EPTGlad I switched to TheCore+
I'll test it personally when I have the chance.
[G] TheCore - Advanced Keyboard Layout - Page 102
| Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy |
|
JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
Glad I switched to TheCore+ I'll test it personally when I have the chance. | ||
|
TheAngryZergling
United States387 Posts
| ||
|
Kwodahn
Costa Rica11 Posts
On June 03 2012 06:50 JaKaTaK wrote: 10. My Ctrl+Shift+0 doesn't work. How do I fix this? + Show Spoiler + This is a windows problem, not a SC2 problem. Look here for the way to fix it: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/967893 I have the same problem in Windows 8, but is not the same solution... Can you help me? | ||
|
rolando
United States82 Posts
| ||
|
jesseclaytonjames
20 Posts
you also didn't think about keyboards very much, steelseries keyboards have a smaller shift key, and the "?" and "\" keys are swapped. i understand you put a lot of effort into this, but if someone is willing to "learn something new" they might as well just edit a few of the standard hotkeys. there is a reason the best players still play with most of the defaults. also having your left hand on the right side of the keyboard causes you to have to slide keyboard to the left for your left hand to be comfortable, which in turn makes typing a sentence or anything for that matter a ridiculously uncomfortable affair, having to reach over to the left with your right hand to find home row, or having to slide the keyboard back forth anytime you want to type. | ||
|
Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
I could calculate the time spent reaching for keys in a 20 minute game with standard, if you want me to. It's probably at least 10 minutes. Think about it: the only inhibiting factors of APM are the player's time between keystrokes, clicking speed, mouse speed, and the delay between keystrokes and clicking, which is infinitesimally small. Pro players are generally incredibly speedy with the mouse, as evidenced by their amazing micro, so time between keystrokes makes up the majority of the game. For example, camera keys are so much closer to the home keys on TheCore. Camera keys are usually on the function (f1, f2, etc.) keys, as you probably know, and it's invaluable to things such as injects, chrono, MULEs, and worker maynarding when used on CCs/Nexi/Hatches. You can also use it for rally points, which is an amazing time saver. Now take one of your fingers of of ASDF and estimate how many times you can move your index finger to f4 and back in one second. I got 3 (I think the maximum times humanly possible would be 5 or 6). That means if you use camera keys just 15 times, you waste 5 seconds. Now try the same thing with the f (letter) key. Way easier. That's the kind of benefit you see commonly in TheCore. Your estimate of 5 seconds wasted from reaching keys is... painful, I'm sorry to admit. The highest wpm ever recorded was 216 wpm. One word is any 5 keystrokes in standard calculation methods, so that's 18 keystrokes every second, or 1/18 of a second for each keystroke. If there are 1000 keystrokes in a given game, then that is a minute of reaching for keys. The time required to push a key down far enough to register as a keystroke is minimal for someone that fast. Even so, the fastest wpm average over a reasonably long amount of time is 170 wpm, which comes out to 71 seconds wasted. Even so, I doubt any pro player is that fast, because 300 apm includes way more clicks than keystrokes. And 1000 keystrokes is low. Also, if Grid is so undeniably better than Standard, why isn't a calculation-heavy layout which has been in production for about half a year undeniably better? Sandbox from Infinity Seven uses TheCore and praises it too, so your pro player argument isn't valid. High-caliber pros are too used to Standard/Grid/their personalized layout to switch to TheCore. That's the only con of TheCore: it takes a while to switch. Even so, it doesn't take long, and the benefits are huge. Many people don't seem to recognize it and just ignore TheCore because they think it would take too much time/effort to switch. | ||
|
JDub
United States976 Posts
On November 30 2012 11:56 jesseclaytonjames wrote: is this a joke? the total amount of "time spent reaching" during one game, it maybe adds up to like 5 seconds at the most. and thats with unmodified hotkeys. just a simple modification of the standard layout like switching immortal hotkey and patrol hotkey is just as effective as "TEH CORE" there is a reason professional players haven't started using this system, it's because it sucks. might as well just use grid hotkeys if you don't want to move your hand half an inch... you also didn't think about keyboards very much, steelseries keyboards have a smaller shift key, and the "?" and "\" keys are swapped. i understand you put a lot of effort into this, but if someone is willing to "learn something new" they might as well just edit a few of the standard hotkeys. there is a reason the best players still play with most of the defaults. also having your left hand on the right side of the keyboard causes you to have to slide keyboard to the left for your left hand to be comfortable, which in turn makes typing a sentence or anything for that matter a ridiculously uncomfortable affair, having to reach over to the left with your right hand to find home row, or having to slide the keyboard back forth anytime you want to type. Actually, the reason pro players don't use this is because hotkey customization came out a fair amount after the release, most pro players were playing for a long time before making something like TheCore was even possible, and re-training their muscle memory from thousands of hours of practice isn't worth it (or at least, from their POV it doesn't seem worth it) for the improvements TheCore offers over less optimal layouts. Moreover, it's just one layout made by "some guy on TL" from their perspective, I'm sure if Jak got a big name to support TheCore you'd see tons more pros picking it up. Your post basically consists of: 1) being rude (posting "is this a joke?" on page 102 of a well-thought out, highly detailed thread is the real joke.) 2) pulling numbers out of your ass 3) making shit up 4) an actual argument about it not working for some keyboards (which Jak has already acknowledged is an issue). 5) a silly argument about typing in-game, which has been brought up a gazillion times in this thread already 4 and 5 are the only semi-worthwhile parts of your post. The keyboard issue is a real issue. Some keyboards work better with TheCore than others, and some keyboard (like laptop keyboards) flat out won't work. As far as typing goes, with a standard layout you have to move your hand off your mouse anyway, with TheCore you have to move both your hands (although you can press Enter before moving your hands), and besides, typing is not important if you are focusing on 1v1 (the only things I type in a typical game are "gl hf" and "gg"). It does make it harder to bm your opponent in the middle of a game though, that's for sure. | ||
