Good Read
If you want my advice, just play brood war for a good month, and try to get to D playing standard zerg, when you come back, you will be Masters.

The skills in Sc2 that are optional in lower leagues were mandatory in any league in Brood War.
You will be forced to play better

and when you hit Sc2, you will be able to have control of the mechanics very easily.

This is golden for zergs just starting out. <3

Snoyarc

United States101 Posts

February 26 2011 01:55 GMT

#62

Great post, I have been playing SC2 for about a week, but have been watching pro games since MLG DC, I know i'm Better than alot of the players im playing against but 1 base timing attacks almost always kill me, hopefully I can get back up to gold and keep getting better(i got demoted to silver last night)

Daveoo2

Australia19 Posts

February 26 2011 08:20 GMT

#63

Long but I forced myself to read it! Thanks a lot!

Arisen

United States2382 Posts

February 26 2011 09:17 GMT

#64

On February 26 2011 10:14 Twaxter wrote:
Good Read
If you want my advice, just play brood war for a good month, and try to get to D playing standard zerg, when you come back, you will be Masters.

The skills in Sc2 that are optional in lower leagues were mandatory in any league in Brood War.
You will be forced to play better

and when you hit Sc2, you will be able to have control of the mechanics very easily.

This is golden for zergs just starting out. <3

Well, if you create an iCCup account, to be fair, you're already at D

I think this is helpful, in a way, as it will punish you for having poor mechanics around the D-C range, and really punish you above that. Yes, you'll learn allot of the economic focused RTS basics by playing BW. However, BW and Starcraft 2 should be viewed, IMO, totally different games from a player perspective. I use BW references allot to pound my points home, I realize, but the sheer difference in BW zerg and SC2 zerg makes it something like a totally different race. In my opinion, you'll get more out of playing SC2 for practice than BW. BW has nothing to simulate queen's larvae inject which is probably one of the main problems facing new zergs. Also, you're learning a whole other system of hatchery management where you only had 1 larvae per (?) seconds per hatchery, and (theoretically) you'd never have more than one larvae per hatch after the first few minutes of the game, so resources flowed completely differently.

While I completely support anyone playing BW because it's a great game, practicing BW zerg to get good at SC2 zerg doesn't make the most sense to me, as, in my mind, they're apples and oranges.

Thanks for the suggestion, and if anyone wants to try this, more power to you, I just feel you'll get more out of your practice time by playing SC2 than BW

ReNhoSoft

Mexico69 Posts

March 12 2011 00:01 GMT

#65

Awesome guide, a really nice read. I got a question though, what are the main differences between the mentality of a zerg player and a protoss/terran player?

Communism

United States176 Posts

March 12 2011 03:38 GMT

#66

Great thread, im coming in kind of late but i did want to give my 2 cents on one thing.

Hotkey setup is largely preference but the undisputable most effecient way to hot key your queens is by having all of the queens on one hotkey, and then changing the base camera function from the backspace key to something more accessible... i like to use shift + space as mine.

So basically when i inject this is all that happens: (for 3 bases lets say)
I hit my queen hotkey button once ( 6 ) - 1 key press total
I hold shift and press V - 2 key presses total
I press space once and click on my hatch, while continuing to hold shift - 4 key presses total
I repeat this for the other 2 hatches - 8 key presses total

With the OP's method, this happens:
hit each queen hotkey twice, then press v and click ( 4 key presses per hatch )
repeated for 3 hatches, this is 12 key presses.

Another point is that with my method, I can inject 3 bases in under 2 seconds once my queens are selected and i press v i just have to alternate space and click for each base.

Also this way you can support an unlimited number of bases without having to have 4+ different hotkeys for your queens.

Sorry if this is slightly off topic, but I really feel like this way is undeniably more efficient than using any other method so if you are just building habits it may be a good one to use

DocSeverinsen

Germany86 Posts

March 12 2011 03:43 GMT

#67

Really nice thread! So much work... i will send my friends in here for some awesome zerg knowledge!

dogcore

Albania128 Posts

March 19 2011 03:00 GMT

#68

More zergs need to see this

Andwhy

United States91 Posts

March 19 2011 03:11 GMT

#69

Way to bolster our race, Arisen! Thanks for such an insightful, well thought-out, organized post. I'm also glad you gave up on the "Zerg is underpowered" concept, I think it's just harder/ more fun. You present wonderful commentaries on the powerful aspects of the zerg meta-game!

archdevilz

91 Posts

March 25 2011 13:49 GMT

#70

i'm sure alot of the stuff mentioned here are things that high zergs r struggling or striving to improve or perfect. definitely not just meant for low level zergs.

awesome post =)

MrJargon

United Kingdom158 Posts

March 25 2011 15:45 GMT

#71

I bookmarked this page since I don't have time to read it all right now, but I am definitely going to.

Questo

Sweden19 Posts

April 09 2011 22:28 GMT

#72

That's a very intresting read Arisen, I agreed with alot of your opening arguments and I also struggle alot with playing as Zerg on the ladder.

