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The Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 99

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action.
elgringo
Profile Joined March 2011
United States28 Posts
November 04 2011 19:20 GMT
#1961
how the hell do you defend proxy 2 gate in PvP? I scout it, start chronoing zealots out of my one gateway, stop mining gas, and throw down a forge for defensive cannons. i lose every time. is getting a forge the wrong response?
But what is happiness except the simple harmony between a man and the life he leads? -Albert Camus
monk
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States8477 Posts
November 04 2011 19:22 GMT
#1962
On November 05 2011 04:20 elgringo wrote:
how the hell do you defend proxy 2 gate in PvP? I scout it, start chronoing zealots out of my one gateway, stop mining gas, and throw down a forge for defensive cannons. i lose every time. is getting a forge the wrong response?

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=269312
Moderator
TheBlankets
Profile Joined October 2011
United States14 Posts
November 04 2011 20:15 GMT
#1963
I'm a fairly new player and I'm having trouble with expanding. When I expand, I usually queue up 5 probes from each Nexus and chrono them out to get my expansion up and running. When I do this, however, I can't make units. Any tips on how to get probes to expansions or any tips on expanding in general?
aZealot
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
New Zealand5447 Posts
November 04 2011 20:29 GMT
#1964
Huh? Assuming good saturation on your main I would have thought you'd transfer some of the probes from your main to your natural. Alternatively, rally new workers from both Nexi to your natural mineral site. And don't queue up worker units, make 1 at a time, and queue up the second when the first is almost done.
KT best KT ~ 2014
TheBlankets
Profile Joined October 2011
United States14 Posts
November 04 2011 20:32 GMT
#1965
But if I'm saturated at my main why would I unsaturate it by transferring? Or do I keep making probes at my main until I'm over saturated and transfer the excess probes?
Latedi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Sweden1027 Posts
November 04 2011 20:54 GMT
#1966
The techniques achieve the same result with small variances. The overall goal is to saturate both bases as fast as you can. And to clarfiy about the queueing of probes, this will effectively lock up 4x50x2 minerals until the probes are done. That's the same as almost 3 gateways or 4 zealots.
I am Latedi.
aZealot
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
New Zealand5447 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-04 22:23:16
November 04 2011 21:15 GMT
#1967
Yeah, it shouldn't make too much of a difference either way. Although, of course, if you've constantly made workers, are expanding late, and are over-saturated at your main, then transferring is the better option, IMO. Day9 did a good daily on basic macro a while ago. I think it was 184 - but the best part was at the very end where he ran a simulation for about 10 minutes and compressed everything he had talked about over the episode into that little segment at the end. It's well worth the watch:



(I think this is the episode, I'm not completely sure though)
KT best KT ~ 2014
TheBlankets
Profile Joined October 2011
United States14 Posts
November 05 2011 00:25 GMT
#1968
Yeah I've seen that one, I actually just watched it again a couple of days ago, its the one where he always says "probes and pylons" haha I love Day9. And yeah I understand why I shouldn't queue up probes, but I feel like I need to because otherwise I forget to make the probes, so I guess its just something I need to practice.
blooblooblahblah
Profile Joined February 2011
Australia4163 Posts
November 05 2011 00:46 GMT
#1969
On November 05 2011 09:25 TheBlankets wrote:
Yeah I've seen that one, I actually just watched it again a couple of days ago, its the one where he always says "probes and pylons" haha I love Day9. And yeah I understand why I shouldn't queue up probes, but I feel like I need to because otherwise I forget to make the probes, so I guess its just something I need to practice.


It's better to practice the right way now so it doesn't come back to haunt u later on. It's easy to forget probes and queue them up but learning it the right way now will be a lot more beneficial when u become better.
Ganzi beat me without stim. Ostojiy beat me with a nydus. Siphonn beat me with probes. Revival beat my sentry-immortal all-in.
JonnyLaw
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3482 Posts
November 05 2011 01:06 GMT
#1970
Blankets, getting into the habit of hitting 4ee 4ee 4ee once in a while while briefly looking down at the bottom of the screen to see how many workers are queued is a great habit.

It will be a skill you will utilize in any and all sc2 games.