|
JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
iEchoic uses a modified version of TheCore (he admits TheCore is probably better but is experimenting with different ideas) iSandbox uses TheCore. There will be more pro players using TheCore in the future. It's just a matter of time at this point. | ||
|
BjoernK
194 Posts
As explained by the author and as to be expected I feel kind of overwhelmed with the new design. What I think would greatly help to overcome inital frustration is a small image-file with a keyboard printed on it and on the keys the general functions "camera, control group, action, ability,...". Like that one could print out the image file and glue it on the bottom of the monitor. Is there something like that already around? | ||
|
JaKaTaKSc2
United States2787 Posts
 | ||
|
esToDo
United States14 Posts
On December 02 2012 04:22 BjoernK wrote: Hi everyone, first of all thanks for getting this keyboard-profile done. The theory behind it sounds very well thought out. I am just trying it out and did a couple of custom games vs ai. As explained by the author and as to be expected I feel kind of overwhelmed with the new design. What I think would greatly help to overcome inital frustration is a small image-file with a keyboard printed on it and on the keys the general functions "camera, control group, action, ability,...". Like that one could print out the image file and glue it on the bottom of the monitor. Is there something like that already around? here's the one deetox made which i really like. http://i.imgur.com/8nxix.jpg depending on what version you're using, some things may vary. regardless, this image will help get you familiarized with thecore. also, in regards to my personal edit of thecore, i think i'll finally be able to move stuff back to the N and M keys now that my pinky is nearly fully healed. :D | ||
|
BjoernK
194 Posts
| ||
|
AfricanPsycho
South Africa158 Posts
| ||
|
bourkes
Australia9 Posts
I use the RRMM version at around plat level as a random player, diamond as toss. my first issue was my hand moving around and i would hit the wrong keys and mess everything up, to solve this i carved lines on the jip and , keys so i always get my hand to the home position and correctly press , key when i need to. T he 2nd issue i had was with zerg lava and drone both on "i". I changed lava to "-" and overlord to "," to solve this one so there wont be any more drones instead of unit :D The last issue is worker on "i", which isn't bad, but i have been having trouble building units, mainly zealot/stalker, marine/marudder and viking/medivac, I have been thinking about swapping them around to see if that helps but at this point I think will will leave it for another few weeks to see if i adjust. other then that i must say this hotkey layout is amazing, even if i haven't got back to where i was yet i know that this will help me improve my army control and multitasking to a level that wouldn't be possible on standard hotkeys! 10/10 great job guy | ||
|
SPARTAN-001
United States10 Posts
On November 30 2012 09:03 Kwodahn wrote: I have the same problem in Windows 8, but is not the same solution... Can you help me? I've run into this same problem running Windows 8 as well. I may have to poke around in the registry to find where it's bound, because I can't find out how to unbind it in Windows thus far. | ||
|
Kwodahn
Costa Rica11 Posts
On December 04 2012 21:16 SPARTAN-001 wrote: I've run into this same problem running Windows 8 as well. I may have to poke around in the registry to find where it's bound, because I can't find out how to unbind it in Windows thus far. I got the solution... Follow this steps: 1. Go to Control Panel. 2. Click Clock, Languaje, and Region Options. 3. Click Change input methods 4. In the left side click Advanced settings 5. Click Change languaje bar hot keys, and select Between input languages. 6. Click Change Key Sequence. 7. For Switch Keyboard Layout, select Not Assigned. 8. Click OK to close each dialog box. | ||
|
AfricanPsycho
South Africa158 Posts
| ||
|
slowbacontron
United States7722 Posts
On December 02 2012 21:35 AfricanPsycho wrote: Hey man really like this idea, had a look at a couple of your vids and subscribed to your channel, keep it up! Just wanna ask, will you be making a core layout for hots? Also, what is the actually key differences between small, medium and large, can't seem to find info on that. On December 05 2012 18:36 AfricanPsycho wrote: what is the core+ ? TheCore is indeed being developed for HotS alongside WoL. The small, medium, and large layouts are all the same, except shifted by 1 key to the left or right. And finally, TheCore+ is a version of TheCore in which manual edits to the actual game's hotkey files are made, which brings further benefits if done correctly, but is a little dangerous if not. I believe a user of the regular Core can edit hotkeys within the game's UI, while TheCore+ cannot? Something like that. | ||
|
Antylamon
United States1981 Posts
On December 05 2012 18:58 slowbacontron wrote: I believe a user of the regular Core can edit hotkeys within the game's UI, while TheCore+ cannot? Something like that. Exactly. Due to the game not normally allowing some of the text-edited keybinds, whenever you edit anything in the ingame hotkey editor, it realizes that you have tons of normally impossible keybinds and unbinds them all at once. No other con than that. | ||
|
JDub
United States976 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/O6QaP.jpg) There is of course the "Ignore" button, so it's not really an issue. | ||
| ||
