EPT[G] Bomber's TvZ - Page 4
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BigJoe
United States210 Posts
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Azera
3800 Posts
On January 08 2012 21:59 WCX wrote: LOL @ Day[9] daily ripoff. For the record, his MS Paint picture >>>>>> your 1st screenshot. I already said that this is a review of the Daily. | ||
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Micket
United Kingdom2163 Posts
On January 08 2012 22:07 ReachTheSky wrote: so i watched the daily for this build. I come to realized this is the most greedy "economic cheese" there is, maybe aside from cc first. If the zerg drone scouts you will literally die to any amount of roaches. Any type of all in will beat this build right away. I personally don't think its safe at all vs anything  . That bunker will do nothing. Sure this build can be amazing, but only if your opponent doesn't drone scout lol. Marineking held off a roach baneling all in without a bunker without a wall off, whilst going triple orbital opening, with the cc at his third. You need fantastic micro. Btw, marineking barely lost any scvs to this and only a handful of marines. | ||
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KaiserIV
Sweden31 Posts
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Azera
3800 Posts
On January 08 2012 23:07 KaiserIV wrote: Hello, did just test this, (high masters) This don't work because when you push out at 200/200 zerg has full control of the map and 3/3 on all units and high tech like broodlord and or Ultralisks. I may have been unclear, but you're supposed to push out when +2 for Infantry finishes. | ||
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KaiserIV
Sweden31 Posts
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Yoshi Kirishima
United States10382 Posts
On January 08 2012 23:13 Azera wrote: I may have been unclear, but you're supposed to push out when +2 for Infantry finishes. It might not work in your level or with you but it works at the pro level so... i don't think people will take a high masters's input over a progamer's, who has succeeded with it. | ||
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ThePianoDentist
United Kingdom698 Posts
On January 08 2012 23:07 KaiserIV wrote: Hello, did just test this, (high masters) This don't work because when you push out at 200/200 zerg has full control of the map and 3/3 on all units and high tech like broodlord and or Ultralisks. I agree, even if bomber can take down top pros like idra with it, the fact you tried it one game and managed to lose shows that this is an awful unusable style. :| | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On January 08 2012 22:07 ReachTheSky wrote: so i watched the daily for this build. I come to realized this is the most greedy "economic cheese" there is, maybe aside from cc first. If the zerg drone scouts you will literally die to any amount of roaches. Any type of all in will beat this build right away. No. 28 (or a bit later) Roach Warren is easily dealt with (bunker + Marauder), and even the ~9'30 Roach + Baneling Bust can be defended. Even if you lose 20 SCVs, that's ok because you have 3 OCs and the Zerg didn't drone / take his third yet. | ||
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NoisyNinja
United States991 Posts
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Mindblown
United States6 Posts
 I tried this build the best I can and it works great so far! :D | ||
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Deleted User 135096
3624 Posts
On January 09 2012 04:35 NoisyNinja wrote: Here are the two reps from STBomber vs. IdrA games from MLG Orlando.Can you please post replays? This is a really good guide, but I feel some people would benefit from seeing exactly how Bomber does it, where he's looking, and what he controls and when. http://drop.sc/62710 http://drop.sc/62708 | ||
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Phemtos
Canada163 Posts
On January 08 2012 23:07 KaiserIV wrote: Hello, did just test this, (high masters) This don't work because when you push out at 200/200 zerg has full control of the map and 3/3 on all units and high tech like broodlord and or Ultralisks. High master here as well and while I was skeptical of the build at first, especially against mass upgrade lings with ultra/infestor I still think this build can work if the zerg doesnt scout the third too fast and if you follow the build order timing as well as possible. if you max out at the correct time the zerg usually doesnt have many high tech unit and your maxed out army should beat his assuming he doesnt have too many infestor but yeah I can see your point how it can still lose against this army comp especially if the zerg is more greedy then you. also you can just add a couple of marauders if he see him going early ultra and viking for BL. Either way I think your main push should be able to do good damage in any case unless you fuck up really badly. this build is worth testing out. | ||
