EPTWhat do I do? Is not expanding the only option I have? Even if I scout this, its pretty hard because like I said I have not enough units.
The Terran Help Me Thread - Page 299
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
What do I do? Is not expanding the only option I have? Even if I scout this, its pretty hard because like I said I have not enough units. | ||
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jay.li
United States23 Posts
On July 12 2012 15:36 dynwar7 wrote: Hi guys, how do you deal with 7/8 marine, 3 hellions elevator play? I normally go 1rax fe in tvt, so this is a problem for me. I cant split my marines in two, defending the high ground and my natural ramp. I have bunker there but that takes 4 marines, so basically I dont have enough units when this elevator play hits. What do I do? Is not expanding the only option I have? Even if I scout this, its pretty hard because like I said I have not enough units. Typically a bunker at the front will ward away any frontal attack, so the rest of your units can sort of be on your ramp/ in your main in order to quickly respond. The key is quick response time and full vision of your main. You must not allow him to elevator up all of the units undisturbed. If he does though, you will certainly need to pull scvs. | ||
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ncsix
1370 Posts
On July 12 2012 14:20 XenOsky- wrote: what is the best way to approach the 1 base Hellion Marine drop when going 1 rax f exp? 1 rax FE. Bunker with 4 rines at Nat. Tech to Siege Tank, Get Eng Bay, 2 Missile Turrets at most obvious drop pathway into your base. You won't have any medivacs but its definitely the way to defend your Main and Nat to any early drops. If he insist on dropping after being shot by the turrents, its all too likely he'll lose his medivac and its easy to clean up. If he spots the turrets and tries to drop around it, you should have your bunkers unloaded and be ready to move your scvs. By the time anything gets done, you should have at least 2 tanks, which is plenty good against hellion rine drops. | ||
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
On July 12 2012 15:58 jay.li wrote: Typically a bunker at the front will ward away any frontal attack, so the rest of your units can sort of be on your ramp/ in your main in order to quickly respond. The key is quick response time and full vision of your main. You must not allow him to elevator up all of the units undisturbed. If he does though, you will certainly need to pull scvs. But if I pull my marines there, the medivac will give vision of his hellions which will burn my marines. What is a strong opener in TvT that is decent vs elevator play? I noticed many Ts do 1/1/1 now...so marine/hellion/medivac or reaper/hellion/medivac which eat marines...so what do I do vs this? Is there a safe opener in TvT that starts with 1rax FE? | ||
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stew_
Canada239 Posts
also, how should i execute it against zerg? i've given up all hope for going to a macro game. thanks! | ||
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Pillage
United States804 Posts
On July 12 2012 17:40 stew_ wrote: what is the 'standard' bo for a 11/11? also, how should i execute it against zerg? i've given up all hope for going to a macro game. thanks! Build the depot at the ramp and rally the 11th scv to the proxy area. rally the scv building the depot to the same area and you should have just enough minerals to start both the rax when they get there. Pull 5ish scvs additionally to help make sure the bunkers go down at his nat. | ||
EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 12 2012 03:30 monkybone wrote: You die to a 7 gate for sure... It hits my 1 rax expand into 3 rax so hard that I don't usually have a chance. And I don't skimp on units. .....what? You go 3rax and you "don't skimp on units"??? Dude, 3rax is the definition of cutting units in favor of faster tech. What I'm suggesting is SUBSTANTIALLY faster stim/CS and medivacs with 2 rax. By doing this, you can have 5-6 rax pumping out stim/CS units by 10 minutes...all you have to do is survive the initial poke for more than 30 seconds and you should be in good shape. You can do this with little to no early defense, knowing that your opponent went nexus first and can't possibly do something like a 3-4 warp gate attack at 6:00-7:00. Hope this helps! | ||
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EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
On July 12 2012 16:43 dynwar7 wrote: But if I pull my marines there, the medivac will give vision of his hellions which will burn my marines. What is a strong opener in TvT that is decent vs elevator play? I noticed many Ts do 1/1/1 now...so marine/hellion/medivac or reaper/hellion/medivac which eat marines...so what do I do vs this? Is there a safe opener in TvT that starts with 1rax FE? Thorzain's TvT opening This is Thorzain's opening. It opens with an astounding number of marines with really fast Combat Shield and quick tanks or medivacs to follow. The only thing I'd add to what Day9 says is to MAKE SURE you start poking around and gaining map control and vision as soon as you have CS. Map control is VERY important with this build. I've outright beaten a lot of elevator play with this strategy. As long as you have a bunker at the front and decent ability to spread units, you should be able to beat the medivac/hellion/marine play with this. It also does well against banshee openings. If you are playing against a 1-base fast tank all-in, just make sure you meet him in the middle with your marines and pick off tanks. Hope this helps! EDIT: In addition, the fast tank allows you to hold off any pressure including hellions/reapers. ONE tank (without seige mode) will utterly destroy the speed reaper/hellion all-in. It also immediately shuts down the hellion/marine/medivac attack. | ||
