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On August 29 2017 23:43 Jank wrote:
Where's the best place to obtain a good amount of replays (on ladder maps preferably) or free to view vods (Any good terran streamers who leave their vods viewable without subscription?). I'm an old mediocre terran (17 times masters lol) but I haven't really played since half way through hots, need a way to study builds/catch up on the meta. Any recommendations on builds/styles to copy (preferably not mech...) and what are the cheeses of the day that I need to watch out for? Just started coming back to the game and I'm sick of being stuck in diamond after being masters my entire sc2 "career" x.x
Id watch GSL Super Tournament, Download the Shanghai replays (IEM), and watch GSL Season 3 and Season 2. Additionally there are some good games in the ballistix cup that rapid casts
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On August 29 2017 23:15 pvsnp wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2017 22:28 LoneYoShi wrote:
Actually TvZ is the matchup with which I struggle most as well. I'm not making it any easier on myself by playing with outdated builds (good ol' 16 marines stim double drop) but I'm actually too lazy to learn new builds. Also, I don't like mech at all, so I appreciate this build going straight into a metric-ton of bio. Basically I just use TvZ as a mechanics training, working on my macro and multitasking. Zergs tend to sit back and not harrass you as much as T's or P's, so it's a good matchup to practice offensive multitask since you don't really have to defend much... Just focus on production and harrass, until you either lose too much and he counters and you die, or you slow him enough so you can regroup and go for the kill. Poke continuously everywhere, there are always weakspots, and if he splits his units to defend everywhere, regroup and go kill a base. This does mean you need to have map control though, and limit creep as much as possible.
Sometimes I manage to overpower the zergs in the midgame like that, by doing more than them at more places (I always feel proud when I manage to kill the 4th with a drop, while doom dropping their main and having a liberator wrecking havok at their nat or third), sometimes I also get wins by defending badly executed all-ins. Most of the time though, I lose. Ling bane hydra hits hard... But at my humble level (dia2 now), macro-ing well (no mineral spike when fighting/dropping, constant production, no supply blocks, not forgetting upgrades, etc) + some limited multitasking is enough to keep me in the game.
Obviously if I lose two dropships for little gain during the early/mid-game, I know it's over, but hey, it teaches me to be more careful/aware. It sounds like you're still playing old-school aggressive 4M against the new Hydra/Ling/Bane meta. That being the case, I'm not surprised you're losing most of your games since LBH is specifically designed to stop that sort of thing. Even at the pro level it's pretty rare for the Terran to just drop/parade push their way to victory against LBH. These days most people are going for a big Bio-Tank timing that hits right before the Ultralisk transition. Alternatively, I have seen pros try 4M in a less committed eco-heavy style by going up to 80+ SCVs and continuously trading. It almost always ends in the lategame though, so unless your name is INnoVation or TY I wouldn't recommend trying it.
Yep, that's exactly what I'm still doing. I really, really love(d ?) that style: parade-pushing, constant aggression, producing 10+ marines per cycle, etc. But yeah, now that my MMR caught up, I'm kinda hitting a brick wall...
I'm starting to experiment to adapt my builds/playstyle. I'm still opening with the 16 marine drop, but I switched from producing mines to tanks. I have only played a few TvZ with that change, not very successful so far. I don't think one factory is enough, I have to get more tanks quicker, so I'll add a second factory, to give more strength to my pushes... But that also means going from constant aggression/trading to a few timing pushes...
Well, I guess eventually I'll find a build and playstyle that I like and that (kinda) work ! ^^
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Simple question, though not really a "help me" one, why don't pros shift-click their scvs back to the mineral lines after ordering a building? I understand it takes time and it's not necessary for the scvs on depot building duty, but I see terran pros on stream with 3+ iddle scvs and it just makes my head hurt.