If that case I'm saying '4' is your nexus hotkey obviously.
TheBlankets
Profile Joined October 2011
United States14 Posts
November 05 2011 03:26 GMT
#1971
Haha yeah I hotkey my Nexus as 4. Thanks guys, I'll start practicing that. As you can probably tell by my question I'm pretty new, so I have a LOT to learn. Any other tips would be greatly appreciated :D
Mitchlew
Profile Joined September 2010
Australia428 Posts
November 06 2011 10:43 GMT
#1972
I am having so much problems with zerg, literally losing 90% of my pvz. I started trying double stargate, I can get ahead in supply, tech and econ. However the zerg seems to just absoultely crush me no matter. I don't know how to transition from mass pheniox. Would really really appreicate some help. Was vsing masters this morning, went on a major tilt and back to diamond players and still losing.

Replay 1: http://www.users.on.net/~rice69/doublesp1.SC2Replay

Replay 2: http://www.users.on.net/~rice69/doublesp2.SC2Replay
Rohan
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom83 Posts
November 06 2011 16:55 GMT
#1973
Finally managed to iron out my PvZ and my PvT to the point that I'm confident in those MUs now, which means I'm left with PvP ¬¬

What is a solid, go to, build in PvP? I enjoy playing blink stalkers in general, but I have no real idea of how to play when someone masses up a ball of 1-2 collosi 1-2 immortals and zealots and then just wanders into my base and kills me. Usually to get to blink, I'm going for a robo -> observer (immortal if i'm being 4 gated) and then going into blink. However, I have no idea at all how to follow this up; I'm not one for collosi battles really, so Zealot/Archon would seem natural -- but, argh. I just don't get PvP at all. Does anyone have any links to a decent thread, or two, that can give me something more of a direct game plan?

Also, how the hell do I hold off a marine/scv all in :|
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-11-06 17:35:20
November 06 2011 17:13 GMT
#1974
On November 06 2011 19:43 Mitchlew wrote:
I am having so much problems with zerg, literally losing 90% of my pvz. I started trying double stargate, I can get ahead in supply, tech and econ. However the zerg seems to just absoultely crush me no matter. I don't know how to transition from mass pheniox. Would really really appreicate some help. Was vsing masters this morning, went on a major tilt and back to diamond players and still losing.

Replay 1: http://www.users.on.net/~rice69/doublesp1.SC2Replay

Replay 2: http://www.users.on.net/~rice69/doublesp2.SC2Replay


If you go double stargate, you need to do an enormous amount of damage with it, a disproportionate amount of damage. Since the phoenix are not going to be useful in a straight up fight, your stargate choice will set you way behind unless you do a ton of damage. If you aren't confident in doing a lot of hurt to the zerg, don't go double stargate.

Game one you did enough damage, but you didn't really do a few of the other necessary things you need to do with phoenix, like scout the whole map. He took a ninja expansion on the far right side right after losing his third for example. You also didn't respond to the mutas. You need to be constantly active with your phoenix, up until you suspect infestors are coming out on the field, at which point you keep poking around, but stay clear of their base. You also need to get those extra gateways out a lot sooner, double stargate into double robo is an interesting idea, but it leaves you with a very low gateway unit count for most of the game, and doesn't give you time to get the extra gateways out that you'll need for when the high corrupter count comes out to sweep the map of your colossi. Your upgrades were also a bit behind where they should have been, +1/+1 at the 20 minute mark. Then you engaged a brood lord/corrupter/ling army head on with little to no micro and no forcefields, and the lings destroyed a lot of your stalkers very quickly. It takes another 12 minutes to end, but the game was over at around 23:00.

Game two, you overcommitted to stargate tech and did nowhere near enough damage.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
GomJabbar
Profile Joined February 2011
United States161 Posts
November 06 2011 17:29 GMT
#1975
On November 07 2011 01:55 Rohan wrote:
Finally managed to iron out my PvZ and my PvT to the point that I'm confident in those MUs now, which means I'm left with PvP ¬¬

What is a solid, go to, build in PvP? I enjoy playing blink stalkers in general, but I have no real idea of how to play when someone masses up a ball of 1-2 collosi 1-2 immortals and zealots and then just wanders into my base and kills me. Usually to get to blink, I'm going for a robo -> observer (immortal if i'm being 4 gated) and then going into blink. However, I have no idea at all how to follow this up; I'm not one for collosi battles really, so Zealot/Archon would seem natural -- but, argh. I just don't get PvP at all. Does anyone have any links to a decent thread, or two, that can give me something more of a direct game plan?

