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On August 07 2011 14:10 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2011 15:18 Lordwar wrote:
Why does OP claim that if terran makes bottom wall ramp and marine dies then 6pool automatically wins? scvs can still repair those buildings and prevent zerglings from coming in and when next marine comes out the push is over. Due to the defavorable concave when waling at the bottom, the zerglings have much more surface area than your scvs. I haven't actually tested this but I'm quite certain that they out-dps your ability to repair.
SCVs repair pretty fast in comparison to ling dps. They should be able to keep it up long enough for you to get a marine out. If you don't rally the first marine to the inside of the ramp, then you're probably screwed though.
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I think only one SCV can repair the depot in that walloff.
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OP said:
"Always make the first marine pop INSIDE your wall off (even though it is tempting to go outside to kill the scout). If you pop outside and he has 6 or 7 pooled, you lost the game right there."
This is not true, and shows that OP doesnt know so much about this game afterall.
If your first marine dies because of lings, you can still repair that wall until your second marine comes.
Even if those lings outdps scv repairin in defavorable concave, repairing slows it down enough so second marine has time to pop out and kill those zerglins and eventually you get more marines.
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France13023 Posts
On August 17 2011 02:14 Lordwar wrote:
OP said:
"Always make the first marine pop INSIDE your wall off (even though it is tempting to go outside to kill the scout). If you pop outside and he has 6 or 7 pooled, you lost the game right there."
This is not true, and shows that OP doesnt know so much about this game afterall.
If your first marine dies because of lings, you can still repair that wall until your second marine comes.
Even if those lings outdps scv repairin in defavorable concave, repairing slows it down enough so second marine has time to pop out and kill those zerglins and eventually you get more marines.
The OP is protoss so he probably didn't deal well with 6 pool as terran and thought you had to pop rine inside base
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why are you trying to promote people to cheese their way up to masters league? in the end they are doing themselves no good because they cant play any other way.
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You won't lose if the marine pops outside.
That having been said, it's still better to have the marine pop inside so you can force the lings to pull back instead of you pulling your scvs and waiting for a second rine to pop
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I tested in unit tester, and it feels like if 4 lings are able to attack that supply depot while one scv is able to repair it, lings will outdps but it takes long enough to kill that building so terran has time to make another marine and it pops out about at the same time when that depot gets destroyed. Terran can simultaenously command one scv to build new supply depot while pulling rest of the scvs with one marine to kill those lings.
And if 6 lings attack barracks instead, then its even easier since two scv can repair that barrack which slows down lings dps so much that they cannot never go through it.
I see no reason why terran would loose if played correctly, in this situation.
Geiko is wrong.
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Hey guys, I love it when my threads get bumped every so often ^^
Don't make such a big deal of this 6 pool thing. I only lost to it once on slag pits, and I might have taken a bit long to react to pull scvs. but yeah, only 1 or 2 scvs can repair the wall, and 4 or 5 of his lings can hit it...
I'll do some tests and come back to you.
This is not true, and shows that OP doesnt know so much about this game afterall.
That's hard man 
^^
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On August 17 2011 02:55 Lordwar wrote:
I tested in unit tester, and it feels like if 4 lings are able to attack that supply depot while one scv is able to repair it, lings will outdps but it takes long enough to kill that building so terran has time to make another marine and it pops out about at the same time when that depot gets destroyed. Terran can simultaenously command one scv to build new supply depot while pulling rest of the scvs with one marine to kill those lings.
And if 6 lings attack barracks instead, then its even easier since two scv can repair that barrack which slows down lings dps so much that they cannot never go through it.
I see no reason why terran would loose if played correctly, in this situation.
Geiko is wrong.
Nitpicking much? It's obviously the correct play to rally the Marine to your ramp instead of outside the wall-off until you know there aren't lings stalking around out there. Whether or not it will lose you the game is irrelevant.
Seems like you just want to pick a fight with somebody.
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Canada10567 Posts
On August 06 2011 00:52 Squigly wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2011 00:46 Snaphoo wrote:On August 06 2011 00:37 Squigly wrote:Lol Protoss is the race made for cheese. You have so many to choose from. DTs? Proxy 2 gate? Maybe make some cannons? Or just 4 gate all in if you fell like it. 3 gate Proxy stargate all in is disgustingly strong against T and Z. Its also indistinguishable from DTs when scouting. (If not id love to know the diffs, would really help me out) Most people will just assume DTs from lack of sentries no expo etc. Your trolling is laughable. 4 Gate is terrible against any half-decent Dia Z or T, DTs are not cheese (unless Cloaked Banshees are Cheese?), and Cannons/Proxy 2 Gates will get you nowhere near a 50% winrate. If "cheese" is defined as strong all-ins, there should be 0% disagreement that Terran has the strongest (Tank/Banshee/Marine, Raven/Tank/Banshee/Marine, 6 Naked Rax, 2 Rax + SCVs, 3 Rax, etc. etc. etc.) Are you seriously saying that a DT rush is not cheese? And Who do you say is trolling? And yea, ive never seen a 4 gate win in pro leagues. Course not. Oh wait...... Oh btw have you heard of combatex? Cannons/2 gate proxy in master/GM and oh look hes really really good at it and rapes top players. Before you post think about what youve written. If its silly, dont click that post button
DT rush is not cheese. You can DT -> expand to punish terrans who don't play safe and for complete and total map control. It also keeps you safe from drops and forces terran to pool scans. If a DT is a cheese, then so is cloak banshee, and yours flies.
