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On July 24 2011 03:51 Sennap wrote:I know I can keep practicing and eventually this will only happen to me 0,0001% of the time. But I don't see a reason why I wouldn't just make it 0% right now 
The reason is because it will screw you over in the long run. You're trying to implement a crutch for your play that you'll just have to unlearn later, when it's much harder to change your habits.
You -do- need to keep practicing anyway, and this isn't the number one problem you have that's causing you to lose games. It will go away on its own, and in the short-term a-moving on the minimap will also solve the problem without leading you down a dead-end path.
Don't cut off your toe to solve a rash; treat it with ointment and wait for the rash to go away.
EDIT: http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-309-the-right-and-wrong-way-to-learn-5229698
What you're suggesting is equivalent to not using infestors because you're bad at infestor micro.
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On July 24 2011 04:35 philipov wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2011 03:51 Sennap wrote:I know I can keep practicing and eventually this will only happen to me 0,0001% of the time. But I don't see a reason why I wouldn't just make it 0% right now The reason is because it will screw you over in the long run. You're trying to implement a crutch for your play that you'll just have to unlearn later, when it's much harder to change your habits. Don't cut off your toe to solve a rash; treat it with ointment and wait for the rash to go away. EDIT: http://blip.tv/day9tv/day-9-daily-309-the-right-and-wrong-way-to-learn-5229698 What you're suggesting is equivalent to not using infestors because you're bad at infestor micro.
No, you're misunderstanding. A-attack doesn't have any advantaged over patrol-attack (that I can think of, and no one in this has suggested otherwise). So I'll never have to unlearn it.
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I was just trying it out in a unit tester with zerglings, and the pathing around corners doesn't seem so different, but I'm still worried that you you will have to change whether you a-move or p-move depending on whether you have scvs selected with your main army. I know terran likes to do that a lot, and there are plenty of times when I box all my drones together with any zerglings and roaches to defend, and I don't want to be thinking whether I should be a-moving or p-moving then. Having to use the appropriate key depending on whether there are any SCVs in your army sounds like it's a lot less effective, and keeps p-move from being a reliable replacement for a-move.
Also, I don't like that I can't tell my units to a-move to a spot so they'll attack any units on the way there, but -stop- when they reach that spot. with p-move, I have to micro my units just to have them reach their destination. This is another reason why you will continue having to use a-move even if you switch to using p-move.
As long as p-move isn't a complete replacement for a-move that lets you simply stop using a-move, it's my contention that it will be more effective to continue using a-move as you normally would instead of intertwining the two, and leave p-move to its specific uses. Mixing the two will just cause confusion in the middle of battle because you don't have a clear mental map.
If you continue having a problem, it's better to learn to a-move on the minimap, because that actually teaches you something you can apply to other situations.
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when you a-click, just make sure you a-click PAST the army. Your units will swarm the attackers and march forward to victory after they've killed everything.
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On July 24 2011 05:17 philipov wrote:
I was just trying it out in a unit tester with zerglings, and the pathing around corners doesn't seem so different, but I'm still worried that you you will have to change whether you a-move or p-move depending on whether you have scvs selected with your main army. I know terran likes to do that a lot, and there are plenty of times when I box all my drones together with any zerglings and roaches to defend, and I don't want to be thinking whether I should be a-moving or p-moving then. Having to use the appropriate key depending on whether there are any SCVs in your army sounds like it's a lot less effective, and keeps p-move from being a reliable replacement for a-move.
Also, I don't like that I can't tell my units to a-move to a spot so they'll attack any units on the way there, but -stop- when they reach that spot. with p-move, I have to micro my units just to have them reach their destination. This is another reason why you will continue having to use a-move even if you switch to using p-move.
As long as p-move isn't a complete replacement for a-move that lets you simply stop using a-move, it's my contention that it will be more effective to continue using a-move as you normally would instead of intertwining the two, and leave p-move to its specific uses. Mixing the two will just cause confusion in the middle of battle because you don't have a clear mental map.
If you continue having a problem, it's better to learn to a-move on the minimap, because that actually teaches you something you can apply to other situations.
