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On May 19 2013 08:37 Tib wrote:
Help me guys, im using a french azerty keyboard, is it usefull to try The Core ? Or it's just for US keybaord? I saw that there is hotkeys for french keyboard, but it is cool? Someone tried it? Because im top master in EU ladder and im playing with Grid, it is not the best for use control, adn rly hard to use ctrl shift and tab often.
Azerty would be right here.
As for opinions, I'm not one to write a good review, so I'll redirect you to this guy's:
(There's a humorously brief TL;DR if you don't have the time)
On December 22 2012 09:08 sanddbox_sc2 wrote:
I think I've been using TheCore long enough to finally put my two cents in. I didn't want to post until I could put my full endorsement behind TheCore, and now that I'm fully updated it's that magical time. Up until a few days ago I was on a sort of bastardized core (because I made the switch right before several changes were made that I didn't want to learn after going through the process once). Now that I'm playing HOTS, I've updated to the most recent version and been really surprised what an improvement it was over the version I was previously using.
Switching to TheCore:
If you play the game anywhere near a high level switching is going to be very painful for awhile - the first day you'll have trouble with very basic macro, but within a few days you'll find yourself learning the system and finding the hotkeys more natural. Completely learning the hotkey setup takes a lot longer than getting to a level of proficiency; like learning any skill, you'll run into the law of diminishing returns relatively quickly. My experience switching was made pretty painful because of some clan wars/showmatches I had to play in, so make sure you're not playing anything important within 3-4 weeks of switching (a month is really the time it takes to be able to tangibly feel the benefits, even though you'll be playing pretty well within a week).
The best way to switch is to dive right in, and now that TheCore is a lot more fleshed out you don't have to worry about huge, sweeping updates to the system. The hotkey trainers help, although no matter what you'll have to just play a lot of games. Once you're reasonably proficient with the setup, you'll be able to guess what the hotkey is for an upgrade without having ever seen it before; the hotkey setup is just that well-designed. Obviously it'll be a complete shift in terms of hotkeys, however, so don't expect it to be easy, but it's certainly worth it in the end.
Pros/Cons:
TheCore is, to the best of my knowledge, the best and most intelligently designed hotkey setup out there, and although the learning curve is steep it's worth it in the end if you value your mechanics. I actually finally made the switch because of wrist pain (presumably some form of early RSI), and since then pain in my keyboard hand is basically gone; the setup itself is ridiculously more ergonomic than the standard setup.
The only real con besides the learning curve is that playing campaign, custom games, other games, etc obviously don't use TheCore, and it can feel weird having to go back to standard hotkeys at times (although, like anything, once you've learned a hotkey setup you'll never forget it). If you're debating switching and plan to be playing Starcraft for more than a month into the future, make the switch - you won't regret it, although your cortisol levels will rise for about the first week or so.
I'm now basically using the Standard version of the core, minus a few very minute adjustments (the biggest of which being that I don't use the layered inject method; I just hotkey each queen individually still).
TL;DR: gud hotkeys
To be more specific to your case, the location of the thumb over Ctrl and Shift is incredibly useful for endurance. Tab isn't used at all.
Oh, and if you didn't read the OP very much, which seems to be the case, you have to tilt your keyboard about 35 to 40 degrees (clockwise for righty, counterclockwise for lefty) and relocate your hand to the opposite side of the keyboard. Unorthodox, but still very practical.
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JDub thanks a million, use the raw download and everything worked fine. I have indeed been of those who have downloaded incorrectly in the recent past ;-).
Thanks again :-)
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Hey guys,
I'm Kibbelz, some of u may know me as a caster, some as a player, or you may not know me at all. Regardless, I wanted to offer my feedback and thoughts on learning the core.
I came up with a few ways to learn The Core (potentially) way faster
1) Practicing Unit Hotkeys: Using the 'Micro Tester' Arcade map, I created a mini-game to help embed the unit hotkeys into muscle memory. Basically, spawn a ton of Terran Mech AI in the middle of the map. Then, start making waves of units and rallying them in to be killed by the Tanks/Vikings/Thor.
