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I added one of Shankapotamus's plat reps which illustrate some nice micro.
Also, as a general request, can those who use this often share their turret placement/marine micro tricks. Screen caps with a brief description would be preferable.
IE:
Turret Behind the Minerals
![[image loading]](http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/6168/turretsbehindminerals.jpg)
Turrets behind the minerals is one of the most basic uses for Raven harass. Positioning turrets like this makes them extremely hard to attack with melee units effectively and the long lifespan of each turret denies mining for 3/4 minutes. If left alone long enough both geysers and hatches will die to turret fire.
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This above screenshot is my common turret use by far. I usually group them a little bit tighter though to make them even more difficult to kill for lings. (ppl rarely waste banes on the turrets). The only other places I use turrets are randomly around the map to try to block banes from my marines, panic turrets to defend from mutas and once I have a huge ball I just throw them down all over the zerg base to finish the game.
In regards to blocking banes, I find this is less efficient use of my apm then just splitting my marines as often as possible except maybe to block a ramp.
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On November 14 2010 23:38 statikg wrote:
This above screenshot is my common turret use by far. I usually group them a little bit tighter though to make them even more difficult to kill for lings. (ppl rarely waste banes on the turrets). The only other places I use turrets are randomly around the map to try to block banes from my marines, panic turrets to defend from mutas and once I have a huge ball I just throw them down all over the zerg base to finish the game.
In regards to blocking banes, I find this is less efficient use of my apm then just splitting my marines as often as possible except maybe to block a ramp.
Actually, using them to ramp block is great. The best way to deal with banes turret wise is to throw turrets down in zerg's likely routes of reinforcing when you attack an expo so they have to run through a turret line(Can't a-move) or go around.
Actually all the best baneling counters(like spread out your marines and stuff) occur before battles with zerg armies so  .
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When is the micro tricks section coming?
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On November 15 2010 02:25 freezeframe wrote:
When is the micro tricks section coming?
When its done :D I don't make videos or have a youtube account so I have to write everything out and take screen caps.
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How effective is the patrol spread micro trick in regards to splitting for banelings? has anyone tried this out yet??
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Patrol spread does a help a little bit, but it doesn't work when the enemy is in target acquisition range. So you need to do it a before you engage, which can be cumbersom. It's also inconsistent, if you're on patrol and the enemy engages you, the patrollers will group up again slightly unless you hold position after they spread.
Also sense you have to do it before you engage, your spread will be clumped when you go to attack move a target area. It's best on defense when your just holding ground for a moment. And quite effective at that.
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I just noticed while watching the replays, that both turret range and building armor upgrades applies to Raven's AutoTurrets, would those both be worth getting? Turrets are usefull to soak damage so +2 armor could be quite powerful
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On November 15 2010 05:22 BobMcJohnson wrote:
I just noticed while watching the replays, that both turret range and building armor upgrades applies to Raven's AutoTurrets, would those both be worth getting? Turrets are usefull to soak damage so +2 armor could be quite powerful
Definitely worth getting building armor, and most people usually do. +2 armor also makes p-forts, bunkers, and missile turrets pretty robust too. Hi-sec auto tracking is nice too, although most people don't get it - probably hecause it ties up the eng bay.
I noticed in kme's most recent replay pack that he wasn't getting building armor. If it was anyone else I would assume they forgot or something, but kme was leaning more on tanks in those games and less on auto turrets to cover the marines so that's probably the reason. He may care to elaborate further.
By the way I wanted to take a minute to applaud the exquisite marine micro displayed in kme's third replay pack. It's calm and elegant, obviously resulting from a lot of practice. He just smoothly cuts slices and positions them so that banelings do very little damage. There is no sense of that frantic panic you usually see when banelings are chasing marines. It was a pleasure to watch, and here's the surprise: his apm is only around 100-120 on average. Stay calm and split intelligently and you don't need lightning fingers.
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I started finally watching those KME reps.
