EPTSlush vs Artosis - Page 5
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JassyP
United States10 Posts
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Slow Motion
United States6960 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:34 Zergneedsfood wrote: But an e-sports community has always been wrapped in the concept of good manner. Just because real sports is a "BM" event doesn't justify doing something like this. I'm a bit neutral on the whole issue as I wasn't here to watch it, but seeing someone else kick someone in the face doesn't justify your actions. If Slush didn't man up, then he should have. That's the end of the story. It doesn't matter if Artosis was whining or whatever, if someone doesn't man up, then that's a BM play that shouldn't be accepted in an e-sports community. This. It doesn't matter how well Slush played later. The fact is he should have forfeited that game, and didn't because he doesn't have integrity. I think Artosis acted childishly but he's 100% right not to play with Slush again. | ||
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NukeGoesKABOOM
United States5 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:35 JassyP wrote: I feel people need to stop bashing Artosis, yea his temper got the best of him....but on the real tip...if you felt someone was going to snatch 300 dollars out of your hands you would get angry too. He flipped out over a video game dude. | ||
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Tiorda
United States91 Posts
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HansMoleman
United States343 Posts
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teamsolid
Canada3668 Posts
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SuperXlax
United States197 Posts
Lets hope your post count stays at 2. | ||
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NukeGoesKABOOM
United States5 Posts
[B]On May 09 2010 12:39 SuperXlax wrote: Lets hope your post count stays at 2. Oh boy the post count response, good manner TL. | ||
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I_Love_Bacon
United States5765 Posts
You'll go far with that attitude on a forum dedicated to said game... Obvious troll is obvious; but at least your name will be appropriate at this rate. | ||
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UbiNax
Denmark381 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:40 I_Love_Bacon wrote: You'll go far with that attitude on a forum dedicated to said game... Obvious troll is obvious; but at least your name will be appropriate at this rate. Yeah get out NukeGoesKABOOM..... | ||
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Foxhawk
United States41 Posts
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EvilTeletubby
Baltimore, USA22261 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:07 iCCup.Raelcun wrote: Responses like this are EXACTLY what I'm talking about I'm coming from 2 years on iCCup and 3 seasons on PGTour as my listed experience in this matter. This is much much easier said than done especially when the players have already talked about and argued about it so that you're being pressured even more to make hte "right" decision. Reinforcing what Raelcun just said to be true. I was the ref in this game. To be up front, I'm absolutely not the most well versed player on SC2 game flow. While I can confidently say I'd be able to make an accurate judgement call in BW 99+% of the time, I'm definitely not that confident that I could make a similar call in SC2. So why would they allow me to ref a game if that's the case? To be honest, we were simply very short on available staff members and I had nothing going on today. I didn't even think I was going to be needed, but I was sitting in the channel at 2pm, they realized they needed another person, and I raised my hand to keep the tournament moving. So, fast forward to the end of the first game #3. The drop screen pops up and counts down, both Slush and myself even left it up for another full minute or two just incase, but ultimately, yeah, Artosis had dropped. While the drop screen was up, I surveyed the situation asap - Artosis was up about 35 supply (both were still over 100), up a couple bases (although some weren't online with workers just yet), and had a better upgraded army. Slush still had standing units, and had 3k minerals in the bank. No one anywhere could dispute Artosis was ahead, but was it enough to award Artosis the win, and deny Slush his chance to comeback? I didn't know. Second opinions were necessary, and several staff and veteran members quickly surveyed the situation and reviewed the replay. Keep in mind we had the pressure of a live cast going on with nothing casting at the moment; Not an excuse but a reality. From the people there at the time, no one felt 100% confident that it was IMPOSSIBLE for Slush to come back. Incredibly unlikely, but we were not absolutely certain. Given the information we had right then, in the middle of a live cast, we made what we thought was the best, most fair option at the time. Something I will gladly defend and justify, even if it ultimately turned out to be incorrect. Keep in mind our #1 concern is to maintain fairness as much as possible for all players involved. In a situation like this, NO MATTER WHAT DECISION WE MAKE, someone will be unhappy(Go see the MSL finals if you don't know what I'm talking about). It's a bad situation for everyone to be in. Immediately after the game, Slush felt as if he still had a chance, even if a small one, to win. We had to examine that chance and at the time we felt that Artosis's advantage wasn't overwhelming enough to deny Slush that chance. A re-game was the fairest option. As some of you saw in the chat logs and game chat, Artosis was definitely not happy with the decision, and reacted less than professionally, something that belies his ability and true character. For what it's worth, Artosis has already apologized to me personally for the way he acted after we informed him of the decision. Did he react excessively? Yes, most definitely. Do I blame him? No, not at all. I thought he had every right to be upset given the circumstances. The only thing we can do now is learn from the experience and move forward. Better preperation could have definitely helped. Having more experts readily available to weigh in would have helped. Having more time to review the game and explore all possible scenarios could have helped. But we didn't have those this time around. We will next time, we owe that much to our players and to our spectators. You guys are the best, and I appreciate the understanding and level-headedness that most people have shown during this. | ||
