if not for his attitude, at least for his play.
[FnG]Thomean
Profile Joined May 2010
Netherlands7 Posts
July 26 2010 11:12 GMT
#3072
I think it's fun to see how 'overpowered' terran mech is as many people say. I see how they defeat everything by just a-moving.

NP is not op at all, in my opinion. But in that battle Idra made one mistake after another while TLO managed to keep his cruisers alive for a long time. There were many times Idra could have killed lots of cruisers. But he did not. And it's not that TLO did not attack the infestors because they were nothing to worry about. But he did not want his cruisers to float above the hydras. He managed to keep them alive because he did not attack the infestors.
mrlie3
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada350 Posts
July 26 2010 11:18 GMT
#3073
On July 26 2010 12:26 drewbie.root wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 07:34 Pandain wrote:
On July 26 2010 07:23 Surrealz wrote:
I am shocked that QXC is in the finals and white-ra is not. Perhaps it was White-Ra's lack of play in phase 2, but still, I feel like whitera is a whole tier above qxc.. probably terran imba


Qxc reallly suprised me this game. I've said this before, but I really believe it: I think QXC is the future of SC2. Do you see his micro? He's livening things up in ways unbelieved. Dang, I can't believe it, I'm actually becoming a true fan of someone haha.

qxc's worst match up is tvp and he doesn't have much confidence in it, he was trying some new builds that he doesn't usually do as well, which didnt work out too well ;(


Boxer sucked at TvP too but managed to snatch Bonjwa title in early Starcraft scene you know... =) As a qxc fan I cheer for him in this tournament! Go qxc!
Crimson @ Clan CORE | ESFI World Translator
Attris
Profile Joined September 2009
United States175 Posts
July 26 2010 11:28 GMT
#3074
On July 26 2010 12:26 drewbie.root wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 07:34 Pandain wrote:
On July 26 2010 07:23 Surrealz wrote:
I am shocked that QXC is in the finals and white-ra is not. Perhaps it was White-Ra's lack of play in phase 2, but still, I feel like whitera is a whole tier above qxc.. probably terran imba


Qxc reallly suprised me this game. I've said this before, but I really believe it: I think QXC is the future of SC2. Do you see his micro? He's livening things up in ways unbelieved. Dang, I can't believe it, I'm actually becoming a true fan of someone haha.

qxc's worst match up is tvp and he doesn't have much confidence in it, he was trying some new builds that he doesn't usually do as well, which didnt work out too well ;(

New builds for $$ tourny. FTW
Are you serious? |sRs| www.srejects.com
AmiPolizeiFunk
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany804 Posts
July 26 2010 11:48 GMT
#3075
It would be nice to get a confirmation on the exact start time of the semifinals.
Esviliance
Profile Joined June 2010
Russian Federation6 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-07-26 14:16:20
July 26 2010 14:06 GMT
#3076
why don't they update this tourney info?
shutdown_exploded
Profile Joined June 2010
United States133 Posts
July 26 2010 14:20 GMT
#3077
On July 26 2010 20:48 AmiPolizeiFunk wrote:
It would be nice to get a confirmation on the exact start time of the semifinals.

The ustream says come back at 4pm for the cast of the event. It doesn't seem like that could run for 8 hours before he casts a single game, so the midnight is probably wrong?

they played the finals in phase 2, right? they're not live after the beta?
Myles
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5162 Posts
July 26 2010 14:20 GMT
#3078
On July 26 2010 23:06 Esviliance wrote:
why don't they update this tourney info?


What do you mean? The OP has results and vods.
Moderator
retro-noob
Profile Joined June 2010
110 Posts
July 26 2010 14:23 GMT
#3079
On July 26 2010 20:48 AmiPolizeiFunk wrote:
It would be nice to get a confirmation on the exact start time of the semifinals.


Agree. Today's a busy day for me, and as much as I'd like to watch all of the party, I probably don't have that option.
Esviliance
Profile Joined June 2010
Russian Federation6 Posts
July 26 2010 14:40 GMT
#3080
On July 26 2010 23:20 Myles wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 26 2010 23:06 Esviliance wrote:
why don't they update this tourney info?


What do you mean? The OP has results and vods.


even the 6th day isn't wroten and no groups are determined..
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