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I'm having some trouble with ZvZ when my opponent goes fast muta/ling/spine mass expand.
Currently my solution is to be very active while scouting and throw down a hydra den + infestation pit when I suspect spire/mutas are on the way.
Once the hydras and 2 - 3 infestors are out, I play defensive to secure my 3rd. Once I have 3 bases (if I didn't take too long to get my 3rd) I can usually play standard with slightly more hydras than I normally would + overseer for blings.
But I feel like this approach is a bandaid of a solution, any tips? please!
Thank you!
Fairchild
Coz he has so many spines he probably wont be able to put pressure until his mutas are out. What i do is i take a quick third and go mutas as well. On 6 gases u can make more mutas with better upgrades. if he does switch to infestors or hydras u shld b able to whoops his ass on 3 bases since hes counting on his mutas to keep u contained while he get his third.
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hi guys i would like to begin playing zerg so i think it would be cool if you guys could recommend me the most macro oriented builds/openers you can think of and maybe go into a little more depth about zvz since i feel from watching a lot of high level games that i have a better understanding of zvt and zvp than zvz.
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I'm back from about 10 months of playing League of Legends with zero Starcraft II. I was okayish (diamond afaik) when I quit, just looking for someone to give me a quick jump start. Stuff like send your ovie out etc. Battlenet name is BouBou, char code is 865. Would appreciate it, I have skype and teamspeak.
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I've been having an issue with my Mid and late game ZvZ. I go roach/infestor and usually lose to non-stop harass. I simply fall behind and lose. I feel that I get enough upgrades and have a good army comp but whenever I get into a battle or just settle down from an event, more harass happens and I feel pinned back and under constant attack. What can I do to fix this?
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What is the best way to deal with Froge FE into phoenix's into Chargelot/Archon?? Should I even make Hydras?
1k masters
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On October 11 2011 14:41 Deatheus89 wrote:
Coz he has so many spines he probably wont be able to put pressure until his mutas are out. What i do is i take a quick third and go mutas as well. On 6 gases u can make more mutas with better upgrades. if he does switch to infestors or hydras u shld b able to whoops his ass on 3 bases since hes counting on his mutas to keep u contained while he get his third.
Thank you! What are a couple big hints that he is going muta and around when do u notice these tells?
Currently I just look for him to saturate his natural's gas before he even finishes saturating it's minerals. However I feel this is only one approach to fast 2 base mutas and I can misread if the 3rd/4th gas are taken later as it might just look like double evo infestor sort of preparation.
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Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used.
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Thank you! What are a couple big hints that he is going muta and around when do u notice these tells?
Currently I just look for him to saturate his natural's gas before he even finishes saturating it's minerals. However I feel this is only one approach to fast 2 base mutas and I can misread if the 3rd/4th gas are taken later as it might just look like double evo infestor sort of preparation.
That depends on quite a few factors.
Who got ahead after early game aggression?
Does he mass spines?
Did he invest into ground upgrade?
Does he get roaches/banelings and how much?
Im really looking at this with shakuras plateau in mind cause 2 base turtle with static D into mutas is really common hah
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On October 13 2011 16:45 IM_Megan wrote:
Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used.
no professional player does that, they use 9/10 overlord because it's slightly better than extractor trick
only koreans use extractor trick, i dont know if that's a nostalgic thing to broodwar or they wanting to be unique and cool but 9 ovi is the best
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Hi, im a silver league zerg player who are some trouble with when i should build drones and when i should build units to defend, so i have a couple of questions.
1. Lets say i have 10 larva, should i spend all that on drones and no attacking units or should i just use half of the larva to build drones and the rest to build overlords/units.
when i put down a lot of drones at the same time i'm always unluccka and my opponents attack me and i have money but no larva.
2. should i just build drones and wait until i see him attack until i start building defending units or should i just drop some spinecrawlers.
