EPTHe also did a 1 Gate Robo no unit expand into a Zealot + Immortal. Does anybody have a BO for that?
[G]HuK! PvT 20food 1gate FE - Page 6
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NguN
Australia1322 Posts
He also did a 1 Gate Robo no unit expand into a Zealot + Immortal. Does anybody have a BO for that? | ||
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iChau
United States1210 Posts
It was all one-sided. I won with my macro and in one game I won with the 4 stalkers (LOL). I love this build, it balances economy and pressure quite well. I think the best transition is into forge + twilight into archons. In one of the replay I defend a early mm + 5 scv attack and later some pretty nice double attacks. | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
When you scout him first and he builds a marine before tech lab: Instead of getting gas ASAP, leave the geyser idle until right after you start your core, then put 2 into gas. That will get you 50 gas just a few seconds before core completes. You can throw a third on gas after you've saturated the minerals at 2 probes / patch. Then just leave your probes on gas forever. This way you don't need to pull probes off gas and reveal your plan. Because of the warpgate nerf: You can afford and have time to get two units before warp completes. Zealot -> Stalker makes sense, so does Stalker -> Stalker, or Zealot -> Sentry if you're into that. If you go for one of the 100 gas options, you're going to want to build a 2nd assimilator around 4:50, right after your third pylon, or else you'll be about 12 gas short for the 3 stalker warp at 5:40 (which is when you warp if you execute cleanly) You only need a small probe cut ever, at 21 probes (23 food), until you make the third pylon, after which you resume probes. | ||
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shizna
United Kingdom803 Posts
also, i believe that it only works because early conc shell marauder rush has fazed out. a lot of koreans seem to be opening tvp with marauders again, so it looks like this protoss build has had it's day already. | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
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Dommk
Australia4865 Posts
Other than that, it seems like an decent idea. EDIT: Can't remember if he got the 4Stalkers though, think he just did an expand with quicker warpgate tech | ||
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EternalSC
Sweden313 Posts
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GreEny K
Germany7312 Posts
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
On May 29 2011 23:45 GreEny K wrote: I die when the Terran goes for 2 rax, not sure if that is the counter, but it has stopped this build for me. Tech lab-reactor shouldn't be able to kill you straight up with a 2rax rush. Can I see a replay? | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
On May 29 2011 19:55 Keilah wrote: few little optimizations: When you scout him first and he builds a marine before tech lab: Instead of getting gas ASAP, leave the geyser idle until right after you start your core, then put 2 into gas. That will get you 50 gas just a few seconds before core completes. You can throw a third on gas after you've saturated the minerals at 2 probes / patch. Then just leave your probes on gas forever. This way you don't need to pull probes off gas and reveal your plan. Because of the warpgate nerf: You can afford and have time to get two units before warp completes. Zealot -> Stalker makes sense, so does Stalker -> Stalker, or Zealot -> Sentry if you're into that. If you go for one of the 100 gas options, you're going to want to build a 2nd assimilator around 4:50, right after your third pylon, or else you'll be about 12 gas short for the 3 stalker warp at 5:40 (which is when you warp if you execute cleanly) You only need a small probe cut ever, at 21 probes (23 food), until you make the third pylon, after which you resume probes. You don't always want a zealot or a sentry so early with this build unless the T scouts you early enough to 12/16 2 rax reactor tech lab so I don't know if it's worth getting the zealot before wg finishes and you definitely don't want a sentry to suck up your gas | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
On May 29 2011 20:09 shizna wrote: it looks like the entire build is 'trick him into thinking its a 4gate', but if the terran knows this trick is a possibility he'll scout at the right time... also, i believe that it only works because early conc shell marauder rush has fazed out. a lot of koreans seem to be opening tvp with marauders again, so it looks like this protoss build has had it's day already. No.. there's not as big a gimmick to this build as you are making it out. It doesn't straight up die to all rushes. marauders are not what scare you; it's marine-heavy 2 rax pressure with pulled scvs which the terran can only pull off if they scout you early enough and know to make this adjustment. this has been covered in the thread repeatedly. | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