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On September 03 2017 01:10 VengefulTree wrote:
Simple question, though not really a "help me" one, why don't pros shift-click their scvs back to the mineral lines after ordering a building? I understand it takes time and it's not necessary for the scvs on depot building duty, but I see terran pros on stream with 3+ iddle scvs and it just makes my head hurt.
For depots, its because they want those to be dedicated scv's for buildings it is sometimes so they have the option to throw down another building right away. Mostly Depot scv's you always want 2 scv's building 2 depots at a time till you're at the max of 200
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On August 30 2017 19:22 LoneYoShi wrote:Show nested quote +On August 29 2017 23:15 pvsnp wrote:On August 29 2017 22:28 LoneYoShi wrote:
Actually TvZ is the matchup with which I struggle most as well. I'm not making it any easier on myself by playing with outdated builds (good ol' 16 marines stim double drop) but I'm actually too lazy to learn new builds. Also, I don't like mech at all, so I appreciate this build going straight into a metric-ton of bio. Basically I just use TvZ as a mechanics training, working on my macro and multitasking. Zergs tend to sit back and not harrass you as much as T's or P's, so it's a good matchup to practice offensive multitask since you don't really have to defend much... Just focus on production and harrass, until you either lose too much and he counters and you die, or you slow him enough so you can regroup and go for the kill. Poke continuously everywhere, there are always weakspots, and if he splits his units to defend everywhere, regroup and go kill a base. This does mean you need to have map control though, and limit creep as much as possible.
Sometimes I manage to overpower the zergs in the midgame like that, by doing more than them at more places (I always feel proud when I manage to kill the 4th with a drop, while doom dropping their main and having a liberator wrecking havok at their nat or third), sometimes I also get wins by defending badly executed all-ins. Most of the time though, I lose. Ling bane hydra hits hard... But at my humble level (dia2 now), macro-ing well (no mineral spike when fighting/dropping, constant production, no supply blocks, not forgetting upgrades, etc) + some limited multitasking is enough to keep me in the game.
Obviously if I lose two dropships for little gain during the early/mid-game, I know it's over, but hey, it teaches me to be more careful/aware. It sounds like you're still playing old-school aggressive 4M against the new Hydra/Ling/Bane meta. That being the case, I'm not surprised you're losing most of your games since LBH is specifically designed to stop that sort of thing. Even at the pro level it's pretty rare for the Terran to just drop/parade push their way to victory against LBH. These days most people are going for a big Bio-Tank timing that hits right before the Ultralisk transition. Alternatively, I have seen pros try 4M in a less committed eco-heavy style by going up to 80+ SCVs and continuously trading. It almost always ends in the lategame though, so unless your name is INnoVation or TY I wouldn't recommend trying it. Yep, that's exactly what I'm still doing. I really, really love(d ?) that style: parade-pushing, constant aggression, producing 10+ marines per cycle, etc. But yeah, now that my MMR caught up, I'm kinda hitting a brick wall... I'm starting to experiment to adapt my builds/playstyle. I'm still opening with the 16 marine drop, but I switched from producing mines to tanks. I have only played a few TvZ with that change, not very successful so far. I don't think one factory is enough, I have to get more tanks quicker, so I'll add a second factory, to give more strength to my pushes... But that also means going from constant aggression/trading to a few timing pushes... Well, I guess eventually I'll find a build and playstyle that I like and that (kinda) work ! ^^
Alright, after some playing around I do find more success with tanks. Basically my plan now is: open with the "16 marines double drop with stim" build. Use marines and medivacs to limit creep as much as possible, try to snipe a queen here and there, some lings, etc. Generally, get map control. Poke constantly everywhere, but don't fight and lose as little units as possible. Meanwhile, at home, work on upgrades and getting a healthy tank count.
Once at ~7-8 tanks and at least 2-2 on my bio, regroup and do a frontal assault. If the first part of the plan went well, there is not much creep spread and I have map control, so often times the zerg doesn't even see me set up close to his 4th. Then inch forward until killing the 4th/his army/both. Proceed to win the game.