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Bojas
Netherlands2397 Posts
Since I am very lazy I was wondering if any of my fellow terrans took notes on that build Beastyqt has been doing which gets a fast third, double ebay and does a hellion banshee poke? | ||
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KonanTenshi
Sweden210 Posts
On July 12 2012 17:40 stew_ wrote: what is the 'standard' bo for a 11/11? also, how should i execute it against zerg? i've given up all hope for going to a macro game. thanks! My experience is that you send out your first SCV to scout him, build normal 10 depot, and depending on map you send out 1-2 scvs to build double raxxs close the your opponent base. then just keep producing scvs/marines till you or he dies ^_^ | ||
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Andertech
18 Posts
On July 12 2012 13:29 Qibla wrote: So assuming I open gasless, I tried early marine pressure, but this time he went a nexus first, the followed up forge, and had cannons ready up by the time my first marine got there. So in this case is my only option a fast 3rd? Ok, first of all assuming you are going to pressure you should try to exploit the best ways to do it. Nexus first ussually means he doesnt have ANY way of defense until he gets his forge or his gate up. If you scout it early (by early I mean before 3rd pylon, when forge/gate is started or is a at half construction) bunker rush him, in a place where he cant build a cannon right away(so that he must build a pylon then a cannon, you can try to put it behind the mineral line) this will force him to send probes to defend which will do damage to his economy (remember to rally your first marine there). If you scout it when his forge/gate is about to finish or finished you should go 2rax early pressure, and as I said in my first post, push with your first marauder with concussive, marines and a couple of scvs in order to kill expensive units while you take your third base, remember that this push is not meant to kill him as in the middle of it, his warpgate tech might finish and you MUST return to your base to reinforce and tech to medivacs to snipe his tech (you can scan at 6 min to see if hes going 6/7gate or traditional colossus gate army or fast templar tech) if you manage to snipe his tech or do enough econ damage killing his probes or even his main nexus you will be ahead, as always you should be teching to ghosts doesnt matter what happen a couple of emps will give you an edge even if he didnt went templar tech (assuming you have your third up before his and that you traded efficiently you will have better income and more units). You must remember that you dont want to have an even late-game, you need a favored one. Keep the pressure all the time, deny his third with a couple of marine / marauders and stim back to your base, do pronged drops/attacks and abuse tech timings (stim, concussive, +1 +1, medivac timing / ghost timings) if you dont your oponnent will do it (2/3 colossus 2base pushes, 7gate timing push, chargelot archon timing, warp prism sentry drops,etc) PD: Sorry about my bad english :/ hope you understand it and that you can find it useful PD2: If you want to practice add me, im Andertech.768 in the NA server. | ||
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M7Jagger
Sweden237 Posts
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Aquila-
516 Posts
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Bojas
Netherlands2397 Posts
On July 13 2012 02:34 Aquila- wrote: Can anyone tell me please how to stop these retarded gateway pushes from Protoss? I talk about 5-6 gate pushes after 1 gate FE. I alredy always make 3 bunkers because I know it is coming, then I pull scvs, they all get forcefielded away and I just die even though I have 3 bunkers. This is such a joke do I need 5 bunkers or what? Got any replays? That would definitely help. | ||
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Nightmarjoo
United States3360 Posts
On July 12 2012 15:36 dynwar7 wrote: Hi guys, how do you deal with 7/8 marine, 3 hellions elevator play? I normally go 1rax fe in tvt, so this is a problem for me. I cant split my marines in two, defending the high ground and my natural ramp. I have bunker there but that takes 4 marines, so basically I dont have enough units when this elevator play hits. What do I do? Is not expanding the only option I have? Even if I scout this, its pretty hard because like I said I have not enough units. 1. Scout that it's coming. If you scv scout gas, scan with your nat oc's first 50 energy to see if he got a second gas or not. If he did not, this build is a very distinct possibility even if you don't get to see his addons. Scout for proxies to help rule out other possibilities if that scan didn't give you enough information. 2. Only put 2 marines in the bunker, and wall your nat choke off as you can afford to prevent a hellion runby. 3. Spread your existing marines around your main to see the medic. 