EPTTL Mafia 5 [Game Over] - Page 2
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 05:47 MrBabyHands wrote: a few of the people posting ideas are clearly trying to trick the mafia into making a bad move. this much is obvious. if i noticed this, then certainly the mafia does as well. which is probably why they aren't posting. in most games, the mafia are either actively trying to get elected, or are in the back trying not to attract attention. The later is the case for this game. There is very little bandwagoning and lots of strategic talk. Mafia are just watching at this point. Which tells us that: quatol caller bw semioldguy pyrr bloddycobbler are all very likely innocent. i also know a blue role-- they'd been hinting at it for a while in this thread (prolly subconsciously-- even more proof of their innocence). i doubt anybody else has even picked up on it. I'll PM them to let them know to be more cautious. I think it's way to early for a post like this. Some mafia may just be inactive noobs like with the last game. And mafia can be pretty diverse in how much they post I know when I was in MTF's mafia I talked incessantly (as I did last game as a DT). And we were pretty organized but still we all talked different amounts. All Caller has posted that I've noticed is a post to say he's running and a post to quietly say he's not. I guess maybe something came up but usually he's super active and seemed pretty pumped to participate a few days ago and internal to the game all I can see to motivate him pulling out of the race is that he started running before role PMs and then rolled red at which point he felt the need to slink away from the inevitable DT checks. But external to the game plenty of things may have come up and I can't debate that. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 06:27 MrBabyHands wrote: the people who made compelling arguments for being elected are also the ones finding the holes in the strategies others propose. a mafia wouldn't do nearly as much in such a situation. it behooves an elected mafia to commit to following a flawed plan. This is how people think. the people i listed are innocent. When I rolled mafia two games ago I poked holes in plans enthusiastically and in general did everything I could to forget I was red and I was constantly thinking of what my motivations would be as a green townie and what I would say/do as a townie and I almost got into the inner circle that way except I didn't need to because we got our godfather elected partly due to my support. We can trust no one at this point. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 06:58 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: I think it's way to early for a post like this. Some mafia may just be inactive noobs like with the last game. And mafia can be pretty diverse in how much they post I know when I was in MTF's mafia I talked incessantly (as I did last game as a DT). And we were pretty organized but still we all talked different amounts. All Caller has posted that I've noticed is a post to say he's running and a post to quietly say he's not. I guess maybe something came up but usually he's super active and seemed pretty pumped to participate a few days ago and internal to the game all I can see to motivate him pulling out of the race is that he started running before role PMs and then rolled red at which point he felt the need to slink away from the inevitable DT checks. But external to the game plenty of things may have come up and I can't debate that. Well Caller has made a lot more posts than just making and ending his candidacy but that just makes me wonder why he is worried about being too lazy to be an officer when he's been able to post so much and he doesn't give an idea of something coming up that will swamp him just that he's lazy. I know he's ran for office in at least one previous game so I figured he'd be serious about his candidacy but maybe he has decided the limelight would be to bright after all? I dunno. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 07:15 Night[Mare wrote: do we vote for a sheriff/mayor yet? yeah we need to hurry up i dunno how many have voted but I think there may be only 3 or so hours left and there can't be 40 votes yet, maybe not even 30... | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 07:18 Chuiu wrote: Morning lasts 48 hours unless otherwise stated. Night is 24 hours. You have another 28ish hours. oh whew | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 07:19 MrBabyHands wrote: this kinda supports my claim that the mafia havent been posting if the mafia has few experienced people, then they wont be very diverse at all. and i read the last game-- you guys didnt seem that organized to me. lol i understand where you're coming from. i just know that i'm better at figuring people out than they are at hiding. its kinda funny tho-- by addressing my list, you are actually proving your innocence even more. a mafia member wouldnt intentionally cast doubt on a list that says they are innocent. but an innocent trying to help to town would. either way, those people are good. as the game progresses, you will see that.  I wasn't mafia last game, I was mafia in Ace's Mafia World. Last game the mafia was definitely unorganized. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 07:21 iNfuNdiBuLuM wrote: Current vote tally: BC Qatol Jyvblamo Ver Fishball Pyrrhuloxia Fusionsdf Mikeymoo Teejing Semioldguy 0cz3c Mista Pika Chu Pyrrhuloxia i dont think i missed any. I thought I voted for BC not semioldguy | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
-If mayor I'll lynch Pika Chu unless something drastic occurs between now and the end of the election. -If sheriff I will imprison mafia that are suspected and can't be lynched yet (the reasoning for this has been explained earlier by a few people, you, me, maybe some others. If people trust me enough to send me roles I will organize them the best I can but I don't think the mayor or sheriff should demand them at the beginning. I think medics should protect innocent looking vets and hopefully DTs can ferret out some people to trust fully. If this occurs I will definetly not contradict such a player / players. I think vigis should call out their hits beforehand since they only have one hit (making sure to send in their hit really early so it goes through). If the mafia use all of their kill power that night we will have a verified blue - if they lay off with killing power to try to make the person look suspicious, that would be stupid of them because we will have successfully deterred them and if they don't kill the vet we can medic protect him into a figurehead. If the vet dies that night (most likely) at least their hit went through and the vet getting killed is essentially a green at that point and much better than losing a DT / Medic / BG etc. More ideas to come I gotta get dinner / make phone calls. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 08:32 Pika Chu wrote: People have already noted how keen you are on blaming and trying to lynch me, a innocent townie. That is the best defense i can have. I'm not keen on lynching anybody. If I was a vigi I'm not anywhere near suspicious enough of you that I would kill you. But the mayor has to pick someone to lynch day one and no one sticks out in my mind more at this point. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 08:34 semioldguy wrote: There are several reasons why I don't like this plan. We essentially gain nothing unless we also save the Vigilante from being killed. If we don't do that then the Vigilante may have killed an innocent civilian and with the Vigilante dies we did NOT reduce the Mafia's kill power for the night, we increased it. Not only that but we don't have the person with a verified role because now he is dead. Anyone who publicly claims vigilante is likely going to die. They should still do this though as it prevents other roles and their own from being wasted as well as hinders the Mafia's ability to fake roleclaims. Another reason why I don't like this: If the confirmation of Vigilante is secret (which it may have to be in order to get far enough to have some sort of confirmation) then it's too easy to infiltrate. If I was mafia this is how I would try to infiltrate this plan by claiming myself as a Vigilante. Mafia could then use all their kill power killing people and also killing the person the "Vigilante" is supposed to kill. Then a Mafia members comes forward during the next day cycle and says that a Medic contacted him and he was saved. We check him and he turns out to be Mafia, that doesn't really help though, he could have been a Miller. At this point as a town we either need to just lynch one of the two who has come out, in which case our plan has been delayed a very long time or inspect the "Medic." If the medic is the Godfather in hiding then we just "confirmed" a Medic and a Miller and the Mafia is now in the inner circle receiving all of our roleclaims. By this point it will likely be Day 5 or 6 and we will have essentially gotten nowhere in creating a group of confirmed townies. Alright, we agree the vigis should call their hits to avoid overlapping at the very least. The confirmation of the vigi can really only happen if the mafia fucks up and hits people other than the vigi and who the vigi was going to hit (but they'll just hit who the vigi was going to hit and cancel his hit, unless the vigi gets lucky and calls a mafia, since mafia can't hit mafia). Essentially, we agree the vigi should call their hit and if mafia has fallen off the turnip truck we'll get a publicly confirmed blue. I never said anything about private confirmation so there's nothing to infiltrate. If the mafia is off their game and allow us that, the medics should protect them so the mafia either has to waste KP taking out the organizational figure or allows us to get more organized. There's no surefire way to trust anyone if the mafia plays their cards right but if the mafia is as clueless as last game there might be is all I'm saying. Ultimately this game is going to come down to clue analysis and earning trust the old fashioned way, I think. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
So should we medic up on vigis hoping they will kill a mafia and survive the night? If the vigi called out someone the town has high suspicions of and the vigi is someone who has played in a way that looks legit maybe we should consider it because its the most likely way I see to have a publicly confirmed blue that can't be a GF. And if the vigi hits a blue and survives the night with medic help or otherwise, a DT check would confirm they are either vigi or godfather. If they hit a blue we won't send them roles and if there are extra vigi calls we'll have a short list to find mafia from. So... what if we just have one vigi a day call out a hit and then be protected that night. We are bound to eventually hit a red and have someone we can trust. Cons are obviously that it may not be worth the medics focusing and it may take too long and allow too many deaths to set up - plus if mafia get some kills on medics and vigis early we may never get a red and have wasted time setting this up. Still, the unique characteristic that mafia can't kill themselves seems like the only exploitable way to make sure someone is 100% blue so maybe we should consider it. The idea of medics protecting vets could work as long as all vigis call their hits so we know they didn't trigger a medic but the medic and vet could both be mafia or one or both could be millers or godfather and it would be awfully tough to weed that out. | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
On March 18 2009 09:41 Tricode wrote: I put my vote with Cob. Don't douche this first game up for me man, or I'll go to Canada and hunt you down. ooh a smurf! any guesses on who this is? | ||
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
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Pyrrhuloxia
United States6700 Posts
"Sheriff and Mayor will hide the roles of the elected players so that a Detective role check will show them as Sheriff/Mayor and nothing else." This is exactly why I've already said not to give elected peeps the roles. I'm trying to come up with a plan to figure out someone who can be trusted, feel free to tear it apart since I fear it will be nigh impossible to do this game. @ infun "yes, this is true, however - someone the town is extremely suspicious of is not always red." We'll know if a red dies overnight that the vigi hit a red. "Maybe I am misunderstanding you, but Godfather won't show up on a DT check as Godfather, that's why he is the Godfather..." Right but we will have it narrowed to those two and if that vigi is still alive when the godfather dies we will know they are in the clear at that point. "With one vigi a day claming and medics on him, there is no way to coordinate the meds." There is no way to coordinate the meds in any case because the elected officers certainly can't be trusted. Granted, they are less likely to overlap if picking with intelligent guesses than if ganging up on the supposed vigi. "it would allow mafia... to spread the hits around to key players" There is no guarantee that early on medics won't overlap on one key player, be noobs and overlap on a bad player, or overlap on a key player who is mafia this game. "If the vig misses the negative consequences are rather harsh." The biggest risk I see is the mafia faking as a vigi and stringing us along by posing as a vigi attempting to kill blue after blue and having the mafia end up killing the same person. We would probably have to choose as a town who the vigi should kill because that way a fake vigi wouldn't be able to just choose someone who is not mafia everytime and claim every morning that the mafia had killed the same person in order to foil them. Vigis are always having to deal with the risk of killing a blue or green so as long as its a person the town is okay with attacking I don't think the negative consequences are that bad, however early on we are probably unlikely to have an extra kill to want to give to a vigi that might be fake when we could double lynch - we are also unlikely to even have someone to double lynch. "But if the vig is only targeting suspicious players, why would the medic be planning to protect that person anyway?" They wouldn't, I'm just pointing out a possible epic town fail to make sure it doesn't happen. "So i think it's extremely all-or-nothing, especially early on which unfortunately is when we need the most set up we can get." It is all or nothing but it's the only chance at proven innocence I've been able to see. Seems less risky than other strats ive read although still very risky. Hope someone finds something better. | ||
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