Problem: if my harrass fails to do damage and slow the zerg down, he has a Hive by the time of my push. And at that time, I'm still almost exclusively on marine-tanks-medivacs with reactors on my barracks, 1 starport and one factory. It's a really strong timing, but it leaves me not prepared to deal with Hive tech (no libs, no marauders). If the Z sacrifices his 4th, I generally retreat, add 1 factory, 2 starports and switch a few racks from reactors to tech labs. But that's kinda too late for my liking... I still have to work on refining this switch.
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Is there anyway to play bio vs mech in TvT and win? Is it viable at all?
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On September 05 2017 18:06 Jan1997 wrote:
Is there anyway to play bio vs mech in TvT and win? Is it viable at all?
I don't think pure bio can work, but you can make bio-mech (some tanks) work. It's not easy, can be quite frustrating, but it can work.
If you can't finish your opponent in the midgame tho, you have to switch to air at some point when your opponent gets a certain amount of tanks, or else he'll just leapfrog forward and you'll have no way of stopping him.
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there are a lot of things a bio terran can do vs mech.
i dont get why bio terrans always feel like they have to all in a mech terran. Just think about what the actual advantage of playing mech is.
A mech terran has the advantage of having a lot of tanks with upgrades,... and what else ? Hellbat drops ?
If you're playing bio and you face mech, you just add some additional techlabs for marauders and get your own tanks and then you can have a game.
You have the mobility advantage, you can always try to get drops in etc... Just make sure to get some sensor tower to not get suprised by a push, be aggressive and keep mapcontrol and if you end up being ahead you can even switch into mass air and finish him with liberators.
Also playing early aggression can pay off, since mech needs some time to get the production up-
Well timed pushes on the mech players 3rd can often already decide the game.
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On September 05 2017 23:40 Siegetank_Dieter1 wrote:
i dont get why bio terrans always feel like they have to all in a mech terran. Just think about what the actual advantage of playing mech is.
Nobody here said all-ins are a necessity when facing a mech player.
On September 05 2017 23:40 Siegetank_Dieter1 wrote:
A mech terran has the advantage of having a lot of tanks with upgrades,... and what else ? Hellbat drops ?
Having more tanks is not an advantage, it's a fact. Advantages would be: more fire power, ability to hold an entrenched position against a superior ground force, air control, etc.
On September 05 2017 23:40 Siegetank_Dieter1 wrote:
If you're playing bio and you face mech, you just add some additional techlabs for marauders and get your own tanks and then you can have a game.
You have the mobility advantage, you can always try to get drops in etc... Just make sure to get some sensor tower to not get suprised by a push, be aggressive and keep mapcontrol and if you end up being ahead you can even switch into mass air and finish him with liberators.
Yep, here we agree :-) (it's what I said in my posts above).
On September 05 2017 23:40 Siegetank_Dieter1 wrote:
Also playing early aggression can pay off, since mech needs some time to get the production up-
Well timed pushes on the mech players 3rd can often already decide the game.
Bio also needs some time to set up (time to get stim, combat shield, upgrades and production).
Judging from my experience as a bio player, I have gotten very little success by trying to end the game with a frontal push on the third (but I'm only a diamond player...). I manage to delay the 3rd and get ahead this way, but in the few games where I actually attacked into the mech player, I always got rebooted (giving the mech player the ability to take his 4th) unless he makes a huge positionning mistake.
Edit: spelling and stuff. I can't write English anymore :-/
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Hi guys, once there was a page, where i could see all relevant timings for the different races. (3:00 Stargate starts etc.) Is something like this still out there ? Or have we to start this ?
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On September 25 2017 00:40 wand.mp3 wrote:
Hi guys, once there was a page, where i could see all relevant timings for the different races. (3:00 Stargate starts etc.) Is something like this still out there ? Or have we to start this ?