Then, you "begin" the game. Move your camera to where the units will be dying. As units appear on the screen, try to make a few of that unit type. When the next unit type appears, make a few of those. Keep repeating this. Since the units all have different movement speeds, the order of units will randomize and you will constantly be forced to quickly make all different kinds of units. It really helps reinforce the hotkeys for each unit into your mind and muscle memory.
2) Practicing Constructing Buildings & Setting Cameras: For this, I used 'Fastest Map Possible'. There are plenty of variations, so choose whatever feels right for you. The basic concept here, is that your going to gain money really fast, so you can practice expanding, teching, and setting cameras on your bases. I also grilled my larvae injects on the map since I'm Zerg. Remember there is a supply cap on this map, so its not best suited for unit practice.
3) Darglein's Micro Trainer: I found this useful, but not as much as the others. Regardless, the roach test really helped me get attack walk, burrow, and unburrow into my head.
I started learning The Core 4 days ago. On day 1-2 I was losing to most Gold players. Now on Day 4 I am beating most Master's players. PLEASE UNDERSTAND, I admittedly have a lot of experience with changing hotkeys from my own personal layouts, and I think that helped quite a bit. Still, I think a few things I tried REALLY helped accelerate along the learning curve.
If you have other maps to recommend I'd love to hear them! I think a ling bane micro one would be awesome. Hope this ends up being helpful for some of you 
- Andrew 'Kibbelz' Dunne
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Hello! I am currently running ZRS, and I was wondering, when on the control groups section of the spreadsheet it says eg: Mutalisk/Spire, does that mean I should have them both on one hotkey? Or use it for either or? And if you have them on both how do you switch between them with tab key being so far away from my left hand? Thanks - Lolwut
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Anyone else experiencing thumb pain after prolonged use of thecore? My left thumb has been killing me the last few days and it keeps getting worse the more I play. At first I thought it was just sore from being over worked (compared to playing with Standard), but today I was having a hard time grasping things with my left hand and had a shooting pain when I grabbed a glass?
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Fiziks, no hand pain should arise from using the Core properly, especially not thumb pain. The pain in your hand may be from wrong positioning of your hand that puts too much pressure on your wrist; I would advise trying some hand and thumb stretches to see if it helps to alleviate the problem.
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Ok so after playing a game against AI using the core (really hard lol) I had a question. For PRM: is your thumb hitting any other buttons than Alt, Ctrl, and Shift? The warp in advanced structure button is "/". Should I use my index or thumb for that? My guess is thumb because it is also used for casting secondary spells and it would be a bit of a long reach during a battle, but I would just like confirmation.
Also, does anybody put anything to use on the left arrow key to hit with the thumb?
And just a small thing that I changed that I thought might be able to help other protoss players. I changed the hallucinate phoenix button to the same key as hallucinate. That way you can just double-tap hallucinate to make a phoenix to scout with. I did this on my old hotkey setup before too.
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On May 19 2013 15:11 Epishade wrote:
Ok so after playing a game against AI using the core (really hard lol) I had a question. For PRM: is your thumb hitting any other buttons than Alt, Ctrl, and Shift? The warp in advanced structure button is "/". Should I use my index or thumb for that? My guess is thumb because it is also used for casting secondary spells and it would be a bit of a long reach during a battle, but I would just like confirmation.
Also, does anybody put anything to use on the left arrow key to hit with the thumb?
And just a small thing that I changed that I thought might be able to help other protoss players. I changed the hallucinate phoenix button to the same key as hallucinate. That way you can just double-tap hallucinate to make a phoenix to scout with. I did this on my old hotkey setup before too.
Yes, pretty sure you hit / with your thumb (at least I do, I don't see any other comfortable option). I also hit ' with my thumb, even though it is supposed to be hit with the index finger. I find the thumb more comfortable personally. Also maybe the 'enter' key? I think that is on rotate camera now so that may not get a ton of use depending.
I would imagine they are hesitant to use the arrow keys as the positions may vary greatly depending on keyboard. On mine they seem fairly easy to hit though so I'll have to keep that in mind, thanks
Nice trick with the hallu, if I played toss I'd definitely use that.
