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On October 09 2011 03:27 Brainiak wrote:No its before a 13 gate, you just scout with the 11th probe and build the gateway with the next one Doesnt set you behind, because this probe would not mine much anyways in comparison with a 13 supply scout
I wouldn't do it on a 4 player map. On a 2 player map, maybe? But I feel like scouting after gate is probably economically optimal.
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Ive just switched to toss from zerg as Ive hit a plateau with zerg. I came across an old thread which boasted that with just good macro , massing stalkers and A moving as toss will get you to diamond. I tried this theory in a game vs a terran - when I saw his tanks i obv did use some sense and get immortals. We both were fighting off 2 base but I still ended up gging..can some toss guys let me know what I did wrong please? And what are the best hotkeys for zeal/stalker/sentry/immortal army?
http://drop.sc/41696
Thanks guys!
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On October 09 2011 04:37 vahgar.r24 wrote:Ive just switched to toss from zerg as Ive hit a plateau with zerg. I came across an old thread which boasted that with just good macro , massing stalkers and A moving as toss will get you to diamond. I tried this theory in a game vs a terran - when I saw his tanks i obv did use some sense and get immortals. We both were fighting off 2 base but I still ended up gging..can some toss guys let me know what I did wrong please? And what are the best hotkeys for zeal/stalker/sentry/immortal army? http://drop.sc/41696Thanks guys!
You had enough immortals... but during the engagement at your natural, you sent them in LAST. Immortals are there to tank damage while your stalkers deal them. Even though you let him siege up outside of your natural (which you should never do) if you sent your immortals first, and followed with your other army, you would've crushed it. Also, don't send in immortals by themselves. Ever. Then need gateway support.
You could have expanded WAY earlier especially since you saw the wall-off, but you were floating high resources and could have expanded way earlier. Thus, you were only mining off of one base for a good chunk of the game because of it.
Immortals are great against tanks.. send them in first. Blinking into tank lines... kind of risky, and very situation dependent. Don't get into that habit. You probably would've been better off with chargelots too, because they charge into marines and the siege tanks to splash.
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+ Show Spoiler +On October 09 2011 04:48 mizU wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 04:37 vahgar.r24 wrote:Ive just switched to toss from zerg as Ive hit a plateau with zerg. I came across an old thread which boasted that with just good macro , massing stalkers and A moving as toss will get you to diamond. I tried this theory in a game vs a terran - when I saw his tanks i obv did use some sense and get immortals. We both were fighting off 2 base but I still ended up gging..can some toss guys let me know what I did wrong please? And what are the best hotkeys for zeal/stalker/sentry/immortal army? http://drop.sc/41696
Thanks guys!
You had enough immortals... but during the engagement at your natural, you sent them in LAST. Immortals are there to tank damage while your stalkers deal them. Even though you let him siege up outside of your natural (which you should never do) if you sent your immortals first, and followed with your other army, you would've crushed it. Also, don't send in immortals by themselves. Ever. Then need gateway support.
You could have expanded WAY earlier especially since you saw the wall-off, but you were floating high resources and could have expanded way earlier. Thus, you were only mining off of one base for a good chunk of the game because of it.
Immortals are great against tanks.. send them in first. Blinking into tank lines... kind of risky, and very situation dependent. Don't get into that habit. You probably would've been better off with chargelots too, because they charge into marines and the siege tanks to splash.
yes, I agree on the immortal front..I guess my hotkeys were just fuked up. But blinking stalkers into tanks isnt that why blink shd be used to nullify the range and get friendly fire? advice on hotkeys pls !