4. When you see the medic, crush it with all the marines in your main + a healthy scv pull from your main line. Micro your scvs to prevent huge losses from the hellions. Red hp scvs are still living scvs. You should have the marine count to easily fend off any further aggression by the time it comes (if it does). When I'm going 1rax cc I always go 1rax cc gasgas rax, and I always stop this kind of a build and have more scvs than him following the aggression (plus a cc lead). 8 marines with a medic healing and 3 hellions in one spot are impossible to beat. A handful of marines being dropped out one at a time with a medic not healing because it's dropping and 3 hellions which can't hit your marines aren't so scary. On July 12 2012 16:09 ncsix wrote: 1 rax FE. Bunker with 4 rines at Nat. Tech to Siege Tank, Get Eng Bay, 2 Missile Turrets at most obvious drop pathway into your base. You won't have any medivacs but its definitely the way to defend your Main and Nat to any early drops. If he insist on dropping after being shot by the turrents, its all too likely he'll lose his medivac and its easy to clean up. If he spots the turrets and tries to drop around it, you should have your bunkers unloaded and be ready to move your scvs. By the time anything gets done, you should have at least 2 tanks, which is plenty good against hellion rine drops. You can't possibly have tanks out by the time it hits; and you can't possibly afford enough turrets to deter the drop either. 2 missile turrets are useless vs this kind of a drop. A bunker in main could potentially be useful (but probably isn't necessary). On July 12 2012 16:43 dynwar7 wrote: But if I pull my marines there, the medivac will give vision of his hellions which will burn my marines. What is a strong opener in TvT that is decent vs elevator play? I noticed many Ts do 1/1/1 now...so marine/hellion/medivac or reaper/hellion/medivac which eat marines...so what do I do vs this? Is there a safe opener in TvT that starts with 1rax FE? I personally like 1rax cc gasgas rax a lot vs tech builds; as the 2rax is enough production to stop initial aggression; and you should be able to stall to get a tank out vs heavier aggression (such as reaper/hellion/medic) On July 13 2012 02:34 Aquila- wrote: Can anyone tell me please how to stop these retarded gateway pushes from Protoss? I talk about 5-6 gate pushes after 1 gate FE. I alredy always make 3 bunkers because I know it is coming, then I pull scvs, they all get forcefielded away and I just die even though I have 3 bunkers. This is such a joke do I need 5 bunkers or what? Check your macro to make sure you have as high a unit-count as possible. Three bunkers should suffice if you position them properly and position/micro scvs properly. If he's sentry-heavy you need to put scvs in front and behind the bunkers before his attack hits. Don't worry about lost mining time; your tech will give you the advantage as soon as he backs off his aggression. Don't worry about losing scvs (within reason) for the same reason. Just make sure to keep macroing properly during the course of the aggression. | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25551 Posts
On July 13 2012 02:22 M7Jagger wrote: What do I do in TvZ lategame? All the TvZ's I play I get to the lategame with the zerg adding on a bunch of ultras and then he just kills me, I just cannot stop the ultras. I almost never have addons on my barracks so that i can transition into marauders if he goes ultras but it doesn't seem to be helping. Any advice? Ideally, you want to start drastically increasing your infrastructure as you get on more bases. Remember that every base a Zerg takes is more infrastructure for him to make new units, and in the late game zerg likes to make ultras or brood lords. Add barracks with tech labs and add extra starports BEFORE he hits you with BLs or Ultras, so that when they come out, you can counter appropriately. Beyond this, I can't give much advice without seeing a replay. | ||
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Sorkoas
549 Posts
My opening is usually as follow: 16 CC 17 depot 19 rax * 2 21 gas bunker in front of expansion. I follow it up with a combat shield or naked marine poke around 8-9 to pick off some sentries and just get an idea of what my opponent is doing. At this point I have added another 2 rax for 5 in total and started my factory as well as all upgrades from tech labs and +1 attack. My goal is to overwhelm the protoss with mass bio and my first 4 medivacs around 12-13 min, while I'm taking my 3rd base. The colossus push itself comes around 10:30-11:30, when I have just started my first set of medivacs. This is as I already said no issue on big maps because I can take map control and not let the Protoss player get in a good position with his army all together. Should I aim for an earlier and stronger timing attack or do you guys have any other ideas to delay his push so I can get vikings out and move to my 3rd base which is easier to defend? It seems this style is standard for most P on CK atm. | ||
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Kamelixs
Sweden88 Posts
edit: Or rather; what is the "best" and most standard to do theese days | ||
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Account252508
3454 Posts
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Account252508
3454 Posts
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