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On February 26 2012 00:32 Xaldarian wrote:
After lurking on this forum since beta, I found your guide so interesting I wanted to reply. so here goes, what would you do vs a speedling expand like 14/14 or 11 pool? I find that I can't deal with them without a forge. You seem to leave yourself wide open, how do you deal with early pressure OP? plat toss here.
I would say 1 zealot can hold 4 zerglings, 2 zealots can hold 8, 3 zealots can hold 12. Use the terrain and building to not let the zerglings surround you. In the 1 zealot vs 4 zergling case, use 1 probe to kill 5 hp zerglings so that the zealot doesn't waste an attack on them (11 damage overkill). When the photon cannon finishes, it's most likely his all in won't work. I was experimenting with late forge but earlier zealots, and earlier forge but late zealots. It seems early forge is better since you can always hold low amounts of lings with the help of some probes, and when the cannon is up, he can't pressure anymore.
As for other all ins, just use scouting, check how late he got his base, does he have gas, and try to have a probe near his base or send your zealots to the watch tower early. Once you scout an all in, add 1-3 cannons and you will hold it most probably. If you're having trouble you could do what Yuffie suggested and add a sentry.
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Awesome build. Real starcraft is making strong pushes and timings while macroing behind it. Cool stuff, ty for the well written guide and the replays.
edit: Does Zerg go muta in any of the reps? I would like to check those out particularly.
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On February 26 2012 01:57 hunger wrote:
Awesome build. Real starcraft is making strong pushes and timings while macroing behind it. Cool stuff, ty for the well written guide and the replays.
edit: Does Zerg go muta in any of the reps? I would like to check those out particularly.
I will try to upload more replays against other builds, including mutas. I have a friend who likes muta style zerg play so I will ask him if he could try muta against me. Usually zerg doesn't go muta due to blink stalkers. Sometimes if zerg goes 2 base muta, I simply keep warping zealots and kill his natural since he doesn't get roaches.
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helped me out a lot, thanks for the guide.
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Awesome, I got to try this, struggling hard against Zerg right now.
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Can we get some more creative build names?
Tired of people just naming it after themselves.....
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Had a game where Zerg just droned up hard on 2 bases and got roaches before his third. This build keeps up in econ if the Zerg goes for a fast third and you do some damage/force lings, but you end up behind on probes and unable to take a third if they just macro up on 2 bases and play safe with quick roaches before going for a third. Have you found this to be true in your games or have you not seen that?
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2 things:
1. without the early wall off, wouldn't a ling runby be GG?
2. What happens if the zerg is on 2 base when your 7 zealots hit and he has 2-3 spines, and just goes for a roach all in irectly after that BEFORE your +2 blink stalkers are up?
awesome guide, thanks!
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I saw this thread on my phone and I was so excited about trying this build and watching the replays
I got home and clicked on your replay vs the top 100 grandmaster
I get a 404 error
I have never been so crushed and disappointed in my life. Please reupload ^^
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On February 26 2012 04:55 hunger wrote:
Had a game where Zerg just droned up hard on 2 bases and got roaches before his third. This build keeps up in econ if the Zerg goes for a fast third and you do some damage/force lings, but you end up behind on probes and unable to take a third if they just macro up on 2 bases and play safe with quick roaches before going for a third. Have you found this to be true in your games or have you not seen that?
The problem with 2 base zerg is that they will be lacking larva unless they build a macro hatch, a macro hatch is fine if you're going to be defensive and put spine crawlers and go something like 2 base muta. However if you go roaches, your army is strong enough to allow you to get that 3rd, so it's pretty useless. My zealot push is so strong that it will kill his natural instead of his 3rd if he goes so. However if he stops the push by getting really really early roaches, then he's forced on the offensive and I will defend it with stalkers. And I really doubt how he can get more drones than me.
On February 26 2012 04:52 AGIANTSMURF wrote:
Can we get some more creative build names?
Tired of people just naming it after themselves.....
Sorry, all names taken. You don't want me to call it the Zealot mega doom attack off 1 gate nexus transitioning invincible blink stalkers into mass nexus protoss op qq? Don't you?
On February 26 2012 05:12 Banchan wrote:
I saw this thread on my phone and I was so excited about trying this build and watching the replays
I got home and clicked on your replay vs the top 100 grandmaster
I get a 404 error
I have never been so crushed and disappointed in my life. Please reupload ^^
Ow, something bad has happened. When making this I tried an other replay site so it could be uploaded easier and faster. It seems it doesn't work. I'll try to reupload with my old replay site. Don't worry people, it will be fixed soon.
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Yeah none of the replays are working for me either
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Edit: Fixed the replays. Not sure if they are in the same order, but it's fixed.
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What is the reasoning for placing the core on the low ground?
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On February 26 2012 05:29 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
What is the reasoning for placing the core on the low ground?
In most cases it won't matter. However here's some specific reasons while it can actually be better:
1) Core has more hp than forge.
2) If core dies, you can rebuild it, only delaying your warp tech. However if forge dies, you can't build cannons and most probably die to the push/all in that killed it. Believe me, forge high ground saved me tons of times against all ins and won me the game, especially against the zerg gm player wrj famous for baneling all inning all his games to gm. I wonder if I can find a replay of it.
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Adonminus:
I watched your game vs Breathe, and I have a few questions. How come you were not able to finish him off once you got your 3rd up and running? You were way ahead in workers and supply. Was it because stalkers aren't very good vs roach hydra infestor? I often find myself in a similar situation: ahead against zerg, but unable to deal the killing blow, meanwhile he gets more bases up and running and almost always comes back? I guess my question is, how do you actually win vs zerg, i.e how do you know when to engage and to keep pushing for the win? Thanks
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Just on my second try of this build I completely rolled a zerg. Zealot + 1 kills 3rd base, blinkstalkers kill rebuilt 3rd base--it's all so brilliant! Thanks for writing up a guide to it, more replays with dividers amongst the replays categorizing them would be even better! Also a small typo (i think) you say get first zealot at 18 supply, think you mean 16 from what I've seen a lot in your replays 
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On February 26 2012 06:29 CodECleaR wrote:Just on my second try of this build I completely rolled a zerg. Zealot + 1 kills 3rd base, blinkstalkers kill rebuilt 3rd base--it's all so brilliant! Thanks for writing up a guide to it, more replays with dividers amongst the replays categorizing them would be even better! Also a small typo (i think) you say get first zealot at 18 supply, think you mean 16 from what I've seen a lot in your replays
Yeah sorry, 16 zealot. Made the error cause it shows 18 supply when zealot starts. Fixed it.
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quite exited to try this on monday, very nice guide
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I think the 7:10 push will meet the Roach rush on which part he said if you see roaches pull back
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EPT