Also, how the hell do I hold off a marine/scv all in :|

If you're playing blink against colossus, you should take an early expand far away on the map and continuously harass him while denying his natural. Any time he leaves his base, blink in and threaten a base trade (which you would win with two spread out bases). In the meantime, get a superior economy and tech to chargelots and archons. You don't want to actually engage with blink stalkers once he has a few immortals and colossus. Stall until chargelots and archons.

Defending a marine-scv all-in involves chronoboosting stalkers as soon as you see it coming. Kite his marines/SCV's all the back back to your base. When he gets to your base, pull all of your probes and mineral-walk them through his army until they are on top of the marines, then attack. They'll get a huge surround on the marines. Target fire the marines with stalkers (ignore his SCVs entirely). You should clean up the marines pretty fast and have some probes left over.
Latedi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Sweden1027 Posts
November 06 2011 17:32 GMT
#1976
On November 07 2011 01:55 Rohan wrote:
Finally managed to iron out my PvZ and my PvT to the point that I'm confident in those MUs now, which means I'm left with PvP ¬¬

What is a solid, go to, build in PvP? I enjoy playing blink stalkers in general, but I have no real idea of how to play when someone masses up a ball of 1-2 collosi 1-2 immortals and zealots and then just wanders into my base and kills me. Usually to get to blink, I'm going for a robo -> observer (immortal if i'm being 4 gated) and then going into blink. However, I have no idea at all how to follow this up; I'm not one for collosi battles really, so Zealot/Archon would seem natural -- but, argh. I just don't get PvP at all. Does anyone have any links to a decent thread, or two, that can give me something more of a direct game plan?

Also, how the hell do I hold off a marine/scv all in :|


I suggest you expand in a proxy location and then base trade the colossi player. Your army is much better than his in situations like this, also your map control will let you expand like that.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=249772
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=249638

To hold off a marine/scv all in, chronoboost stalkers and use them to kite the marines. When he reaches your base you want to surround the marines with probes. You can sometimes do this by pressing on the minerals in your natural to go through his scvs and then attack move when you are in the marines, don't engage on the ramp however.
I am Latedi.
Xenomorph
Profile Joined May 2010
United States137 Posts
November 06 2011 21:35 GMT
#1977
Whats a good timing/composition against a 2/3 base mass roach zerg player? Lets say on generally most medium maps. What is also a good timing to take a third against a zerg who takes a fast third against a FFE?
Intrepid Traveler
Latedi
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Sweden1027 Posts
November 06 2011 21:42 GMT
#1978
On November 07 2011 06:35 Xenomorph wrote:
Whats a good timing/composition against a 2/3 base mass roach zerg player? Lets say on generally most medium maps. What is also a good timing to take a third against a zerg who takes a fast third against a FFE?


Get a stalker sentry army with support from immortals and/or colossi. This army easily deals with any amount of roaches but it will be more problematic once the zerg starts adding other units to the army. As for the third that really depends on what build you go for. It's quite standard to take it once you have a colossus or two out. But you can also take it with for example a 5gate robo or behind 6gate pressure.
I am Latedi.
Xenomorph
Profile Joined May 2010
United States137 Posts
November 06 2011 21:57 GMT
#1979
On November 07 2011 06:42 Latedi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 07 2011 06:35 Xenomorph wrote:
Whats a good timing/composition against a 2/3 base mass roach zerg player? Lets say on generally most medium maps. What is also a good timing to take a third against a zerg who takes a fast third against a FFE?


Get a stalker sentry army with support from immortals and/or colossi. This army easily deals with any amount of roaches but it will be more problematic once the zerg starts adding other units to the army. As for the third that really depends on what build you go for. It's quite standard to take it once you have a colossus or two out. But you can also take it with for example a 5gate robo or behind 6gate pressure.


Most of the time I see a lot of mass sling into mass roach so its odd getting a gate army that can deal with both on a 2-3 base without getting rolled.
Intrepid Traveler
SkaPunk
Profile Joined October 2010
United States471 Posts
November 06 2011 21:58 GMT
#1980
Can we get a picture to a few different ffe building placements on antiga are? Also a replay of them holding off 6 pools.
Team Fallacy
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