EPT[H] 3 roach+speedling all-in PvZ - Page 30
| Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy |
|
aurum510
United States229 Posts
| ||
|
aurum510
United States229 Posts
| ||
|
eth3n
718 Posts
| ||
|
Basileus
United States103 Posts
| ||
|
HardCorey
United States709 Posts
| ||
|
Gooey
United States944 Posts
On February 03 2011 12:47 BrenttheGreat wrote: You did a 13 gate. If you 10 gate your warpgates are up earlier and you will have 1 zealot + 5 stalkers to hold it off. He is pretty much all in. With some micro and good unit composition + a little probe help if necessary you can fairly easily stop it and have an advantage. As far as I can tell this is a typical 1 base zerg push. That is a blind 10 gate, though. He is looking for solutions to stop it with a standard 3 gate zealot/sentry expand build. The thing that makes his persistence good, is that he wants his build to be as safe to everything a zerg can do as possible without deviating from the standard look of his build. It is what makes your build strong, by being able to use it effectively against anything. I think he realizes that it all comes down to scouting and using chrono boost on the right buildings based on what he scouts, and how is sim city is done. If you wade through some of the muck in the last 30 pages, there are a couple of good constructive posts of people who have gone and tested timings and analyzed when zerg got what in the replay, and how to react properly. | ||
|
Conrose
437 Posts
On February 03 2011 13:20 HardCorey wrote: Ive been using this for relatively close posistions ZvP all day and won 6 out of 6 times with it. Really strong build because most people wont fully wall off. It also doesnt seem to matter what unit comp they have. Every different skew of zealots, stalkers, and sentrys falls the same. The reason it works is because the Lings counter all the early Toss Units when they get a good surround, zealots are pummeled with Lings are assisted by Roaches. Lings are terribad in a choke, and that's the sole purpose of making the 3 Roaches, to break the wall and allow the Lings to engage in their element. | ||
|
LiveBreatheOwn
United States31 Posts
| ||
|
emc
United States3088 Posts
So I used this build, I modified it but it's basically what that wzp guy does: 14/18 gas 14/18 pool 16/18 roach warren @100 gas take 1 drone off gas 15/18 queen + ling speed 17/18 overlord 18/18 ling 24/26 3 roaches 24/26 overlord 24+ lings from here on out + overlords First overlord has to try and spot the high ground to snipe pylon or zealot, then stream lings in while rallying in. The only ones who have stopped this has been 1 guy who got a quick robotics and chronoboosted an immortal asap, I was able to break his front door but using probes and an immortal allowed him to hold my push. The 2nd guy spotted my build and apparently had enough time to get a forge, gateway and cybernetcis with a cannon and a zealot and stalker. I'm still figuring out a transition, but basically if toss can hold on they can win because I've had no success in coming back after trying this and not winning right away. ALSO! this build works EXCELLENT in ZvZ, works well against 7RR and other Roach openings, as long as you can keep your roaches a live and let the lings tank the damage and surround. It's very important in both matchups, that your roaches stay alive! I got a pretty damn good record tonight using this in ZvZ. | ||
|
ZeNd0kUn
United States331 Posts
i think it was 20% advice ( both sound and misguided ) and 60% BS of flaming on Travis, flaming on Protoss in comparison to Zerg and just 20% pure BS in general. Dear @Travis, I hope you find out a way to deal with this build and really appreciate it for posting the replay here so we can all check it out. I'm interested what you personally have come up with. PM me if you prefer. I guess you have to be a saint or something to get reasonable & positive feedback from a thread with no whining, no imba crying, no rebuttals to bad comments and suggestions. Or maybe you just have to be thick-skinned and know what to expect when you post a thread. | ||
|
TheAbysCries
Australia41 Posts
| ||
|
Klamity
United States994 Posts
i also think you should steal the gas when doing this build, it'll help limit the sentry count. | ||
|
wzp
Mexico9 Posts
WZP <---------------------- | ||
|
ZomgTossRush
United States1041 Posts