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Antylamon, thank you, but i would know too how do i choose my control groups for army? Is there a specific control group adapted for everything? Like one for barracks, one for command center etc ... Or there are 10 control groups and we just have to use them all like we wish? Because i would get a shot to The Core, but first i want to be sure of getting the right controls, and the right hotkeys :D. The spreedsheap show every controls for US keyboard, not french azerty :D.
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Hi!
I have just started using The Core. Macro was pretty easy to get used to as it feels very natural. Everything with the thumb, ctrl, shift and alt is still quite hard for me since standard is so deeply rooted.
I have one big question. It says in the OP that the suggested army and harass can be found in the spreadsheet. It also says that it is quite important to use the suggested hotkeys. I find it terribly hard to find them (maybe because it's my first time using a spreadsheet) and have now finally found what I think is the harass hotkeys for ZRM (90å).
Is that so? What is the main army hotkey. Maybe an easier way of finding these out should be added to the OP.
It's hard transitioning but in a week I think I will be back in masters.
Thank you for your work on this.
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On May 19 2013 19:37 Tib wrote:
Antylamon, thank you, but i would know too how do i choose my control groups for army? Is there a specific control group adapted for everything? Like one for barracks, one for command center etc ... Or there are 10 control groups and we just have to use them all like we wish? Because i would get a shot to The Core, but first i want to be sure of getting the right controls, and the right hotkeys :D. The spreedsheap show every controls for US keyboard, not french azerty :D.
Assuming you're using TRM:
CC/Ebay on P
Rax/Fact/Port on O
Full Army on M
Ghosts/Ghost Academy on L
Tanks/Armory on ç
Marine/Marauder on à
Widow Mines/Factory TLab on )
Harass/Starport TLab on ^
Vikings/Rax TLab on =
Harass/Fusion Core on :
Do what you want, though. These are only the suggested CGs. For example, I personally swap O and P because OI for build SCV and PJ for build Marine is personally easier for me over PI and OJ.
On May 19 2013 19:51 MaxViktory wrote:
Hi!
I have just started using The Core. Macro was pretty easy to get used to as it feels very natural. Everything with the thumb, ctrl, shift and alt is still quite hard for me since standard is so deeply rooted.
I have one big question. It says in the OP that the suggested army and harass can be found in the spreadsheet. It also says that it is quite important to use the suggested hotkeys. I find it terribly hard to find them (maybe because it's my first time using a spreadsheet) and have now finally found what I think is the harass hotkeys for ZRM (90å).
Is that so? What is the main army hotkey. Maybe an easier way of finding these out should be added to the OP.
It's hard transitioning but in a week I think I will be back in masters.
Thank you for your work on this.
There is the reference spreadsheet, but unfortunately it doesn't include keyboard layouts other than QWERTY. It would get a lot more cramped than it is already. Although I do know that there could be alternate spreadsheets for other layouts, I don't know if that would be too much to ask for.
Anyways, I need to make sure you know one thing before I list off the suggested CGs for Swedes. There is one special CG which is on the same key as another one. In order to access it, you need to use Ctrl+I to Add to CG, Ctrl+Shift+I to Create CG, and Shift+P to Recall CG.
Hatcheries on P
Injecting Queens on Shift+P
Melee Units and Buildings (Ling/Ultra/Pool/Cavern) on Ö
Ranged Units and Buildings (Roach/Hydra/Warren/Den) on L
Mutas/Spire on 9
BLs/Non-Injecting Queens OR Banes/Nest on 0
Infestors/Pit on +
Vipers/Evo Chambers on Å
Corruptors/Overseers on Ä
Swarm Hosts on `
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Ok THANKS, i'll try like that i think with my top master level, it will take a moment to rly use ths hotkeys as a good level, but i think it will worth it !
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I used the reference spreadsheet but I had a hard time finding what I was supposed to use control groups for. Thank you very much. I think I will be using my Swedish keyboard as if it was an American qwerty keyboard since the canceling of buildings is on "OMLJUD" when I have it on Swedish. No clue what that is.
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On May 19 2013 23:01 MaxViktory wrote:
I used the reference spreadsheet but I had a hard time finding what I was supposed to use control groups for. Thank you very much. I think I will be using my Swedish keyboard as if it was an American qwerty keyboard since the canceling of buildings is on "OMLJUD" when I have it on Swedish. No clue what that is.
