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ZvT Mutalisk "Magic Box" via PsyStarcraft - Page 2

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
August 20 2010 22:22 GMT
#21
On August 21 2010 07:12 Galleon.frigate wrote:
so I've known of this for weeks, not that I'm special, read it here weeks ago.
yet no one has posted a replay where this made a different at high level? I know I've been looking...


I'm very excited to see somethign happen, but ... wtf.. still waiting



Check has made use of spreading mutas for a long time now.
Moderator
Tropics
Profile Joined August 2007
United Kingdom1132 Posts
August 20 2010 22:25 GMT
#22
this isnt magic boxes and people have been doing it for a long time

:/
Wr3k
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada2533 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-20 22:29:11
August 20 2010 22:28 GMT
#23
Honestly I don't get how people didn't know about this before. You could always kill thors with mutas if you did this, the problem is that if they add 10 stimmed marines you get shat on.
FakeSteve[TPR]
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Valhalla18444 Posts
August 20 2010 22:31 GMT
#24
On August 21 2010 06:56 cyprin wrote:
2400/2400 of mutas beat 1200/800 of thors?


it's a reasonable scenario. most terrans will make only 3 or so thor to deal with the prospect of muta
Moderatormy tatsu loops r fuckin nice
Kryptonite
Profile Joined June 2010
United States155 Posts
August 20 2010 22:34 GMT
#25
LOL I played a game as Terran vs a Zerg and I noticed my Thors were not splashing like they normally did...this is what the Zerg must have been doing. This makes me very happy though (since I play Zerg too (random player)).
http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/299590/fLcKrypt
groms
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada1017 Posts
August 20 2010 22:37 GMT
#26
On August 21 2010 07:12 Galleon.frigate wrote:
so I've known of this for weeks, not that I'm special, read it here weeks ago.
yet no one has posted a replay where this made a different at high level? I know I've been looking...


I'm very excited to see somethign happen, but ... wtf.. still waiting

Idra actually used it in his matches against sarens. It worked OK but unfortunately sarens ended up winning that match. You can watch the series on ESL.tv it was the quarter finals of the IEM gamescom tournament.
I have a recurring dream that I'm running away from a terran player but the marauders keep slowing me down. - Artosis
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
August 20 2010 22:37 GMT
#27
Why don't we get brood war magic box back? That would be awesome.
Chairman Ray
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States11903 Posts
August 20 2010 22:45 GMT
#28
I've been using this tactic for a while now. I had no idea it was new. I think I saw it in a game and picked up on it. Thanks for bringing this up though, i think it would help a lot of people.

In my experience, against thors this works well, but if they also have marines attacking you, then it's counter-productive to keep mutas unclumped since marines will just rip through them. Mutas are still for picking off stray units and buildings, there's no way they can ever engage in actual combat.
Tazza
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Korea (South)1678 Posts
August 20 2010 22:51 GMT
#29
Hey thanks for the video. I never knew this. This will really help when I play against terran
Scottymc
Profile Joined August 2010
Australia134 Posts
August 20 2010 23:49 GMT
#30
I would also like to test this with 1 corrupter for the +20% damage. I think you would be surprised how hammered those thors get. its basically +2 damage for each of the mutalisks. for the price 150/100.
so normal you would have 24 x 9(i think thats what muta does) unupgraded thor armor is 1 so its 24x8
= 192 per hit (not counting bounces).
With the corrupter its 23x9 which is 207 x 1.2(20% extra damage) = 220.8 per attack. thats a bonus of 28.8. + the first bounce if your next target has corrupt on it it scales very well.
And the big bonus If you lead with the corrupter has an armor of 2 if it takes the first volley of attacks it really helps remove the damage off your mutalisks. and no bonus damage. so instead of one of your mutas taking the rediculous 150 damage volley that 4 thors can dish out (what is it 4 x 12 each?)
The first volley only does about (4 - 2 x 6) x 4 = 48 to the corrupter and the mutas can go to town on the thors.