Thanks for your feedback. So far this hasn't been too confusing for me yet (have only been using this for a couple of days), but your point is definitively valid.
On July 24 2011 05:41 SixPackAbs wrote:
when you a-click, just make sure you a-click PAST the army. Your units will swarm the attackers and march forward to victory after they've killed everything.
Yeah I know how it works but it still can happen by accident (blinking stalkers, units coming out from the fog). It happens to high-level players too.
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I like the idea presented. I'm trying to think of other application like this.
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I find I snipe my own units more frequently than I'd like (certainly more than my units like). Considering swapping my Attack and Patrol keys (they are right next to each other right now). Not sure if I will, but it's a nice tip, none the less. Might consider adding it to the 1000 Tips thread.
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I suppose it works for stutter step micro. I remember when I used to do it with 40+ marines, I'd accidently click on one of my ally marines. Luckily I play Zerg, so I don't have to worry about it as much.
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I Think the OP is useful for players who lack the discipline or experience to not panic and i have personally given feedback on players where they lost 1/2 their army because they right clicked behind the enemy army instead of right clicking an unit, a moving or patrolling. I believe the OP should reword the post to reflect that this technique is more beneficial to players who are trying to learn mechanics and have a tendency to panic.
Overall i don't think this is game changing or really beneficial to the majority of TL posters and should rather be included as a mini section in a guide rather then be its own subject, but please keep posting and trying to help the community and players :D
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It's rare but I do snipe my own units once in awhile... =[
not entirely convinced it's worth switching to patrol attacking though, especially now that I think about it, the only times I snipe my own units is when I just ask them to a-move from place to place and never during an engagement. That would just make patrol extremely frustrating
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Does this actually happen to people more than once every few months?
I mean, yeah this eliminates the problem.. But there wasn't really a problem for me to begin with. I'm much more worried when two big armies meet about repositioning, casting, misc micro and keeping up my macro than spending time correcting patrolled units that didn't attack move where I wanted them to.
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What happens when Patrol is Q and you want to play Zerg? No more Queens?
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Patrol attacking does not work with workers, they will just patrol and you've accomplished nothing.
Patrolling sounds good on paper and I think it would make a concave better. I think it would of been a better situation for you to test this theory and add it to the post instead of just stating the obvious.
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On July 24 2011 15:15 Sweetness.751 wrote:
What happens when Patrol is Q and you want to play Zerg? No more Queens?
rebind to 'a'.
edit:
On July 24 2011 15:19 Kornholi0 wrote:
Patrol attacking does not work with workers, they will just patrol and you've accomplished nothing.
Patrolling sounds good on paper and I think it would make a concave better. I think it would of been a better situation for you to test this theory and add it to the post instead of just stating the obvious.
you should re-read the op x.x
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you can right click a changeling to kill it
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On July 24 2011 15:19 Kornholi0 wrote:
Patrol attacking does not work with workers, they will just patrol and you've accomplished nothing.
Patrolling sounds good on paper and I think it would make a concave better. I think it would of been a better situation for you to test this theory and add it to the post instead of just stating the obvious.
I already said in the OP doesn't work with workers. I've tested a lot of stuff (check if melee units will behave strangely/worse using patrol-attack, if medivacs won't heal by using this, etc.). So far it's all pretty much equivalent to a-attacking. One thing I've found different is that a chost on "hold fire" wont attack when patrolled but attacks if a-attacked.
On July 24 2011 15:15 Sweetness.751 wrote:
What happens when Patrol is Q and you want to play Zerg? No more Queens?
Since Hatch/Lair/Hive can't patrol you can still use Q for making Queens.
On July 24 2011 16:07 Stropheum wrote:
you can right click a changeling to kill it
Yeah, that's true. It had already been added to the OP. But thanks anyway.
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maybe you can winn a battle with a few more units left... 1/4000 games where u misclick something so simple
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Can I just point out one thing at least? If you want to snipe a specific unit in the enemy's army, do NOT right click(!!). if you miss, you will spend valuable time trying to hit the right one again, while your army is suiciding itself into the enemy lines.
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EPT