Wut
Cancel should be on " for Swedish keyboards. I think SC2 got confused because there's 3 things on that key.
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wow first time I try The Core, it is REALLY HARDCORE I feel I'm bronze ... I think it will take time u_u
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On May 19 2013 08:18 Antylamon wrote:
What happens if I change Shift+CG to Add to CG, Ctrl+Camera to Recall Camera, and keep Ctrl+Shift as Create CG? Are there any conflicts with that?
I feel like I should restate this.
Also, the most significant pro I've seen so far with this switch is consistency and speed with the J and I camera hotkeys. All four bases can be on the home keys without switching from Control to Shift in between. I know the suggested 3rd and 4th base cams are L and Semicolon, but I feel like we can do better. Alternatively, I can keep J and I as Rally Point and Buildings, as I did before, but now the process of constructing buildings is faster. However, having Rally Point on Semicolon is nice for TRM because it shares a key with Army.
I still can't discern any cons besides the transition phase.
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On May 19 2013 11:20 TCPLolwut wrote:
Hello! I am currently running ZRS, and I was wondering, when on the control groups section of the spreadsheet it says eg: Mutalisk/Spire, does that mean I should have them both on one hotkey? Or use it for either or? And if you have them on both how do you switch between them with tab key being so far away from my left hand? Thanks - Lolwut
Sorry for taking so long; I missed your post.
That's an and/or situation. Do it if you feel comfortable with it. I would suggest taking the time to try to get used to binding upgrade structures on the same keys as some units, but whatever you want to do is fine. Spires can't attack, so it doesn't really matter if you're selecting them with Mutas. You can only upgrade with them if you tab to them.
Speaking of tab, the Next Subgroup command is NOT on tab in TheCore. It is on the forward side mouse button by default. I would suggest rebinding it to Enter if you do not have a mouse with side buttons.
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On May 20 2013 02:49 Antylamon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 19 2013 08:18 Antylamon wrote:
What happens if I change Shift+CG to Add to CG, Ctrl+Camera to Recall Camera, and keep Ctrl+Shift as Create CG? Are there any conflicts with that? I feel like I should restate this. Also, the most significant pro I've seen so far with this switch is consistency and speed with the J and I camera hotkeys. All four bases can be on the home keys without switching from Control to Shift in between. I know the suggested 3rd and 4th base cams are L and Semicolon, but I feel like we can do better. Alternatively, I can keep J and I as Rally Point and Buildings, as I did before, but now the process of constructing buildings is faster. However, having Rally Point on Semicolon is nice for TRM because it shares a key with Army. I still can't discern any cons besides the transition phase.
So I take it you're using TRM? And you're talking about recalling base cams with ctrl+key instead of shift+key? And you're leaving the freecams as they currently are?
I dunno if it causes and problems with T and P, but for Zerg you definitely want your basecams on shift because of injects.
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On May 20 2013 03:49 Borskey wrote:Show nested quote +On May 20 2013 02:49 Antylamon wrote:On May 19 2013 08:18 Antylamon wrote:
What happens if I change Shift+CG to Add to CG, Ctrl+Camera to Recall Camera, and keep Ctrl+Shift as Create CG? Are there any conflicts with that? I feel like I should restate this. Also, the most significant pro I've seen so far with this switch is consistency and speed with the J and I camera hotkeys. All four bases can be on the home keys without switching from Control to Shift in between. I know the suggested 3rd and 4th base cams are L and Semicolon, but I feel like we can do better. Alternatively, I can keep J and I as Rally Point and Buildings, as I did before, but now the process of constructing buildings is faster. However, having Rally Point on Semicolon is nice for TRM because it shares a key with Army. I still can't discern any cons besides the transition phase. So I take it you're using TRM? And you're talking about recalling base cams with ctrl+key instead of shift+key? I dunno if it causes and problems with T and P, but for Zerg you definitely want your basecams on shift because of injects.
Yes to both questions. I answered the latter in my self-quote.
I am using this as a personal change. The primary reason I posted it here is to find out exactly what I'm losing and what I'm gaining.
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EPT
