EPT[G] SC2 Notes: 3-Base Blink Attack PvZ - Page 2
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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OPDream
Canada77 Posts
The core idea of recall strat works like this"protoss move out with some units and MSC with recall available, zerg better be ready, cus if you don't have enough, I will kill you". Simply forcing some units from zerg is good but not good enough. | ||
Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
On July 11 2014 01:34 OPDream wrote: An ancient build. Also there is not enough pressure on Zerg in the early game. Would be a much better build if Nony's TRIPLE recall strat can be used in this BO. This build is probably the last to be developed in hots, after the stargate/fast third builds that go into either colo or void ray/templar. It really isn't "ancient", and in fact Classic used it to great effect in the last GSL finals for example... | ||
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OPDream
Canada77 Posts
Besides that, the build in OP is not stargate into fast 3rd. It is some kind of gateway units into 3rd with a little pressure with MSC recall ability. It's kinda similar to the WOL FFE 4gate pressure while taking 3rd base and teching to blink and +2 attack. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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OPDream
Canada77 Posts
Like I said, there is no "WHENEVER". Nony's recall build can move out after first recall immediately because 1. first recall happens around 8 min, it's close enough to 9min to move out again safely. 2. he constantly makes units from gates, which means he has enough units to make sure he is safe on the map, and is able to do a lot of damage if zerg don't have enough.That's why his timings are powerful. If you are good enough, you can notice pros only move out to do a TIMING attack. It's quite clearly why they don't blindly move out besides some obvious reasons like it's risky, they don't wanna waste msc's energy for some potential small damage (clearing creep), they aim for bigger damage. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Xinzoe
Korea (South)2373 Posts
And also the build mentions that you take third at 8:30. Most Zergs that opened gasless should be saturated or close to saturated on 3 bases so technically u arent really "forcing" units besides the fact that they probably wanted to spend the gas on hydras or mutas instead. But its not like u forced useless units. Roach ling compliments hydras very well, with mutas u can do double prong attacks which is a headache for most toss players that didnt open phoenix | ||
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OPDream
Canada77 Posts
 I think I said quite clearly, they save msc energy to use for a good timing attack. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12248 Posts
"Muaaah my roach/hydra midgame army can't win against colossus/void ray, muaaaah" | ||
EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 11 2014 07:31 Xinzoe wrote: Well I think the reason players dont do recall pokes is because they are afraid they can't hold the counterattack after forcing so many units out of Zerg. I've seen Zergs continue to build units after seeing seeing the toss recall and just crush the third with pure roach ling. And with the current map pool, the third and natural is pretty far like in Catellena and Merry Go Round so it is completely understandable. And also the build mentions that you take third at 8:30. Most Zergs that opened gasless should be saturated or close to saturated on 3 bases so technically u arent really "forcing" units besides the fact that they probably wanted to spend the gas on hydras or mutas instead. But its not like u forced useless units. Roach ling compliments hydras very well, with mutas u can do double prong attacks which is a headache for most toss players that didnt open phoenix Well, technically the poke hits at around 7:00-7:30, which IS before saturation. It technically hits with 4 warp gates, so you still have the potential to do damage, especially if the Zerg decided to open gasless. I honestly think the big difference between this sort of build and the more "Korean" builds that open up stargate and play very passively are that this one is a lot more focused on gateways and gateway units. The scary part of holding the counterattacks is not that you won't have enough units to handle a massive flood of units, but that you won't be able to handle a massive flood of *good* units. That is, if you don't do enough damage or juke your opponent well enough, you'll just straight up die to maxed out roaches or hydra/ling or something of that nature. More often than not, lings are pretty manageable with this build, especially since you're getting such an early +1. EDIT: Also, time warp is just a really good spell. I think OPDream is correct in saying that it's probably better to save your MSC energy for double time warp for a timing over constant recalls simply because it's such an amazing spell. That said, it's likely the reason we don't see these types of plays in professional play and especially in Korean play is that it just doesn't do enough damage, directly or indirectly, to make up for the fact that you have no stargate and your robo tech is quite heavily delayed. Still, for most ladder purposes, I think this is still a great build that allows players to deviate from the more "standard" passive play and play a more aggressive style while still maintaining a clean, solid macro build without any real gimmicks. | ||
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OPDream
Canada77 Posts
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