EPTLets say I see a Protoss forge fast expo, and find a late 2 gas, figuring there's gonna be no pressure for a bit. I go ahead and take an early 3rd at 7 min 7 30 min. I drone somewhat hard, and as i see pressure move out. Without supply blocks, am I able to hold an 7/8 gate all in?
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BretZ
United States1510 Posts
Lets say I see a Protoss forge fast expo, and find a late 2 gas, figuring there's gonna be no pressure for a bit. I go ahead and take an early 3rd at 7 min 7 30 min. I drone somewhat hard, and as i see pressure move out. Without supply blocks, am I able to hold an 7/8 gate all in? | ||
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Douillos
France3195 Posts
On August 28 2011 16:24 Vod.kaholic wrote: I believe they would aggro automatically onto the queen if she is in range of the banes. From zealot and DT drops I've learned that they love auto-prioritizing queens over drones even when queens aren't attacking. Ok thanks for Info :-) | ||
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Salivanth
Australia1071 Posts
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Clbull
United Kingdom1439 Posts
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RyanRushia
United States2748 Posts
On August 28 2011 16:26 MasterMesa wrote: What is an appropriate response as Protoss against a hatch first (15 hatch I think it is?) when playing against zerg? if you're forge fast expanding, it's entirely possible for you to canon rush it, but beyond that i'd just take your own expansion. a 4gate or similar pressure MAY have a chance but with the larger amount of larva they'll have by the time your 4gate comes, i wouldn't particularly risk it | ||
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RyanRushia
United States2748 Posts
On August 28 2011 17:16 Salivanth wrote: When facing small amounts of Marine-Marauder such as from a 2-rax expand or 3-rax stim with a Stalker composition, should I focus fire the Marines or the Marauders first? marauders, they take more damage from stalkers per shot (10 vs light, 14 vs armored), and marauders deal more damage than the marines back | ||
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
1. If I see approximately 3 gateways and 1 gas, is it a good sign that he is 4 gating me? 2. WHen does the P normally send his scouting probe? And it is hard to know where he puts his proxy pylon, especially on big maps like Taldarim Altar. What do you guys normally do? 3. Army composition vs 4 gate, basically MM will do, right? Perhaps I have to put down a bunker? And lastly, I heard if their 4 gate fails, they are behind economically and in tech? Because I had this game where I went out for my push, and he had like....10+ stalkers and 2 sentries no zealots.. Grr at 4 gate lol. Thanks | ||
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Iyerbeth
England2410 Posts
On August 28 2011 23:40 DontLoseSightOfIt wrote: Alright....I have been fighting quite a lot of 4 gating Protoss lately....it is kinda annoying. Anyway, this is what I think should be done when I scout a 4 gate coming: 1. If I see approximately 3 gateways and 1 gas, is it a good sign that he is 4 gating me? 2. WHen does the P normally send his scouting probe? And it is hard to know where he puts his proxy pylon, especially on big maps like Taldarim Altar. What do you guys normally do? 3. Army composition vs 4 gate, basically MM will do, right? Perhaps I have to put down a bunker? And lastly, I heard if their 4 gate fails, they are behind economically and in tech? Because I had this game where I went out for my push, and he had like....10+ stalkers and 2 sentries no zealots.. Grr at 4 gate lol. Thanks 1: I believe it was iNcontroL (sorry if i'm wrong!) that said scouting a 4 gate is like building up a narrative of things that when they come together make a 4 gate more likely. When you send your first scout you'll be looking for things like the 1 gas, probe cutting at around 20-22, saved Chrono on the Nexus (or later, Chrono on Cyber Core as soon as it goes up) and what units are coming out of the Gateways. Also, if you FE, or you're close positions that can also make the 4 gate more likely. None of these things by themselves mean a 4 gate is coming, but they all make it more and more likely. There are various forms of 4 gate though so sometimes you won't always see these things or you will see other things (second gas for blink stalker 4 gate or the like) so the only time you can say it is a 4 gate is when you see those 4 gates up, so at around the 6 minute mark you need to scout again to be certain. If you're unable to see in to their base, then checking the front can be a good indicator. If there is no expansion, but there is a sizable army with no obvious robo tech, or only showing minerals, you can be fairly certain that it is a 4 gate. 2: The scouting probe varies from player to player. The most common scout