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On October 11 2011 12:19 curtdisis wrote:
Hey guys, im a diamond zerg and ive been having troubles on shattered temple zvp when the toss goes ffe. I dont feel comfortable taking an early third around 30 supply because it is so far away from my main base so what is the safest thing to do to keep your economy on par with the toss?
nestea's/axa's spinecrawler rush has worked for me a couple times. not exactly the safest thing to do though...
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On October 14 2011 01:56 Samuraigrande wrote:Show nested quote +On October 13 2011 16:45 IM_Megan wrote:
Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used. no professional player does that, they use 9/10 overlord because it's slightly better than extractor trick only koreans use extractor trick, i dont know if that's a nostalgic thing to broodwar or they wanting to be unique and cool but 9 ovi is the best
Hmmm... Don't be so quick to dismiss. Some pros definitely do that. I've never seen JulyZerg NOT do that very thing, for example. I'm not sure why some pros do that sometimes, though. Overlord on nine should be economically better.
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A few months ago in early 2011 there was a popular early Zerg strategy: mass Queens for defense. It was used by Catz with success (seen on a few Day9 episodes), but later I heard little about it. I thought that mass Queens as a early game defense really frees up the Zerg to macro up with drones, as well as giving epic creep spread and great larva inject opportunities.
I am curious about professional opinion regarding this strategy, as I can't find it on Liquipedia. Can it stand up to general builds like Spanishiwa's Ice Fisher build and the speedling expand?
(Repost from Blade's thread)
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In the second-to-last day9 daily, Day9 talks about synching your injects and then tapping with just ONE hatch. So I tried that, and I found that when I built my lair, or upgraded burrow, then the progress tab wouldn't centre on my inject but instead the upgrade. What is the solution to this? Should I make my tapping hatch my nat? or just watch the left side of the screen at those times to see when the injects are finished?
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On October 17 2011 03:34 Mong00se wrote:
In the second-to-last day9 daily, Day9 talks about synching your injects and then tapping with just ONE hatch. So I tried that, and I found that when I built my lair, or upgraded burrow, then the progress tab wouldn't centre on my inject but instead the upgrade. What is the solution to this? Should I make my tapping hatch my nat? or just watch the left side of the screen at those times to see when the injects are finished?
Just make the single hotkey'd hatch a not lair.
On October 14 2011 14:21 Setev wrote:
A few months ago in early 2011 there was a popular early Zerg strategy: mass Queens for defense. It was used by Catz with success (seen on a few Day9 episodes), but later I heard little about it. I thought that mass Queens as a early game defense really frees up the Zerg to macro up with drones, as well as giving epic creep spread and great larva inject opportunities.
I am curious about professional opinion regarding this strategy, as I can't find it on Liquipedia. Can it stand up to general builds like Spanishiwa's Ice Fisher build and the speedling expand?
(Repost from Blade's thread)
As far as I know, the build in your first paragraph IS the Ice Fisher, you just saw CatZ do it before hearing about Spanishiwa, or something. As for how good it is... it isn't. There is a reason it didn't catch on at a high level: You lack the map control that is necessary to play as zerg, I.e. you throw the one huge advantage of playing the race. This allows opponents to be greedy and makes it near impossible to get a third. Basically, you sacrifice macro-advantage in the mid-game for not-dieing in the early game, which could be accomplished with any other build, proper scouting, and knowledge of significant timings. The build was fine when 1 base all-ins were so common, but as 1 rax expands and FFE are becoming the standard, the build is just obsolete.
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On October 14 2011 13:44 Ninety-Three wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2011 01:56 Samuraigrande wrote:On October 13 2011 16:45 IM_Megan wrote:
Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used. no professional player does that, they use 9/10 overlord because it's slightly better than extractor trick only koreans use extractor trick, i dont know if that's a nostalgic thing to broodwar or they wanting to be unique and cool but 9 ovi is the best Hmmm... Don't be so quick to dismiss. Some pros definitely do that. I've never seen JulyZerg NOT do that very thing, for example. I'm not sure why some pros do that sometimes, though. Overlord on nine should be economically better.