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On October 09 2011 05:09 vahgar.r24 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 09 2011 04:48 mizU wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 04:37 vahgar.r24 wrote:Ive just switched to toss from zerg as Ive hit a plateau with zerg. I came across an old thread which boasted that with just good macro , massing stalkers and A moving as toss will get you to diamond. I tried this theory in a game vs a terran - when I saw his tanks i obv did use some sense and get immortals. We both were fighting off 2 base but I still ended up gging..can some toss guys let me know what I did wrong please? And what are the best hotkeys for zeal/stalker/sentry/immortal army? http://drop.sc/41696 Thanks guys! You had enough immortals... but during the engagement at your natural, you sent them in LAST. Immortals are there to tank damage while your stalkers deal them. Even though you let him siege up outside of your natural (which you should never do) if you sent your immortals first, and followed with your other army, you would've crushed it. Also, don't send in immortals by themselves. Ever. Then need gateway support. You could have expanded WAY earlier especially since you saw the wall-off, but you were floating high resources and could have expanded way earlier. Thus, you were only mining off of one base for a good chunk of the game because of it. Immortals are great against tanks.. send them in first. Blinking into tank lines... kind of risky, and very situation dependent. Don't get into that habit. You probably would've been better off with chargelots too, because they charge into marines and the siege tanks to splash. yes, I agree on the immortal front..I guess my hotkeys were just fuked up. But blinking stalkers into tanks isnt that why blink shd be used to nullify the range and get friendly fire? advice on hotkeys pls !
I'm just bronze and don't know enough to answer the blink question, but i noticed that during the the first battle you started attacking marines instead of the tanks for a short period allowing the tanks to get a few more shots off on your stalkers.
And aside from the already pointed out problem of sending in immortals alone, you virtually only attacked the marines in the second battle, even though there were medivacs and so it wasn't that helpful; all this happened while there were a ton of tanks right there for your immortals to kill.
So i think if your army stayed together better and you focused the tanks more you might have won the second battle.
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On October 09 2011 05:09 vahgar.r24 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 09 2011 04:48 mizU wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2011 04:37 vahgar.r24 wrote:Ive just switched to toss from zerg as Ive hit a plateau with zerg. I came across an old thread which boasted that with just good macro , massing stalkers and A moving as toss will get you to diamond. I tried this theory in a game vs a terran - when I saw his tanks i obv did use some sense and get immortals. We both were fighting off 2 base but I still ended up gging..can some toss guys let me know what I did wrong please? And what are the best hotkeys for zeal/stalker/sentry/immortal army? http://drop.sc/41696 Thanks guys! You had enough immortals... but during the engagement at your natural, you sent them in LAST. Immortals are there to tank damage while your stalkers deal them. Even though you let him siege up outside of your natural (which you should never do) if you sent your immortals first, and followed with your other army, you would've crushed it. Also, don't send in immortals by themselves. Ever. Then need gateway support. You could have expanded WAY earlier especially since you saw the wall-off, but you were floating high resources and could have expanded way earlier. Thus, you were only mining off of one base for a good chunk of the game because of it. Immortals are great against tanks.. send them in first. Blinking into tank lines... kind of risky, and very situation dependent. Don't get into that habit. You probably would've been better off with chargelots too, because they charge into marines and the siege tanks to splash. yes, I agree on the immortal front..I guess my hotkeys were just fuked up. But blinking stalkers into tanks isnt that why blink shd be used to nullify the range and get friendly fire? advice on hotkeys pls !
You don't need more than one hotkey, If anything another hotkey on your blink stalkers.
Blinking into tanks is great if they don't have bio. Let the chargelots do that for you if they DO have bio. Also it really depends how clumped up the tanks are. Stalkers die kind of quickly to tank shots, which is why you want to blink them after a couple of volleys go off on the immortals, and try to spread them before you blink.
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hi guys i m looking for a building order for 1g fe
can some 1 help me wif tt?
thanks a lot!
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I have a general warping mechanics question. When you warp in reinforcements in the heat of battle, do you hotkey them first, then rally point them into the battle? I've watched many expert protoss replays and I never see that white rally point line protruding out of the still-warping units.
Also, in terms of hotkeys, I see pros flick through their army control groups rapidly during battle. What is the exact purpose of this? Is this a part of their micro to have to select their units via control groups ad re-position them during battle?
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On October 09 2011 15:20 SGilna wrote:
hi guys i m looking for a building order for 1g fe
can some 1 help me wif tt?
thanks a lot!
On October 07 2011 01:15 SGilna wrote:
hi everyone,
can some1 post a link to teach me how to do a proper a 1g nexus opening? i heard its strong..
thank you for yr much appreciated help :D
What matchup are you talking about?
PvT:
9pylon
13 gate (scout)
14 gas
16 pylon
@100% gate - core, zealot
23-25 pylon
@100% core - warpgate research, stalker
@100% stalker - stalker
@400 minerals - nexus
Then you add enough gates (2-3) to defend any aggression the terran might throw at you.