4gate is now just as strong as a 3rax allin/roach ling aggresion now. It's still strong, but it's not really easy to win with it in anything other than a mirror.
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Lol, this thread is still going strong I see.
I will say, I did this for a solid week straight and inflated my MMR to a point where I could not come close to winning a legitimate macro game as P (my main race). So switching back was a very useful experience, and I learned that my macro was at the time, quite a bit worse than I thought it was.
Another fun thing I found while doing this cheese, is that when I was using it, this thread was at it's prime and so was the density of terrans on ladder using this. Quite a few times we'd both scout each others' low ground wall off, and I'd win because they would commit and I'd make a bunker XD
I don't know about this, but I was having some success:
Instead of building the obvious low ground wall, I would use two rax and a depot at the top, with the depot in the middle. Maybe this is bad because it shows them both rax, but at my level (platinum), and the fear that was associated with the low wall off at the time, I was finding that people would not over commit to defense when scouting this wall as opposed to the low one. This was likely just a meta-game thing at the time, and also a result of my opponents' skill, but worth noting I suppose.
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On August 17 2011 03:34 Revelatus wrote:
Lol, this thread is still going strong I see.
I will say, I did this for a solid week straight and inflated my MMR to a point where I could not come close to winning a legitimate macro game as P (my main race). So switching back was a very useful experience, and I learned that my macro was at the time, quite a bit worse than I thought it was.
Another fun thing I found while doing this cheese, is that when I was using it, this thread was at it's prime and so was the density of terrans on ladder using this. Quite a few times we'd both scout each others' low ground wall off, and I'd win because they would commit and I'd make a bunker XD
I don't know about this, but I was having some success:
Instead of building the obvious low ground wall, I would use two rax and a depot at the top, with the depot in the middle. Maybe this is bad because it shows them both rax, but at my level (platinum), and the fear that was associated with the low wall off at the time, I was finding that people would not over commit to defense when scouting this wall as opposed to the low one. This was likely just a meta-game thing at the time, and also a result of my opponents' skill, but worth noting I suppose.
It's a symptom of poor play. Usually, when people scout 2rax, they will react defensively and pump units, allowing them to react better to cheese than normal. However, walling off at the bottom is also suspicious and will cause unit pumping. If the terran doesn't actually cheese with that wallin, ranged units can harass the walling depot/rax and there's not much you can do.
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On August 17 2011 02:14 Lordwar wrote:
OP said:
"Always make the first marine pop INSIDE your wall off (even though it is tempting to go outside to kill the scout). If you pop outside and he has 6 or 7 pooled, you lost the game right there."
This is not true, and shows that OP doesnt know so much about this game afterall.
If your first marine dies because of lings, you can still repair that wall until your second marine comes.
Even if those lings outdps scv repairin in defavorable concave, repairing slows it down enough so second marine has time to pop out and kill those zerglins and eventually you get more marines.
so you bumped this thread to be a total jerk?
On August 17 2011 02:43 Tiedal wrote:
why are you trying to promote people to cheese their way up to masters league? in the end they are doing themselves no good because they cant play any other way.
you making this comment is keeping this thread alive and therefore, promoting people to cheese their way up to masters league. if you really wanted to convey the message you inferred, please use a pm.
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On August 08 2011 01:27 Wyk wrote:
I think only one SCV can repair the depot in that walloff.
Three SCVs can repair the depo from inside the walloff, which is more than enough to out-repair 6 lings dps.
On August 17 2011 02:14 Lordwar wrote:
OP said:
"Always make the first marine pop INSIDE your wall off (even though it is tempting to go outside to kill the scout). If you pop outside and he has 6 or 7 pooled, you lost the game right there."
This is not true, and shows that OP doesnt know so much about this game afterall.
OP also says himself that he doesn't play Terran. Accuse his knowledge in whatever way you want, but at least he knows how to read. Sue a guy for contributing.
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Hey guys!
I would like to know if it is still working well this tactic currently, someone is still making quite?
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I think some people are not going to be happy with you bumping this thread.....
Anyway, yes. I have been using this for fun, as this is the only cheese I know, and I am a low level player, and yes it works lol.
Just do what Geiko says, he explained it nicely and clearly. Maybe if in the next patch, Barracks time is going to be increased, I dont know if that will have an impact. Most likely yes, but for now, it is working fine.
GL and dont cheese too much 
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Stop bumping this awful cheese, please -_-'
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Bumping it was fine. I never use this cheese, but reading about the thread helped me identify and crush it!
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Did I mention I got into rank 1 masters myself using this build (against zerg)?
It still is bad against terran, and dialing 111 is a better method against protoss
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EPT