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lukasdesign
Switzerland93 Posts
If u could include one or two replays and maybe a link to the daily it would be just flawless. Can't wait to see the TvT and he TvP :-) | ||
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Azera
3800 Posts
On January 09 2012 19:33 lukasdesign wrote: I love this kind of summary! Especially as the day9fan isn't updated any longer. If u could include one or two replays and maybe a link to the daily it would be just flawless. Can't wait to see the TvT and he TvP :-) I added the replays at the bottom of the OP :D | ||
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Bluelightz
Indonesia2463 Posts
 I'll be watching the replays because this style look's very interesting :D | ||
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CatNzHat
United States1599 Posts
On January 09 2012 03:37 ThePianoDentist wrote: I agree, even if bomber can take down top pros like idra with it, the fact you tried it one game and managed to lose shows that this is an awful unusable style. :| I have 10 or so replays against high masters zerg players showing you that with good mechanics, you can absolutely crush zergs with it in a perfectly straight-up manner. If you don't get supply blocked and never miss a production cycle you'll easily max within a minute or so of the zerg, you'll both have big armies, and you will almost never be behind on upgrades, and rarely will they have hive tech out (maybe a few ultras, but not a scary number of broods), and their broods will most definitely not be 3-3. Even if they do have hive tech out and 3-3, you will have ghosts and 3-3 as well, and a fourth base, and a huge amount of production. When you move out you gain the advantage of clearing all the creep on the map, so as the game continues you will have more of a vision advantage, giving you another way to outplay your opponent. A maxed hive tech army is definitely not unbeatable, but if you have shitty control it will be a bit of a challenge, work on controlling your maxed army, properly slow pushing onto creep, target firing with tanks, landing good emps on infestors, snipe spamming broods (with how shitty the ghost AI is, it's pretty hard to snipe effectively with 10+ ghosts). | ||
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Lisitsa
Korea (South)29 Posts
The Ghosts are the keypoint. Otherwise Zerg hive army with broodlords/infestors will definitely take adventage. Yes, ghosts are OP in TvZ, if microed correctly and backed up by Siege Tanks. Once they reach a certain amount of ghosts the game is pretty much over - that has been repeatedly demonstrated in games like MVP vs Nestea, MMA vs DRG and all sorts of things. On ladder you'll see ghosts dying simply because the player level is so much lower, but on paper, and on professional level where theorycraft becomes reality, broodlords infestors ultralisks will never cut through ghost compositions. This style of extreme macro and defensive TvZ style is all about directly abusing the lack of Zerg lategame answer to maxed Terran army with Ghosts. A timing attack is NOT necessary at all. Zerg players should respond to this with early and mid game aggression/harassement, abusing the relatively weak and stretched out Terran defense, and cripple the Terran before he is able to get to the critical mass of Ghosts and Siege Tanks. User was warned for this post | ||
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ReachTheSky
United States3294 Posts
On January 08 2012 23:06 Micket wrote: Marineking held off a roach baneling all in without a bunker without a wall off, whilst going triple orbital opening, with the cc at his third. You need fantastic micro. Btw, marineking barely lost any scvs to this and only a handful of marines. Ok your right about that. But that all in came muuuuch later i feel. A zerg who drone scouts could start prepping for the all in the second they recognize the timings of the terran buildings.... Then what is a terran to do? 2 marines> roaches? i don't think so. Those 2-4 hellions are also going to be very flimsy. | ||
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Azera
3800 Posts
On January 09 2012 22:59 ReachTheSky wrote: Ok your right about that. But that all in came muuuuch later i feel. A zerg who drone scouts could start prepping for the all in the second they recognize the timings of the terran buildings.... Then what is a terran to do? 2 marines> roaches? i don't think so. Those 2-4 hellions are also going to be very flimsy. You start getting tanks after the hellions... | ||
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