why has the discussion gone terribly off topic discussing inject larva?
advantage of backspace method = slightly faster disadvantage of backspace method = small chance of botching up
it's good practice to visit your base every 30 seconds at least anyway - to manage your overlords, tech, keep an eye on drone count/saturation. if you're not doing crazy harrass micro that requires 99% focus, then backspace method is uneccessary risk.
on topic though, i totally love this strategy and i really hope a variation of this can reduce the dominance of colossus deathball in PvZ.
Sen has already showed great infestor play in ZvP on his stream. Do rely on some spines for defence in the early game, especially against 6 gates since you won't have burrowed roaches to defend.
Your main spell to break apart toss' defence is infested terrans, not fungals. What you want to do is play aggressively and engage at the most ideal place possible - their bases (they cant run from infested terrans). Use burrowed infestors for multi-pronged attacks, while your main army engages. Spamming infested terrans does not only kill probes and delay mining, more importantly they force the protoss deathball to split or they risk losing more buildings.
Have 2 macro hatches (5 hatches in 3 bases) since you will be mainly spawning lings and microing infestors are apm sink. Always have some roaches instead of pure lings. This will maximize damage dealt with at least 1 row of roaches attacking behind lings. Spam infested terrans inside the wall while your army attack from the outside. Use neural parasites on any voidrays, collosus and immortals, fungals on stalkers and sentries.
I'm not sure on the best way to upgrade. For me personally, i would upgrade all of melee,ranged,armor slowly. Since you would want to transition into a mainly roach army when hts are out, and melee upgrades also affect broodlords. I'm also not sure whether ultras or broodlords would be better, but what i observed from Sen's play is, broodlords infestors with ground army support is quite micro intensive.
On April 23 2011 21:45 IPS.Mardow. wrote: Lol I tried this and got totally owned -_-
My opponent opened up with mass phoenix, then went void ray/stalker/colossi/high templar. Didnt stand any chance with any infestor combination.
yeah i think the meta game is changing as a result of this... I don't really see lots collosus/voidray on ladder as frequently now...
I believe mondragon's way to overrun enemy with roaches and drops is the best if protoss open up with mass pheonix instead of void rays. What you want to do is drone through your damage and saturate 3 bases asap. Then, focus on pure roaches production and put on constant pressure before toss can get a standard army.
You could also produce hydras but not over-committing on them, then transition into infestors to catch phoenixes. This is what Sen usually does.
I have been meeting a 2 stargate build quite often on the ladder now where they eventually transition into carriers. And my conclusion is that both hydras and corruptors suck against carriers unless you spot the carriers early enough and doesn't let them grow in numbers. The best solution if P has more than 6+ carriers is to setup for a base race. Because they will have 2-3 bases while you have 5+.
On April 24 2011 01:52 nymeria wrote: this is a fail strategy. i keep losing to mass warp prism-sentry.
they rape me with sentry drops at all my bases. my drones are trapped by forcefields, my zerglings can't attack, and my infestors are useless.
You, go back to the future, it isn't 2013 yet People aren't supposed to use warpprisms!
The way I transition out of infestor/ling if they go for HT's is baneling bombs and roaches. Because baneling drops are super effective on high gas low hp units, you can basically tear apart their sentries and high templar. While the roaches clean the leftovers up.
did anyone watch the ZvP matches on the most recent craftcup? with imbalowely vs underdark? he does infestor/ling and completely dominates a toss. replays are on sc2rep.com. copy the builds yo.
I would like to see a few more examples of this play in the original post. When watching those games, as amazing as it was, I saw the protoss sitting at 2,000 plus minerals.
Being said, I tried it myself and it is quite incredible. The infestor is finally becoming a cornerstone unit in zerg matchups. Fungal, neural parasite, and zergling combo is incredible.
I think that you want zergling over roach because of the upgrades. Playing this style, you, as a zerg player, should expect to get Ultralisk. Ultralisks plow through armored units, of which the majority of the Protoss Deathball is made up of.
Best way to counter is ht, if you have decent enough micro, you can feedback snipe infestors before they cause any real damage, and then your death ball can clean up rest. The trouble is reacting to the build and getting the high templar while still maintaining a strong death ball.
I've been having huge sucess with a build like this the last few days.
what i do is open without gas, drone hard until 40/50 supply and take the 4 gases at once (spanishiwa style) immediatly get a lair, +1melee and +caparace and ling speed. after lair i get something like 6 infestors to help my lings to defend. I get my 3rd and my 4th right after that.
I was having trouble dealing with stalker zealot and colossus until i started getting banelings wich annihilated everything.
then i was having trouble with a 1/2 stargate builds until i started adding mutas into the build when i saw 1 or 2 stargates.
later on i add ultras so i don't need to Neural any colossus to deal with forcefields.
I'm really happy to beat protoss once again =D
I usually don't get more than 6 infestors and i try to keep them on that number.
Here is a small video i've made to show the power of ling bling infestor to a friend against protoss:
God, I have been getting my ass whipped by every Zerg going infestors in PvZ. Fungal Growth is very very strong against the Protoss Death Ball. Together with Banelings and Speedoverlords, Zerg can easily take down all the Sentries and even Death Ball without much of a problem. Unscouted Baneling Drops in mineral lines is a GG. I am currently losing too much to this type of strategy.
On April 23 2011 21:45 IPS.Mardow. wrote: Lol I tried this and got totally owned -_-
My opponent opened up with mass phoenix, then went void ray/stalker/colossi/high templar. Didnt stand any chance with any infestor combination.
I will kill 2 birds with one stone in this post. A Spanishiwa style opening will stop any sort of Stargate harass and will allow you to take map control soon after by taking a fast third. He will die before he ever gets to High Templar. Stargate, Templar, and Colossi pretty much requires every tech path to get there which means he has no army at all for a long time.
Also by overproducing Queens it is harder to mess up the backspace method of injections because you always have a Queen for every hatch even though you might end up marching one across the map even though you should have been marching her there anyway.
On April 23 2011 21:45 IPS.Mardow. wrote: Lol I tried this and got totally owned -_-
My opponent opened up with mass phoenix, then went void ray/stalker/colossi/high templar. Didnt stand any chance with any infestor combination.
I will kill 2 birds with one stone in this post. A Spanishiwa style opening will stop any sort of Stargate harass and will allow you to take map control soon after by taking a fast third. He will die before he ever gets to High Templar. Stargate, Templar, and Colossi pretty much requires every tech path to get there which means he has no army at all for a long time.
Also by overproducing Queens it is harder to mess up the backspace method of injections because you always have a Queen for every hatch even though you might end up marching one across the map even though you should have been marching her there anyway.
Just wondering, how the Spanishiwa build does against a forge FE or nexus first build? If zerg takes no gases there's no way he can pressure a toss. It's a very defensive oriented build, so what happens if the toss just expands real quick and takes his third as well (Probably just not do a spanishiwa build and take a fast third yourself I reckon)? From the replays I've seen the zerg tends to underdrone in the midgame in order to gain a massive zergling count. But what if the toss just builds a really good simcity? How are you supposed to pressure his third?
EPT
People aren't supposed to use warpprisms!