If you think playing with under 100APM is noob try having a ping of 450. Welcome australians to BNET 2.0....
Floydian
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United Kingdom374 Posts
August 20 2010 23:58 GMT
#31
I realise a lot of people seems to have worked this already, but as a lowly gold player, I didn't. So thanks for posting. Funny how in BW you generally wanted the opposite, your mutas clumped up as much as possible.
teamsolid
Profile Joined October 2007
Canada3668 Posts
August 20 2010 23:58 GMT
#32
On August 21 2010 08:49 Scottymc wrote:
I would also like to test this with 1 corrupter for the +20% damage. I think you would be surprised how hammered those thors get. its basically +2 damage for each of the mutalisks. for the price 150/100.
so normal you would have 24 x 9(i think thats what muta does) unupgraded thor armor is 1 so its 24x8
= 192 per hit (not counting bounces).
With the corrupter its 23x9 which is 207 x 1.2(20% extra damage) = 220.8 per attack. thats a bonus of 28.8. + the first bounce if your next target has corrupt on it it scales very well.
And the big bonus If you lead with the corrupter has an armor of 2 if it takes the first volley of attacks it really helps remove the damage off your mutalisks. and no bonus damage. so instead of one of your mutas taking the rediculous 150 damage volley that 4 thors can dish out (what is it 4 x 12 each?)
The first volley only does about (4 - 2 x 6) x 4 = 48 to the corrupter and the mutas can go to town on the thors.


You'd have to have the corruptor in a separate group since it moves slower than the muta and will fall out of the box causing them to clump up again. Feels like a lot of extra micro to add yet another control group simply for 1-2 corruptors when u can achieve the same effect by just building 20% more mutas.
ducis
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada96 Posts
August 20 2010 23:59 GMT
#33
loosely packed mutas get pwned my vikings-----hard, especially when the viks are stacked
Jyvblamo
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada13788 Posts
August 21 2010 00:01 GMT
#34
On August 21 2010 08:59 ducis wrote:
loosely packed mutas get pwned my vikings-----hard, especially when the viks are stacked

This is wrong.
ducis
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada96 Posts
August 21 2010 00:04 GMT
#35
how so?
aka_star
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United Kingdom1546 Posts
August 21 2010 01:42 GMT
#36
funny about the comment at the end 'its been in the game and people are just not figuring it out'

if people searched for it they would find numerous posts about mutas beating thors, its been around for ages and common knowledge on diamond since beta. There is also a mechnaic to make the thors AI switch target leaving a muta alive with red life keeping zergs DPS high, you have to dance the mutas directly over the thor and press H and if the turning angle is high then the thor will not spin and shot the next closet muta. its pretty old knowledge by today's standards...


Oh your might want to test the same thing with a couple of marines or a turret near by it really buffs the damage done by Terran and makes this play kinda hard.
FlashDave.999 aka Star
BadBinky
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
Finland649 Posts
August 21 2010 02:08 GMT
#37
"Will change metagame"

Nah. Any sane person would spread their mutas when they are forced to attack thors. Do you think top players stacked their mutas against thors and then went out calling imba?
It's more important to be tough than to have any fun.
knyttym
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States5797 Posts
August 21 2010 02:10 GMT
#38
On August 21 2010 11:08 BadBinky wrote:
Nah. Any sane person would spread their mutas when they are forced to attack thors. Do you think top players stacked their mutas against thors and then went out calling imba?


Yes
Arbalest
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada25 Posts
August 21 2010 02:11 GMT
#39
This is amazing, this is the first time I have heard about it and it makes me really happy to see. It is incredibly difficult for me to win against Terran Mech so maybe now the Terran will have to make something else besides Thors just to counter my Mutas. Thanks alot
FarbrorAbavna
Profile Joined July 2009
Sweden4856 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-21 07:46:01
August 21 2010 07:44 GMT
#40
On August 21 2010 07:22 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2010 07:12 Galleon.frigate wrote:
so I've known of this for weeks, not that I'm special, read it here weeks ago.
yet no one has posted a replay where this made a different at high level? I know I've been looking...


I'm very excited to see somethign happen, but ... wtf.. still waiting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjqXw4zxaPE&feature=related

Check has made use of spreading mutas for a long time now.


He's not using spread out mutas at all like the op is showing. Check is just taking his big group of mutas and dividing it into three smaller groups. They also stack up as they go in for the attack on the thor/s hence it is nothing at all like OP is showing(where only one muta is taking dmg from one thor). Was a great replay though.

On topic: this is great and will be really helpful. Did not know that the natural dispersing of mutas could make such a difference. ty!
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