PvZ:
The opener is about the same as in PvT but you get another gas after the zealot and then you chronoboost a lot of sentries. You also add 2 gates fast after the nexus to wall and block any zerglings. I think this build expands at 33-34 food somewhere as opposed to the 30-31 of the PvT opener.
There is also another PvT build where you get another gas instead of the zealot and then make stalker sentry sentry out of the gateway.
On October 09 2011 17:10 (kimi)YaSu wrote:
I have a general warping mechanics question. When you warp in reinforcements in the heat of battle, do you hotkey them first, then rally point them into the battle? I've watched many expert protoss replays and I never see that white rally point line protruding out of the still-warping units.
Also, in terms of hotkeys, I see pros flick through their army control groups rapidly during battle. What is the exact purpose of this? Is this a part of their micro to have to select their units via control groups ad re-position them during battle?
I believe that is just preference. When you warp in units you have several in game seconds to hotkey and rally them. The order you do this in shouldn't matter if your goal is for them to join your fighting main army.
Yes, using control groups while microing is a lot faster than boxing stuff. It really helps if say you need to move your sentries back from some roaches so that you don't begin moving stalkers by accident. If they are just spamming 1,2,3,1,2,3 for example it's just some habit they have because it wouldn't really do any good.
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ok thanks alot...i m gonna start practising tis 1g fe build first b4 i move on to others..
trying to start to play a marco game now..
btw is 1g fe-the most basic/norm build of protoss nowadays? i mean..after scouting and realise its safe..
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On October 09 2011 19:37 SGilna wrote:
ok thanks alot...i m gonna start practising tis 1g fe build first b4 i move on to others..
trying to start to play a marco game now..
btw is 1g fe-the most basic/norm build of protoss nowadays? i mean..after scouting and realise its safe..
Yeah pretty much, other builds are too safe or too aggressive to be able to play an even macro game.
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Hey Guys.
I need some advice/help in dealing with the 'Polt Prime Timing Attack' in Liquipedia. It is basically a 1-1-1 all in that has no tanks but more marines and banshees (with cloak sometimes) but the real killer is that it hits at 8mins. Im not sure if one base pheonix or mass gateway units or one base templar is the way to go because I feel that the econmic advantage of the 1 Gate Expo builds everyone is using does not kick in sufficently at 8mins. Feedback and help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
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I'm pretty sure stalker sentry phoenix destroys the Polt timing attack, but I'm not sure, and I have actually never faced it before.
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On October 10 2011 08:55 Latchy wrote:
Hey Guys.
I need some advice/help in dealing with the 'Polt Prime Timing Attack' in Liquipedia. It is basically a 1-1-1 all in that has no tanks but more marines and banshees (with cloak sometimes) but the real killer is that it hits at 8mins. Im not sure if one base pheonix or mass gateway units or one base templar is the way to go because I feel that the econmic advantage of the 1 Gate Expo builds everyone is using does not kick in sufficently at 8mins. Feedback and help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
I think you just need mass gateway units against this and maybe observers for cloak. If there's no raven you can a lot more stalkers for dealing with the banshees and also as many zealots as possible to tank. And as already stated. If you can get phoenixes out in time they are really good against banshees. I think your best bet is going 1gate FE into a 5 or 6gate robo but it might be hard to scout in time. Templars will most likely not finish in time unless you rush for them but that's kind of a gamble. It would also have problems against cloak.
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Hey fellow Toss out there :-)
In my Odyssey of trying to take at least a few games away from zerg I tripped over
Plexa's old but still awesome PvZ overview
You can find it here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=167992
Attached to the Guide there is a replay of a korean Protoss
http://sc2rep.com/replays/download?id=2753
He opens up with two gates before core and chronoboosts two early stalkers to put on a little bit of pressure on the zerg. Then he gets some sentries and expands.