I just saw IdrA doing this in a few of his games at MLG. Have definitely seen July use it as well, and am wondering what the point of it is? Can anyone clarify which way is economically superior?
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Tried asking this question in the Simple Question Simple Answer Thread but got no response. I think this thread would be more appropriate:
I was wondering on tips for spore crawler placement in response to air harrass by protoss and banshee harass from terran. Thanks!
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On October 17 2011 13:09 ChiknAdobo wrote:
Tried asking this question in the Simple Question Simple Answer Thread but got no response. I think this thread would be more appropriate:
I was wondering on tips for spore crawler placement in response to air harrass by protoss and banshee harass from terran. Thanks!
You should have one in each mineral line (prevent drone kills and banshee cloak) and as many as needed depending on how many units your opponent trains. Also, you need to have 1 spore crawler at each ramp (very important!). This allows you to move queens around safely.
On October 17 2011 12:42 FYRE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2011 13:44 Ninety-Three wrote:On October 14 2011 01:56 Samuraigrande wrote:On October 13 2011 16:45 IM_Megan wrote:
Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used. no professional player does that, they use 9/10 overlord because it's slightly better than extractor trick only koreans use extractor trick, i dont know if that's a nostalgic thing to broodwar or they wanting to be unique and cool but 9 ovi is the best Hmmm... Don't be so quick to dismiss. Some pros definitely do that. I've never seen JulyZerg NOT do that very thing, for example. I'm not sure why some pros do that sometimes, though. Overlord on nine should be economically better. I just saw IdrA doing this in a few of his games at MLG. Have definitely seen July use it as well, and am wondering what the point of it is? Can anyone clarify which way is economically superior?
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=202464
9 Overlord is the best, followed by 10OL extractor, then 10OL. I think 10OL Extractor trick gets your pool out a smidge faster, but I'm not sure why people don't just 9OL. I think its so they can have 1 more drone if they scout a cheese / 6 pool, etc. And I actually have no idea why people 10OL. It's worse than 9OL in every way.
On October 14 2011 02:46 shmupps wrote:
Hi, im a silver league zerg player who are some trouble with when i should build drones and when i should build units to defend, so i have a couple of questions.
1. Lets say i have 10 larva, should i spend all that on drones and no attacking units or should i just use half of the larva to build drones and the rest to build overlords/units.
when i put down a lot of drones at the same time i'm always unluccka and my opponents attack me and i have money but no larva.
2. should i just build drones and wait until i see him attack until i start building defending units or should i just drop some spinecrawlers.
1) You need to scout. If your opponent can't move out to attack you, or you will be able to hold the push off when they arrive (if you can defeat their army with yours), then you are safe to drone. But yeah, scouting scouting scouting. You need to see your opponent's army composition and size, then react accordingly. If you can't see their army, look at their tech or workers. You need to constantly poke with lings, overseers, and suicide overlords.
2) Scout.
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On October 17 2011 12:42 FYRE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 14 2011 13:44 Ninety-Three wrote:On October 14 2011 01:56 Samuraigrande wrote:On October 13 2011 16:45 IM_Megan wrote:
Why do alot of profesional zerg players open with a 10/10 overlord followed up with 3 drones.
NO extrator trick is beeing used. no professional player does that, they use 9/10 overlord because it's slightly better than extractor trick only koreans use extractor trick, i dont know if that's a nostalgic thing to broodwar or they wanting to be unique and cool but 9 ovi is the best Hmmm... Don't be so quick to dismiss. Some pros definitely do that. I've never seen JulyZerg NOT do that very thing, for example. I'm not sure why some pros do that sometimes, though. Overlord on nine should be economically better. I just saw IdrA doing this in a few of his games at MLG. Have definitely seen July use it as well, and am wondering what the point of it is? Can anyone clarify which way is economically superior?
Hi, I've heard this explained but I still haven't had the time to look into it properly. So hopefully this will allow people a basis on which to make a comparison.
9 OL leads to the best econ.
10 OL allows you an extra drone earlier in case you need to fend off an extremely early attack.
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EPT