Something like that is there on the first page idk if there is many updated timings etc
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How in the world do you defend TvP immortal proxy? I cant defend it even if I scout it :D
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On October 02 2017 19:47 Ihmemies wrote:
How in the world do you defend TvP immortal proxy? I cant defend it even if I scout it :D
Assuming you know it's proxy robo, need to get a viking asap for the warp prism and tanks so he can't walk up your ramp.
Bunker near your production is nice too.
I usually get one mine first to place where the WP might come in. Combined with the marines or a viking shot, it can outright end the game.
If he still manages to get units in your main, hopefully you got a 2nd tank out by then to defend both your production and mineral line, though you absolutely need to surround them with repairing scvs if he gets too close
edit : conveniently just played vs this, went pretty well http://ggtracker.com/matches/7194857
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Thanks for the replay and advices. I think immortal proxy is way too easy to perform compared to how hard is it to defense -_-
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On October 02 2017 21:09 ArtyK wrote:Show nested quote +On October 02 2017 19:47 Ihmemies wrote:
How in the world do you defend TvP immortal proxy? I cant defend it even if I scout it :D Assuming you know it's proxy robo, need to get a viking asap for the warp prism and tanks so he can't walk up your ramp. Bunker near your production is nice too. I usually get one mine first to place where the WP might come in. Combined with the marines or a viking shot, it can outright end the game. If he still manages to get units in your main, hopefully you got a 2nd tank out by then to defend both your production and mineral line, though you absolutely need to surround them with repairing scvs if he gets too close edit : conveniently just played vs this, went pretty well http://ggtracker.com/matches/7194857
Nice! You held it very well. Thank you for the replay. I used to hold it making 1 or 2 vikings, liberator, mines and turrets. You did it better.
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If I scout that the Protoss goes 2 gas 1 base in TvP and I open standard gas first, what is the best response? I assume he will pylon rush into proxy stargate. Should I go marine and get a factory instantly and tech up? Make a cc anyway? Reaper? Reactor? Add more raxes? Maybe get a widow mine and cyclone and then cc?
Generally is it better to tech up 1-1-1 vs Protoss 1 base allins or go mass marines like 3 rax before tech?
Thanks. Master1 btw I am just clueless vs Protoss.
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I have a question about macro: how can you guys know when is the right choice to expand the third or play 2 bases only?
Do you have some text about that kind of choices? I have so many questions.
Ty!
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On October 07 2017 03:08 Aquila- wrote:
If I scout that the Protoss goes 2 gas 1 base in TvP and I open standard gas first, what is the best response? I assume he will pylon rush into proxy stargate. Should I go marine and get a factory instantly and tech up? Make a cc anyway? Reaper? Reactor? Add more raxes? Maybe get a widow mine and cyclone and then cc?
Generally is it better to tech up 1-1-1 vs Protoss 1 base allins or go mass marines like 3 rax before tech?
Thanks. Master1 btw I am just clueless vs Protoss.
I personally prefer staying on 1 base and going marine cyclone with some kind of starport support depending on what they're doing as Terran can always lift their CC if the game drags out, and marine cyclone + air support makes for a very strong counter push to expand behind if you hold the attack.
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On October 07 2017 03:08 Aquila- wrote:
If I scout that the Protoss goes 2 gas 1 base in TvP and I open standard gas first, what is the best response? I assume he will pylon rush into proxy stargate. Should I go marine and get a factory instantly and tech up? Make a cc anyway? Reaper? Reactor? Add more raxes? Maybe get a widow mine and cyclone and then cc?
Generally is it better to tech up 1-1-1 vs Protoss 1 base allins or go mass marines like 3 rax before tech?
Thanks. Master1 btw I am just clueless vs Protoss.
it depends on what you have already done, but if you went gas first reaper expand into factory, just make cyclone and ebay right away. you need a turret finished by 3:30 and a cyclone will help deal with pylons or adepts.
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EPT