I kind of like this build an I have two questions:
1. Do you think this is still viable nowadays?
and
2.Is this something I can use as a staple build or just when zerg opens hatch first?
thx for any advice
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Italy12248 Posts
On October 10 2011 18:34 Forte11 wrote:Hey fellow Toss out there :-) In my Odyssey of trying to take at least a few games away from zerg I tripped over Plexa's old but still awesome PvZ overview You can find it here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=167992Attached to the Guide there is a replay of a korean Protoss http://sc2rep.com/replays/download?id=2753He opens up with two gates before core and chronoboosts two early stalkers to put on a little bit of pressure on the zerg. Then he gets some sentries and expands. I kind of like this build an I have two questions: 1. Do you think this is still viable nowadays? and 2.Is this something I can use as a staple build or just when zerg opens hatch first? thx for any advice
Only do it if he delays his gas a lot. Speedling expand gets the gas too fast for the two stalkers to do anything, and speedlngs wreck a couple alone stalkers. If he's going hatch first, or you notice slow gas and you don't want to cannon rush, it's definitely a viable opening.
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On October 10 2011 08:55 Latchy wrote:
Hey Guys.
I need some advice/help in dealing with the 'Polt Prime Timing Attack' in Liquipedia. It is basically a 1-1-1 all in that has no tanks but more marines and banshees (with cloak sometimes) but the real killer is that it hits at 8mins. Im not sure if one base pheonix or mass gateway units or one base templar is the way to go because I feel that the econmic advantage of the 1 Gate Expo builds everyone is using does not kick in sufficently at 8mins. Feedback and help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
Are you talking about a Marine Banshee Raven allin?
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On October 10 2011 18:49 Teoita wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2011 18:34 Forte11 wrote:Hey fellow Toss out there :-) In my Odyssey of trying to take at least a few games away from zerg I tripped over Plexa's old but still awesome PvZ overview You can find it here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=167992Attached to the Guide there is a replay of a korean Protoss http://sc2rep.com/replays/download?id=2753He opens up with two gates before core and chronoboosts two early stalkers to put on a little bit of pressure on the zerg. Then he gets some sentries and expands. I kind of like this build an I have two questions: 1. Do you think this is still viable nowadays? and 2.Is this something I can use as a staple build or just when zerg opens hatch first? thx for any advice Only do it if he delays his gas a lot. Speedling expand gets the gas too fast for the two stalkers to do anything, and speedlngs wreck a couple alone stalkers. If he's going hatch first, or you notice slow gas and you don't want to cannon rush, it's definitely a viable opening.
Yes, with good micro and knowledge of when to pull back, you can do crazy harass or damage. I have managed to snipe overlords, queens and drones several time without losing my stalkers.
On October 10 2011 18:50 Amornthep wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2011 08:55 Latchy wrote:
Hey Guys.
I need some advice/help in dealing with the 'Polt Prime Timing Attack' in Liquipedia. It is basically a 1-1-1 all in that has no tanks but more marines and banshees (with cloak sometimes) but the real killer is that it hits at 8mins. Im not sure if one base pheonix or mass gateway units or one base templar is the way to go because I feel that the econmic advantage of the 1 Gate Expo builds everyone is using does not kick in sufficently at 8mins. Feedback and help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Are you talking about a Marine Banshee Raven allin?
Polt is kind of the father to all these builds... Can't say I like his contribution to SC2.
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how do i deal with muta ling. i can't deal with god damn mutas. even if i get stalker blink, i lose to much probes/building from mutas and hurt my econ then he just harass me til death and mass muta me... and if i get too many stalkers to counter all his mutas, he'll have enough lings to kill my stalkers.....
i hate zerg. right now they are better than are other races.
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On October 11 2011 11:34 xmikeyy17x wrote:
how do i deal with muta ling. i can't deal with god damn mutas. even if i get stalker blink, i lose to much probes/building from mutas and hurt my econ then he just harass me til death and mass muta me... and if i get too many stalkers to counter all his mutas, he'll have enough lings to kill my stalkers.....
i hate zerg. right now they are better than are other races.
I'll try to help you out but it will be very generalized due to no replay. If a replay is provide we can help you out a lot more than just giving out generalized info. here we go with generalized info:
Getting the blink stalkers was a good a idea but blink is only good for buying time for HT with storm. the way I deal with mutas is try to zone with cannons with as little as possible then get High templar achieves and while it's building get blink to buy time for storm research. while keeping the stalkers alive and getting HT with storm, with the rest of you resources you can place into zealots(if you got a plenty of minerals). you'll most likely behind but you can push and earn yourself a 3rd.
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EPT
