EPT[G] (T) 3 racks : Cheesing your way to GM league - Page 60
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Squigly
United Kingdom629 Posts
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Coriolis
United States1152 Posts
On August 06 2011 00:46 Snaphoo wrote: Your trolling is laughable. 4 Gate is terrible against any half-decent Dia Z or T, DTs are not cheese (unless Cloaked Banshees are Cheese?), and Cannons/Proxy 2 Gates will get you nowhere near a 50% winrate. If "cheese" is defined as strong all-ins, there should be 0% disagreement that Terran has the strongest (Tank/Banshee/Marine, Raven/Tank/Banshee/Marine, 6 Naked Rax, 2 Rax + SCVs, 3 Rax, etc. etc. etc.) Cloaked banshees ARE cheese. If you scout it they won't do anything at all. The only matchup where they aren't would be TvT, and thats due to mobile detection being harder to attain. | ||
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Lordwar
Finland243 Posts
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Squigly
United Kingdom629 Posts
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ZasZ.
United States2911 Posts
On August 06 2011 01:15 Lordwar wrote: is this build even cheese? i think it is legitimate all-in rather than cheese It's hard to say. I always defined cheese as an all-in that will only work if it isn't scouted or you get lucky. This all-in is pretty easy to scout (low ground wall-off) but at the same time, low ground wall-off doesn't necessarily mean this build. I've done it and followed up with a CC on 18. Generally people will overreact to the wall-off and fall way behind economically. I guess I would agree with you. Since it's easy to scout and less easy to prepare for, it's really an all-in and not a cheese. | ||
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Squigly
United Kingdom629 Posts
On August 06 2011 01:33 ZasZ. wrote: It's hard to say. I always defined cheese as an all-in that will only work if it isn't scouted or you get lucky. This all-in is pretty easy to scout (low ground wall-off) but at the same time, low ground wall-off doesn't necessarily mean this build. I've done it and followed up with a CC on 18. Generally people will overreact to the wall-off and fall way behind economically. I guess I would agree with you. Since it's easy to scout and less easy to prepare for, it's really an all-in and not a cheese. If this is scouted if will lose. Seeing a low wall is not scouting it. As im sure you know T: Bunker - win P: Senties -win Z: Make shit that isnt drones - win If its scouted, it loses 100% effect as its very very easy to counter. The whole point is that its bitch difficult to scout. | ||
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Giku
Netherlands368 Posts
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Squigly
United Kingdom629 Posts
On August 06 2011 01:50 Giku wrote: I guess I can safely say Cannon-rushing/proxy 2-gate will suffice then, thanks To cannon rush at high levels requires massive skill. Cancel micro is hard. | ||
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skatbone
United States1005 Posts
On August 06 2011 01:33 ZasZ. wrote: It's hard to say. I always defined cheese as an all-in that will only work if it isn't scouted or you get lucky. This all-in is pretty easy to scout (low ground wall-off) but at the same time, low ground wall-off doesn't necessarily mean this build. I've done it and followed up with a CC on 18. Generally people will overreact to the wall-off and fall way behind economically. I guess I would agree with you. Since it's easy to scout and less easy to prepare for, it's really an all-in and not a cheese. If you're following it up with a CC on 18, then you aren't all-in. When I play against this, the T never CCs. I would be equally as rage-filled if you CCd on 18 because I do shift my build order to react to this and I play extra defensive (and fall behind economically). | ||
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cilinder007
Slovenia7251 Posts
Even if he double CCs on 18 and you dont expand for 5 minutes you should still be ahead economicly... | ||
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dmnum
Brazil6910 Posts
On August 06 2011 07:42 cilinder007 wrote: how the hell can you fall behind economicly against this, he cut like 10 (or whatever) scvs and lost a shitton of mining time Even if he double CCs on 18 and you dont expand for 5 minutes you should still be ahead economicly... I think the zasz was saying he sometimes do a wall off on the bottom of the ramp, then go for 18 cc instead of 3 rax. | ||
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awakenx
United States341 Posts
Does that happen a lot? | ||
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Shintuku
Canada76 Posts
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Tweleve
United States644 Posts
On August 06 2011 13:15 Shintuku wrote: Question, is he getting orbital just to drop that supply depot later on? I feel like this build would be better if he skipped the OC, simply because having mules won't change if you win or loose. Depending how much damage you're doing with the group of marines you have in their base, its nice to mule to be able to stream a couple more marines just in case | ||
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EnSky
Philippines1003 Posts
On August 06 2011 11:58 deathtrance wrote: I did this build and I was called a motherfucking douche. Does that happen a lot? LOL. I tried this build in about 20+ games in season 2 but didn't encounter any BMs. | ||
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awakenx
United States341 Posts
On August 06 2011 13:37 EnSky wrote: LOL. I tried this build in about 20+ games in season 2 but didn't encounter any BMs. the one time i did it, i got BM'd | ||
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-eXalt
United States462 Posts
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Lordwar
Finland243 Posts
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dreamsmasher
816 Posts
On August 06 2011 00:52 Squigly wrote: Are you seriously saying that a DT rush is not cheese? And Who do you say is trolling? And yea, ive never seen a 4 gate win in pro leagues. Course not. Oh wait...... Oh btw have you heard of combatex? Cannons/2 gate proxy in master/GM and oh look hes really really good at it and rapes top players. Before you post think about what youve written. If its silly, dont click that post button you can open DT and transition into a macro game quite easily...it's a pretty standard build to go vs T and Z. you dont need to really cut probe production and can expand behind it quite easily. T definitely has the most varied amount of all ins. | ||
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Geiko
France2048 Posts
On August 06 2011 15:18 Lordwar wrote: Why does OP claim that if terran makes bottom wall ramp and marine dies then 6pool automatically wins? scvs can still repair those buildings and prevent zerglings from coming in and when next marine comes out the push is over. Due to the defavorable concave when waling at the bottom, the zerglings have much more surface area than your scvs. I haven't actually tested this but I'm quite certain that they out-dps your ability to repair. | ||
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