I will take your rules and pointers in mind next time I practice!

Dachef16

United States2 Posts

April 09 2011 22:39 GMT

#73

Wow this is a great guide for a player like me. I'm personally very stubborn about always trying to play a macro game, and I usually lose because. There just seems to be so many players at the lower levels who just want to rush or all-in their way to the top.

MrTortoise

1388 Posts

April 13 2011 09:58 GMT

#74

I have just switched to zerg, great post. I like your point about overlords ... very true. I'd forgotten the corruption day 9 episode .. that was pretty damn funny.

One thing you didn't mention is creep spread from tumors and queens.

One thing that i hadn't noticed whilst playing random 4v4 (I was P 1v1) is that you can use an active tumor to spread creep. I have read a lot about sc2 but have never seen that stated - I noticed by watching streams of people. I was using 2-3 queens to spread creep when really you just need a queen to start the spread. Given that creep gives vision (and slows down armies who want to kill it) its hugely important imo.

Maybe worth an include?

MrHavix

United States53 Posts

May 06 2011 21:27 GMT

#75

This is a great post. Respectfully, Arisen, I don't see a note specifically saying it is adapted from Day[9]'s VOD? I know you include it as a link at the bottom of the mechanics section, but my memory leads me to think at least the Mechanics section is a word for word transcript of his VOD. If it is, I'm sure Day[9] doesn't mind but perhaps you could preface your post with the VOD link and giving more direct credit?

Not trying to downplay your thread -- there is plenty of added value in transcribing his VODs as well as your own analysis.

Edit: Apologies if this starts a flame war, but...I've found a significant amount of content that seems like a direct transcript from Day[9]'s VOD(s). Why didn't you mention this in your intro? I specifically remember him saying this section:

One mistake I see allot of players make is looking at battles, even if they can't do shit about it. Watch a player like IdrA play from a first person perspective and see how much he's actually watching battles. Not very often.

Jayrod

1820 Posts

May 06 2011 22:22 GMT

#76

On May 07 2011 06:27 MrHavix wrote:
This is a great post. Respectfully, Arisen, I don't see a note specifically saying it is adapted from Day[9]'s VOD? I know you include it as a link at the bottom of the mechanics section, but my memory leads me to think at least the Mechanics section is a word for word transcript of his VOD. If it is, I'm sure Day[9] doesn't mind but perhaps you could preface your post with the VOD link and giving more direct credit?

Not trying to downplay your thread -- there is plenty of added value in transcribing his VODs as well as your own analysis.

Edit: Apologies if this starts a flame war, but...I've found a significant amount of content that seems like a direct transcript from Day[9]'s VOD(s). Why didn't you mention this in your intro? I specifically remember him saying this section:

Show nested quote +

It won't start a flame war, but that's pretty much common knowledge. That statement is definitely not day9's intellectual property. He just relays the same information in a way that makes sense to a beginner. All good players know to look away from the battle when the micro is done and I think it would be a shame to deprive the readers of this thread who may not have seen every day9 video of that information.

While I think the OP is fundamentally wrong on alot of the suggestions that its harder to play macro zerg than macro toss or terran or that zergs are allowed fewer mistakes (I find this to be exactly backwards to be honest), you have to give him credit for at least trying to help people and providing correct information on a forum where little "zerglings" (my word for sub-masters zerg players) are looking for help.

All the races are very unforgiving. This GAME is very unforgiving. Zerg doesn't have a monopoly on difficulty, they are just another race, where if you put enough time in, you will understand them and play well in your matchups. Its really no different. I play at masters level at all 3 races, but main protoss. Player matters more than race.

Malpractice.248

United States734 Posts

May 06 2011 22:29 GMT

#77

How do u feel about the pros/cons of
1-3 army, 4+ macro
vs
1-4 army, 5+ macro

I see ~1/2 the pros doing each :/ always thought MORE control groups would give u better control...?

Arisen

United States2382 Posts

May 07 2011 02:50 GMT

#78

On May 07 2011 07:29 Malpractice.248 wrote:
How do u feel about the pros/cons of
1-3 army, 4+ macro
vs
1-4 army, 5+ macro

I see ~1/2 the pros doing each :/ always thought MORE control groups would give u better control...?

If you see a need for an extra army tab go for it. The point of a hotkey setup is something personal to you, that you can use to it's full potential. If you're the kind of player who loves army control and gaining advantages in that way, and could see a way to better his army control with an extra hotkey, you should absolutely try it out. Tyler talks about this in a recent SotG where he binds his buildings to some outlandish shit (robotics to z, etc), but it works for him, and that's all that should matter; what works for you.

Cheers.

nicke10

Sweden114 Posts

May 07 2011 05:43 GMT

#79

Does anyone have good build orders for each matchup that yo ucould practice over and over and preferbly flowcharts as well so you hav ea good gameplan?

I've looked around but most are outdated unfortunately, the flowcharts.