Some interesting stuff:
The one from HammerTime was pretty good. He was probably the most interesting zerg I've seen so far. Bling drops, building nothing but sling/blings and expoing. Its too bad that zerg get so larva blocked if they stay on lings because while HammerTime had the right idea, he couldn't actually build drones. I think getting a third hatch in the main is something that has to be done if someone is wanting to do an expo style that emphasizes lings. You can throw up quite a few hatches with extra minerals but they'll probably die before they produce any large amount of drones unless its in your base.
Will update as I go.
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Yea, he pulled off the Foxer style rine/medivac strategy very well. I enjoyed watching his marine micro in these games.
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Wow, good for kawaii. I haven't seen him play much since beta. It's funny that pros keep doing well with mass marines and we still get people popping in here to say "mass marine sucks, hard countered by x and y"
I'd love to see the replays once they're released.
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I just lost to this, both armies were maxed (my infestor/ling vs his marine/raven), the problem was my infestors couldnt kill anything nearly quick enough, so I would fungal around the same time he cast HSM on all my infestors, I would spawn infested terrans as quickly as possible (they're way too difficult to cast imo, gotta hit T every time >.>) but all my infestors would die, the ravens would take a couple casualties but overall would leave unscathed, and this just happened over and over until I ran out of moneys.
So, my question is, what's the best unit comp to deal with this (since really, at 200/200, unit comp is what matters along with ups)? I feel like corruptors are the only real option, but if I go for them my ground army will just lose and cry and they might die anyways to HSM.
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Once there is a ball of ravens 5+ you probably already lost, as soon as you realize this is happening you need to do a couple things
1) start spreading creep
2) get baneling speed
3) get some mutas for harass and for picking off ravens
4) start getting armor upgrades
5) make toooons of lings, drop an extra hatch in base if u need larva
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On November 15 2010 12:14 statikg wrote:
Once there is a ball of ravens 5+ you probably already lost
That feels really overpowered on a race with the best turtle in game :/
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I'm not a particularly great player (~1800 Diamond), but I love this build. However, I kept running into more and more players who went 2 base Baneling/Speedling rush and wasn't able to defend it without taking massive damage, so I started doing a more methodical Marine/Medivac/Tank push. Instead of splitting Marines and leaving them to die to Banelings, I try to set up some Tanks behind my Marines, do a little damage, and run when the Banelings come. If they chase me, they get shot down by the Tanks, and if they don't, I do free damage. However, this can leave your Tanks vulnerable to Mutalisks, so I like to build some Turrets along the way. I just didn't like the idea of sacrificing Marines to Banelings constantly when I could pick them off with Tanks instead.
Here's a replay to show the strategy in action. Again, I'm nowhere near a pro, so take it for what it's worth. Although I did make mistakes, eventually I won the war of attrition. Thanks to the OP for sharing the build!
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-165948.jpg)
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I just saw Drewbie start adding Ravens in the Undeniably Gamer Tournament finals. His style wasn't quite the same, since he made heavy use of medivacs, banshee and Thors while on his first two bases, and only added the Ravens after taking his third.
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I only have one replay in which I went battlecruisers against Zerg. He responded by massing hydras instead. >_>
I was wondering if adapting the marine/raven build into marine/battlecruiser build might be more viable with a more streamlined build.
The goal is to get Zerg to swap ground army for something that can fire back against the battlecruisers. So long as you can hold out against their early and attacks and keep the aggression on them you can save up for a battlecruiser. Then their zergling, baneling, roach armies are in trouble. Mutas are very costly in terms of gas and that will further slow their ground army and weaken them if they choose to mass a lot more mutas to deal with the battlecruisers.
Hydras are one way also but quite honestly, I think hydras are easier to deal with than banelings and zerglings. And if they do that you can cut battlecruisers again to mass grab more ravens and save those minerals for more marines or whatnot.
Forcing them to again keep watching your tech swap. Ravens also do very well against hydras. Being slower in general than mutas they are under risk from the missile and for some reason, autoturrets seem to do slightly better against hydras than roaches.
What do you guys think?
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EPT