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Eury
Sweden1126 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:25 UbiNax wrote: + Show Spoiler + On May 09 2010 12:21 Eury wrote: If you are not going to discuss it then I suggest you stop posting about it. Oh as i said in my post " im not gonna discuss it with (you) " i will discuss it with anyone else because they clearly see that it was a 100% win which you dont. The end. You don't seem to understand what 100% means. That would mean that it was theoretical impossible for Slush to win, which just isn't the case. That would mean that even if you played the game trillion after trillion of times, Slush would never ever win the match. I have seen bigger comebacks than that in Starcraft before, and there have been way less than a trillion games played in the history of Starcraft.. | ||
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SuperXlax
United States197 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:39 NukeGoesKABOOM wrote: Can you people just shut up about Slush being BM or whatever? He didn't disconnect there's nothing BM about playing a rematch when the other guy's computer fucks up. Oh boy the post count response, good manner TL. It wasn't so much as a "post count response" it's more like "I would like you to never post again". | ||
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NukeGoesKABOOM
United States5 Posts
[B]On May 09 2010 12:41 Eury wrote: You don't seem to understand what 100% means. That would mean that it was theoretical impossible for Slush to win, which just isn't the case. Whoa an intelligent post about the debacle, didn't think I'd see one of those. PS saying something you don't agree with aint trolling (aint directed at you Eury). [B]On May 09 2010 12:44 I_Love_Bacon wrote: I'm not sure why you're arguing this point. TL.net concedes that it was 100% win for Artosis and there are maybe.... 2 people on this website at the moment who have agreed with your stance? Argumentum ad populum. TL is only doing this to appease the masses. | ||
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I_Love_Bacon
United States5765 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:41 Eury wrote: You don't seem to understand what 100% means. That would mean that it was theoretical impossible for Slush to win, which just isn't the case. That would mean that even if you played the game trillion after trillion of times, Slush would never ever win the match. I have seen bigger comebacks than that in Starcraft before, and there have been way less than a trillion games played in the history of Starcraft.. Replays of said game please. I'm not sure why you're arguing this point. TL.net concedes that it was 100% win for Artosis and there are maybe.... 2 people on this website at the moment who have agreed with your stance? | ||
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Jyvblamo
Canada13788 Posts
It would be an interesting exercise to see if anyone can come back from Slush's position vs roughly equally skilled opposition. | ||
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XtrEEmMaShEEN3k2
United States122 Posts
I personally think the first thing to do to clear up ALMOST ALL misunderstandings like this is to make it clear what the rules actually are regarding situations like this, and put it in writing in a link that everyone can see. If these written rules existed, most of this debacle could have been entirely avoided. A LOT of this debate occurred over what the rules regarding situations like this actually were, and no one could really prove the other was wrong because I don't think these written rules exist. And as a result, people just gave their subjective opinions on what should occur in a situation like this because no objective procedure had been established. | ||
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JassyP
United States10 Posts
No one is contesting that fact...whenever money is involved people get serious. Its not just a video game, its his(and my) number one hobby/pasttime for years and anyone, not just Artosis would get angry when they felt cheated out of a win. All im saying is that maybe alittle understanding is what is needed to mend this bad situation. | ||
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nath
United States1788 Posts
On May 09 2010 12:41 Eury wrote: You don't seem to understand what 100% means. That would mean that it was theoretical impossible for Slush to win, which just isn't the case. That would mean that even if you played the game trillion after trillion of times, Slush would never ever win the match. I have seen bigger comebacks than that in Starcraft before, and there have been way less than a trillion games played in the history of Starcraft.. This isnt a mathematics lecture. Leave the technicalities and semantics at the door please. Practically speaking, Artosis had the game won, 100%. If the game was played trillions of times, slush might have won a few. If the game was played a million times, he probably would not have. Have you even seen the replay? There haven't been many (if any) comebacks from a position as bad as that which Slush found himself in... | ||
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