Step 1. There is no reason you shouldn't be seeing this roach warren go down, seeing gas after a decently fast pool is already fishy, that cancels out basically any sort of expand, except for maybe a speedling expand. Either way you should be dancing your probe in his base untill the roach warren gets down. Step 2. Obviously since you KNOW he is doing a funny roach aggression opening you need to actually vary your own build. You don't need 2 gas that early, sentries are great in theory, but you dont have the dps to deal with the lings. Step 3. Ideally you needed to get your 2/3 gateways much faster and focus on more stalkers and zealots rather than a few ff's. Worst case scenario you have to bring your probes to plug the gap untill your warpgate tech is done, but you had about 10 more workers then he did so sacking a few to gaurenteed a choke point is worth. Not sure why we need 30 pages of this... Anyways hope that helps. | ||
|
enderwiggnz
United States87 Posts
On February 02 2011 14:46 Dromar wrote: His mention of baneling busting seems a bit wierd. Though he did continue mining gas after the 176 for ling speed + 3 roaches, if he needs to baneling bust a hard wall (gate-core-gate), that requires him to build a baneling nest (which is 50 seconds IIRC) and 13 banelings just to take out your wall. I feel like in that amount of time/wasted resources to take out your wall, you would be in the favorable position. But again, I've never used this or had it used on me, pure theorycrafting here. There is a very similar banes + slings bust that can be in your base by 5:00. MxiuMxiu always always always opens with it, regardless of matchup. He's also able to transition out of it and go macro if the bust doesn't work. I'll post the replay of him executing it against me as P, its and extremely tight build and cuts drones at 13. I've since switch to Z and am totally aping MxiuMxiu's build. It is exceedingly effective. ![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-165920.jpg) | ||
|
Thiz
United States11 Posts
But i just read this post and tryed it just from watched the replay and my roaches got there way faster then his i dont know what i did but i just winged it same spots basically on meta. heres the replay: http://www.2shared.com/file/3mMx2Cun/ZvP_3_Roach_rush.html | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
Tried it on ladder, if you go for 1 gate - robo into 3 gate robo and chrono your buildings you can have enough zealots and immortals to hold it off. You really only need 1 immo and 5-6 lots, less if you fight at a choke. You didn't fight the build this thread is discussing, it hits well before you could possibly have an immortal out unless you do something weird like 10 gate, immediate cyber core, immediate robo spam chrono immortal, at which point you'd have no other forces. That, and an immortal isn't so great when the rush has only a small amount of roaches and is mostly lings. | ||
|
clayn
Germany444 Posts
| ||
|
VictorJones
United States235 Posts
The trick to stopping the build was not taking the 2nd gas, and instead pouring all early resources into stalkers, 2 zelots, and a sentry. If u want I could link the replay but I don't feel like uploading it ^.^ -2500-2600 masters | ||
|
scvtear
United States7 Posts
How I stopped it: Standard build up until cyber + 2 gas, when you notice he is throwing down a quick roach warren, you know the larva inject is coming at 5:00 so you have until 5:30-6 min depending on map and positions. After you scout this, throw down a forge, build one cannon at ramp with your zeal and constant chrono out sentries and warpgates. Then throw down 2 more gates when you have resources to. The attack: This part is important! You have to have good FF's and hold off the initial push, the real damage will come with the scouting OL who will give sight into your base. You need to have at least 3 sentries at this point (4 FF's assuming your first sentry was on time), when the OL is close to the cliff, use 2 FF's and push the roaches back from the cliff, then focus down the OL. If you can do this, the rest of the rush is easy to hold off with stalkers and sentries warping in. After this, you're in the clear to expo or robo tech. You'll be up ~10 probes with his expo just being underway. Hope this helps all the tosses out there. REPLAY: http://www.2shared.com/file/8Ys_-BE_/Z_allin_counter_5roachpush.html | ||
| ||