is from the 13 Gateway production Probe, but the important point is that when you've been scouted it's very unlikely that Probe went home, even in none 4 Gate builds. Check the surrounding area's, check your third, check behind bushes, scout your base, check round corners that can lead in to your base, you will almost certainly find something (and if not, you haven't lost anything). If you do find a Pylon or a Probe killing them is an inconvenience for the Protoss, but it's not going to change their strategy. At around the 6 minute mark or slightly after you're likely going to have another Probe coming out to build a Pylon if it is a 4 Gate and you killed the Probe, and again it's likely to be trying to place a Pylon somewhere nearby so reinforcements can warp in while the Protoss tries to bring Pylons closer during the fighter. Tal'Darim Altar (as you mentioned it) check your third with the rocks, check down your ramp and around that little tree island, check the watchtowers and around the low ground near ish your natural. They're going to want it somewhere you have to leave your base to find, but close enough to help their push. If you can deny that Pylon, the 4 gate fails and you're ahead. 3: MM will suffice yes, but positioning is important. If you're suspecting a 4 gate, yes a Bunker will definately make your life easier and don't run off from it and let your Protoss opponent pick off your army in two parts. Don't run down ramps, dont get stuck somewhere a FF will cut your army off without support. Although it might be obvious too, keep producing units, and don't get supply blocked. That might sound like pointless advice but the Protoss will be increasing the size of their army every 40 seconds if you don't manage to deny the Pylon, and if you get supply blocked once or forget your production facilities for a moment, your army will slowly be over run. Again though, if you can take out the Pylon reasonably (that you can still hold if you go for it) that should be your goal. Without a pylon the 4 Gate reinfocements have to run from the protoss base and the 4 Gate will fail. 4: As to how behind the Protoss will be, that's based on the type of 4 Gate, how much damage it did to you, and how much they lost in it. There's no way I could say that a Protoss will always be in some position, but if they lose their units in an aggressive 4 gate for no economic damage on you, you will be ahead. It's up to you to find out how far ahead and make the decision to end the game or tech/expand or basically, get more ahead. Don't make assumptions about your opponent, scout them and stay safe! I'm only Plat so if someone corrects this post they're probably right, but I hope this helps. | ||
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Soluhwin
United States1287 Posts
On August 28 2011 19:12 Clbull wrote: What are the standard expansion timings for Zerg in each matchup? Your natural should be taken at 15 supply if you can, 21 if you can't. From there, it all depends on when you are safe, there is no set timing to take these expansions. For example, in TvZ, if you go for a standard 2 base mutalisk opener, then when the mutas come out you are safe because you have contained your opponent and gained map control, so that's a great time to take a third. As another example, in ZvP, if your opponent went gate first and your mid-game plan is ling/infestor, then when the infestors come out you become safe from pressure because the core of your army is now in place. You basically want to look for landmarks in your plan that give you the security to take a third. Taking your forth/fifth/sixth works the same way, and you usually take them at a time that puts you ahead of your opponent in bases. E.g. if your terran opponent takes their third, that's a good time to take your fourth. | ||
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Bassmasta79
United States9 Posts
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ChopSuey2
United States50 Posts
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-228801.jpg) | ||
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freaky]ftb
12 Posts
Once I finally decided to kill him I could kill all of his running expansions except his naturla but lost my (outmined) natural and parts of my main base including robotics and collosus tech. He then used a nydus worm to escape with his army. From this point he just outplayed me with the mobility of his army. I had the bases at the bottom line. (Map Nerazim crypt) and he just attacked with little forces everywhere and sometimes used nydus worm there was nothing I could do. So question is: How can I win defeat a Zerg in late game who goes for a base trade. Once the bases are destroyed I don't know how to handle the mobility of his army. Let's assume everybody has banked alot ofminerals and gas at that point of the game! | ||
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envisioN .
