PvZ simple cheese with ~80% w/r in high masters - Page 3

On September 14 2011 19:40 iNkopwnz wrote:the point is to get ladder points -_- once u get to high masters or w/e, u get matched with stronger ppl and then u can stop doing these bs strats

On September 14 2011 20:44 Sententia wrote:

Why not become better and get there legitimately? If you use these types of cheese you're not helping yourself because you end up at a higher league than you should, and you hit a ceiling when you start playing real games or when your opponents are good enough to stop it.

On September 14 2011 18:55 Koshi wrote:

I always try to mine 100 gas -->lair -->nydus to my third -->expand there --> clear natural with roaches--> take 3rd ---> Lose against Protoss deathball.

On September 14 2011 21:47 shoop wrote:
I hate all these moral judgements flying around. If a strategy is successful, what business do you have telling people it's bad to use those strategies? Any strategy that wins is a good strategy, this is really just the "no rush 15 min" attitude in disguise.

@lcl: "What's the point in having a build only for ladder?": any build is "only for ladder" if, like most people, you don't participate in tournaments. This is like saying "what is the point in singing only in the shower". Weird question.

@Saechiis: "flaunt your 80% winrate" suggests that the OP is a braggart. I can find no evidence of that. He could have written "this always wins", instead the OP tries to give a realistic assessment.

@schmutttt: "How is this new?" OP correctly points out he never claimed it was new.

@Sententia: "Why not become better and get there legitimately?" What kind of legitimacy are you talking about here?

There is always going to be variability in what kind of motivations people have for the game, how they like to behave and what kind of strategies they want to use and the reasons for doing so. It is ridiculous to expect everyone to stick to a narrow code of conduct in a game like this. I sure as hell will never subscribe to such a code. In fact, it would be horrible if some of you guys got your way and there would be a starcraft honour code: everyone would quickly become terribly vulnerable to cheese, leading to a more unstable metagame.

Although I understand that you get annoyed if you die to this guy's strat, the way to make it disappear is by preparing against it so that its success rate drops. Tl;dr: please stop complaining and deal with it. There is no moral flaw in the OP, just a whole lot of grammatical and spelling errors.

On September 14 2011 22:19 Wortie wrote:
I'm an High Diamond Zerg, and I have never lost to this.

One time I faced this on the ladder and I just nydused the protoss. Later on I have perfected it:

If you see the protoss doing this, throw down immediatly 2 extractors. If you can, try to deny scouting from the protoss, but this can still work even if he scouts it. As soon as you can, you start lair tech. Then, after you're fully saturated, you start producing roaches. As the Lair finishes you throw down a Nydus worm, and also start a second queen.


Then take all your forces into the nydus worm (queens too) and try to nydus his main, if this fails because it got spotted. Nydus again before his base, break down his wall and march in. If you have broken his wall he won't have much forces that pose a threat to you. Some protosses will go for air, to prevent the roach bust, hence the 2 queens.

Additional points:
- Immediatly get some overlords in position for the nydus attempts. One at the back of the base for the first attempt and maybe a second in the front of his base. Remember that every unit can spot for you, so if you still have your scouting drone outside your base, try to hide it so you can deploy your nydus with it!
- It is also very handy to put a creep tumor and a spine in your base. Once you have creeped to the ramp, you can pick the pylons with the spine of!
- Try to keep your queens alive, you can lay creep tumors around the nydus for more vision and speed. If you're in the main it will also irritate the protoss very much.


Even if you don't destroy the protoss, you will most likely win because of the damage you done, protoss can't even expand if you have creep in their natural


Also I realise this is an all-in, but trying to continue the game noramlly would be suïcide in my opinion.

On September 14 2011 22:41 kedinik wrote:
I'm fairly certain that if you see this with a defensive 2nd OL and immediately drone-drill, you break the contain before any pylons can even finish.

Which, granted, takes more map awareness and reaction speed than the vast majority of even master league players have.

On September 14 2011 22:35 macaronij wrote:
LOL, don t you know why...

On September 14 2011 22:42 mage36 wrote:

Quick question. Don't the protoss you play against have a couple of cannons out front? As soon as I see the first nydus worm, I deny it with probes or one zealot or a combination of both. Then I just put up a few more cannons in addition to the ones i already have in case he makes a nydus outside the natural (with almost a wall) coz I know he can't possibly attempt anything but banes or roaches at my front as I'm denying the nydus at the back with just workers. And by the time you get to do that, the protoss is so far ahead anyway. In fact, I even put down extra cannons out front just in case either way because I know I can afford to be safe when I see he never put down an expo anywhere else. Warpgate will probably be done already when you get to attack and he will probably have around 4 gates already. (at least that's the number I had the last time I got hit with a nydus with stargate too).

On September 14 2011 22:52 Wortie wrote:


Cannons are not invincible, with this push you can have around 10 roaches and a few lings, so there is a chance you can break them down. Sure it is possible for protoss to put so much defense up so you can't break it, but with that much of an investment, they are crippling themselves. Anything protoss can throw at you, is gonna be weaker and delayed with every cannon they build.

If you don't succeed to do damage, you can break the wall at your natural down with the force you have outside, the wall will be weaker because you will have a better arc than on top of the ramp. After that you can easily take your natural and a 3rd. Also remember that the nydus worm gives you more mobility than any race has. You can take expo's at really weird locations. You will always be faster there than they will be.