EPT[G] ZvP: I offer to TeamLiquid the Fail Pool - Page 4
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XdsZmX
21 Posts
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starcraft2leverage
United States207 Posts
On October 15 2010 11:47 Jermstuddog wrote: @Obsolescence Sorry for not including enough pretty pictures. I am not asking for help on how to properly execute a Fail Pool rush. I know very well how to do it and I am sharing that knowledge with TL. I could have labelled it [D] as I intended to answer any questions people may have about it that I didn't cover specifically in the OP, but I figured the [G] tag fit best with what I wanted to do, which is share a strategy that I have found to be viable at mid-diamond levels. I will add more bold text to the OP if it makes you feel better. edit: Bolds added sir, sorry for the inconvenience. Thanks for the thread, I'm definitely going to try this out. Don't listen to the negative nancy. | ||
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OreoBoi
Canada1639 Posts
On October 15 2010 12:20 XdsZmX wrote: Just wondering, how does this work out against a 10-gate early pressure into FE build? Even vs 6-pool, the toss is constantly chronoing the zealots and the first one will come out on time, or maybe a second or two late to defend. With the toss pulling 3-4 probes along with the zealot, he should no fine, no? Even if you run straight for the toss probe line, he can defend for a few seconds using just his probes and be still be in a good condition. Just don't see how this is viable, considering how often 10-gate pressure is seen vs zerg. You can't get the zealot out unless you want to not completely wall in. For example, If it's scrap station, I could chrono a zealot out, but then a runby is so easy to do. | ||
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Jermstuddog
United States2231 Posts
On October 15 2010 10:49 Subversion wrote: I just wanted to ask you if you could clarifiy the "body block" that forces the zealot to spawn on the inside? Could you explain how you do that? If you give a screenshot that would be awesome, but I understand if thats too much trouble  http://nerdnugget.com/download/file.php?id=93 It's a terrible game in general, I just chose to play like a retard for some reason. But it has a great example of "body blocking" at the 3 minute mark. I use all my lings to block his gateway and his zealot is forced to come out on the inside of his base and be useless rather than outside where he can defend. I can juggle his two gateways for 3 zealots. The obvious counter to this would be to make 2 zealots at the same time, but then your poor guy is stuck 1 vs 7 when he comes out. I added this rep to the OP as well so people can understand the tactic that I mention. | ||
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Mugiwara
3 Posts
On October 15 2010 01:31 Eknoid4 wrote: forge first every single game guarantees zerg gets as early an expansion as he wants. oh really? the zerg can expand as soon as he wants anyway since the zealot buildtime nerf. mb except on steppes when the toss plays dual 10 gate or some shit like that. and the thing is, if you play forge first, you want to do one of the following things: 1. Block the choke with 2 pylons and 1-2 cannons 2. block the natural with 1 pylon+1 cannon both things prevent an early expo of the zerg much better than any gate first build. that prevents the zerg from taking his natural early, or forces him to take another expansion far away from his main. if you are still affraid of zealot pressure in the beginning of the game, you definitly do something wrong.... | ||
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Skrag
United States643 Posts
On October 15 2010 11:15 ittarter wrote: This seems a good counter to the all-in 6 pool. Dunno if you guys were aware of it. GJ reading the thread, which doesn't describe a 6pool, and is not all-in. | ||
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Skrag
United States643 Posts
On October 15 2010 12:12 Adeny wrote: http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=catz vs time&aq=f I haven't seen every single vod, check it out. That search turns up absolutely nothing for me. Got any specific links to vods? | ||
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Spaceknight
United States1 Post
Toss has to keep a steady production of zealots in order to eventually defeat the stream of zlings. This is basically an All-in if it fails because you'll be way behind in production and income. | ||
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Champ24
177 Posts
On October 16 2010 03:03 Spaceknight wrote: 8/9 1300+ diamond zergs tried this on me yesterday. All of them failed. Dropping a 2nd gate while chronoboosting zealots along with using worker probes to surround the zlings really defeats this. Toss has to keep a steady production of zealots in order to eventually defeat the stream of zlings. This is basically an All-in if it fails because you'll be way behind in production and income. Replay? Would be helpful to further this discussion. | ||
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Skrag
United States643 Posts
On October 16 2010 03:39 Champ24 wrote: Replay? Would be helpful to further this discussion. I'd be interested in seeing one or two of those replays too. | ||
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DarKFoRcE
Germany1215 Posts
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warriv13
Canada2 Posts
On October 16 2010 03:39 Champ24 wrote: Replay? Would be helpful to further this discussion. well the thing is it wouldnt further this discussion because it has nothing to do with it at all, the point of this thread as the OP stated several times is to make SIX FAST lings to harass the protoss ONLY SIX meanwhile you are pumping drones and expanding I really like this idea even if it is micro intensive since it gives the zerg more options early game to fluster the toss | ||
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tehemperorer
United States2183 Posts
On October 16 2010 03:03 Spaceknight wrote: 8/9 1300+ diamond zergs tried this on me yesterday. All of them failed. Dropping a 2nd gate while chronoboosting zealots along with using worker probes to surround the zlings really defeats this. Toss has to keep a steady production of zealots in order to eventually defeat the stream of zlings. This is basically an All-in if it fails because you'll be way behind in production and income. The 1300+ Zergs probably are in the beginning stages of using the strat, so aren't accustomed to controlling their units at this stage in the game. When adopting a new build order, there is always an adjustment period between when the steps are executed consciously and when they are executed automatically. | ||
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Benshin88
United States183 Posts
Mean while you can expo or drone up for a baneling attack. | ||
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Jermstuddog
United States2231 Posts
On October 16 2010 05:45 DarKFoRcE wrote: if you want to build 2 drones and then an overlord i would suggest to use an 8 pool This has already been addressed, making 8 drones before pool delays the lings by 17 seconds (game time). This gives plenty of time for that first zealot to be chrono boosted out and significantly reduces the pressure on the protoss player. 7 pool is the slowest pool you can make that still gets inside Ps base before the first zealot is out. Timing is based on the very standard 12 gate opening. | ||
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ittarter
United States13 Posts
On October 16 2010 02:33 Skrag wrote: GJ reading the thread, which doesn't describe a 6pool, and is not all-in. Regardless the strategy is relevant to the thread posts re: defense against the six lings with zealot and probe wall. | ||
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