United States552 Posts
On August 29 2011 09:17 freaky]ftb wrote: I just played a game against a Zerg as Protoss. I was pretty far ahead in my opinion but I couldn't really attack because of his mobility. Once I finally decided to kill him I could kill all of his running expansions except his naturla but lost my (outmined) natural and parts of my main base including robotics and collosus tech. He then used a nydus worm to escape with his army. From this point he just outplayed me with the mobility of his army. I had the bases at the bottom line. (Map Nerazim crypt) and he just attacked with little forces everywhere and sometimes used nydus worm there was nothing I could do. So question is: How can I win defeat a Zerg in late game who goes for a base trade. Once the bases are destroyed I don't know how to handle the mobility of his army. Let's assume everybody has banked alot ofminerals and gas at that point of the game! If the Zerg is really THAT much more mobile than your army, chances are that your army is MUCH more powerful in a straight up fight. Units like the zergling and mutalisk are fast and good for harrass, but in a big fight they aren't as useful as other units. If you get to the late game and zerg is harrassing all of your bases, just go kill him. Attacking his main will force him to retreat or lose all his tech. | ||
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Sina92
Sweden1303 Posts
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
i took this as an example Server: SEA TL ID: LimitSEA B.Net ID.IDENTIFIER: Limit.244 ProfileURL: http://sea.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/367159/1/Limit/ Sc2RanksURL: http://sc2ranks.com/sea/367159/Limit Other: Mid level bronze zerg player looking for help with mid/late game, currently relying too much on early game all ins, any help/race needed. SO i went to BNet and "add character friend" What do I put for characters' name? (is it Limit) what do i put for character's code?(is it 244) second question, when i first bought this game my char code was 321. now its 558. how come it changed? | ||
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Tribune
Australia60 Posts
On August 29 2011 19:41 DontLoseSightOfIt wrote: I have a simple, quick question regarding Practice partner thread. i took this as an example Server: SEA TL ID: LimitSEA B.Net ID.IDENTIFIER: Limit.244 ProfileURL: http://sea.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/367159/1/Limit/ Sc2RanksURL: http://sc2ranks.com/sea/367159/Limit Other: Mid level bronze zerg player looking for help with mid/late game, currently relying too much on early game all ins, any help/race needed. SO i went to BNet and "add character friend" What do I put for characters' name? (is it Limit) what do i put for character's code?(is it 244) second question, when i first bought this game my char code was 321. now its 558. how come it changed? Im pretty sure the character's name is just Limit yes and yes his code is 244. The reason your character code changed is because everybody got a free name change and, correct me if i'm wrong, you had to re-enter/change your character name at some point therefore resetting your bnet ID. | ||
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Tribune
Australia60 Posts
On August 29 2011 09:17 freaky]ftb wrote: I just played a game against a Zerg as Protoss. I was pretty far ahead in my opinion but I couldn't really attack because of his mobility. Once I finally decided to kill him I could kill all of his running expansions except his naturla but lost my (outmined) natural and parts of my main base including robotics and collosus tech. He then used a nydus worm to escape with his army. From this point he just outplayed me with the mobility of his army. I had the bases at the bottom line. (Map Nerazim crypt) and he just attacked with little forces everywhere and sometimes used nydus worm there was nothing I could do. So question is: How can I win defeat a Zerg in late game who goes for a base trade. Once the bases are destroyed I don't know how to handle the mobility of his army. Let's assume everybody has banked alot ofminerals and gas at that point of the game! If you can take out the zerg's main (tech structures), he won't be able to produce anything usefull for a LONG time. So in a base trade scenario that's what you want to go for. Then you need to defend what scraps you have left and try to confront him head on, his mining bases won't do much good until he has his tech structures back up and if you manage to save some of yours, its just a matter time before you can roll him over. As day[9] says when you ask "how do you counter the unusual x strategy?" "just go fucking kill him". | ||
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dynwar7
1983 Posts
On August 29 2011 19:52 Tribune wrote: Im pretty sure the character's name is just Limit yes and yes his code is 244. The reason your character code changed is because everybody got a free name change and, correct me if i'm wrong, you had to re-enter/change your character name at some point therefore resetting your bnet ID. Yes, I did use my name change once, in fact it was two weeks ago. Is this why my code number changed also? | ||
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ToastieNL
Netherlands845 Posts
I would like to practice my Protoss a bit. I do have quite a decent understanding of the race and a lot of the basic knowledge. I player Random in Beta, and some Protoss afterwards. My question is; Could you supply me with 1/2 builds/race? Build that are safe and easy to execute, but still macro- esce, not all ins. I would like the ability to put on some pressure, but not necessarilly. PvP, preferably your two prefered anti- 4-gate builds! Kind regards, Toastie | ||
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MannerMan
371 Posts
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