On May 29 2011 23:52 Alejandrisha wrote: You don't always want a zealot or a sentry so early with this build unless the T scouts you early enough to 12/16 2 rax reactor tech lab so I don't know if it's worth getting the zealot before wg finishes and you definitely don't want a sentry to suck up your gas So get 2 stalkers, ez =p | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
On May 29 2011 23:53 Alejandrisha wrote: No.. there's not as big a gimmick to this build as you are making it out. It doesn't straight up die to all rushes. marauders are not what scare you; it's marine-heavy 2 rax pressure with pulled scvs which the terran can only pull off if they scout you early enough and know to make this adjustment. this has been covered in the thread repeatedly. OK, so if the terran scouts in time and makes the correct adjustment, is the protoss player 100% dead barring screwups by terran? I don't want to waste my time perfecting a counterable build. BTW, is the correct counter to build a reactor? Or just to pump marines with no reactor? | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
On May 30 2011 00:01 Keilah wrote: OK, so if the terran scouts in time and makes the correct adjustment, is the protoss player 100% dead barring screwups by terran? I don't want to waste my time perfecting a counterable build. BTW, is the correct counter to build a reactor? Or just to pump marines with no reactor? As I've already said many times in the thread, the correct response is to go reactor-tech lab 2 rax on 12/16. the terran can only make this adjustment fast enough if he scouts you first. So if you get scouted first, simply keep your probes on gas and do a less greedy build. | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
Can you really get 2 stalkers out of the 1st gate before WG research finishes when you're doing this build? replay please! | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
On May 30 2011 00:14 Alejandrisha wrote: As I've already said many times in the thread, the correct response is to go reactor-tech lab 2 rax on 12/16. the terran can only make this adjustment fast enough if he scouts you first. So if you get scouted first, simply keep your probes on gas and do a less greedy build. that wasn't my whole question, i asked if we were 100% dead assuming he adjusts correctly. | ||
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Alejandrisha
United States6565 Posts
On May 30 2011 01:57 Keilah wrote: that wasn't my whole question, i asked if we were 100% dead assuming he adjusts correctly. Yeah you are kind of dead. If you cut gas at 50 and do the build as it is listed in the OP you won't be able to save your expansion when he pushes with what he can make as well as 6-8 scvs. you can 'survive' by sacking your expansion, but he will get his expansion up and you will be contained for the time being and you will be significantly behind. | ||
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Keilah
731 Posts
Also, I did my variation where you get +1 probe and an extra stalker before starting gateways 2-3, so I had 5 stalkers at 5:45 instead of 4. Altho the word variation is kind of misleading since really it's just an adjustment for warpgate taking longer. | ||
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docoa
United States14 Posts
On May 30 2011 02:26 Keilah wrote: Just tried it with Darkness, the guy who wrote the 16 nexus OP. Maybe he misplayed the terran or something but I just pulled like 12 probes and murdered him. He was at my base around the 6min mark, was that proper? Also, I did my variation where you get +1 probe and an extra stalker before starting gateways 2-3, so I had 5 stalkers at 5:45 instead of 4. Altho the word variation is kind of misleading since really it's just an adjustment for warpgate taking longer. can u post a replay by any chance? I really hope to see how u got an extra stalker and still managed to complete gateways in time  | ||
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shizna
United Kingdom803 Posts
On May 29 2011 23:53 Alejandrisha wrote: No.. there's not as big a gimmick to this build as you are making it out. It doesn't straight up die to all rushes. marauders are not what scare you; it's marine-heavy 2 rax pressure with pulled scvs which the terran can only pull off if they scout you early enough and know to make this adjustment. this has been covered in the thread repeatedly. the point is that once this build becomes more popular, terran will be aware of it... they will know exactly the right time to scout in order to hard counter. not dismissing the build, it's just not what i would call a 'solid' build order. theorycrafting a bit, on large maps you can get away with 1 gate nexus or nexus first anyway... why would you delay this just to make it look like you're doing a 4gate? | ||
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