[M][T] Aperture Mafia 4, Episode 2

On October 27 2020 16:23 GreYMisT wrote:


My firm has an incredible policy that they offer, very fortunate there.

My son will be 3 weeks on Wednesday. The hardest part has been getting his days and nights flipped appropriately. That and convincing him to play Zerg later in life.

On October 28 2020 20:19 Dirkzor wrote:
Im in a meeting. Cant focus much...

what do do with the corruption counter thingy? Organize it so it doesn't go up or what do you think?

On October 28 2020 20:30 Dirkzor wrote:
Maybe due to no vote today?

On October 28 2020 20:30 raynpelikoneet wrote:

Oh dear oh dear....

On October 28 2020 21:09 Dirkzor wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

I think it would be nice to know what happens when the corruption counter increase. So maybe we could have 1 person check that and report back tomorrow. 4 people using this device (unless other, better, night actions available) does seem like a good strategy for us. The more info we have the easier it gets to find scum/third parties...

On October 28 2020 21:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:

Because inam at work and you are asking me questions that are very stupid.

On October 28 2020 22:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am sorry, i am not calling you stupid Acrofales. I mainly never understand your train of thought and why you do the stuff you do and ask the questions you do, because to me most of the time they seem worthless and i dont understand how you can deduct any alignment indicative things from the answers.

I mean like, you asked me if i am mafia or if i am a third faction. How on earth you think i am giving you any other answer than "no" regardless of my affiliation and how on earth that answer can tell you anything about my alignment? That's why i think the questions are stupid and i dont see a point in answering them. That's the only thing you have interacted with me. I dont genuinely have any reason to "avoid you" regardless of my alignment.

I am basically just going to wait for more people to post, corruption counter is interesting. Especially to see what people want to do with it. It actually CAN tell something about someone's alignment. I mean like i think Dirkzor is town already.

On October 28 2020 22:47 iamperfection wrote:

You did say sorry though. That is pretty scummy

On October 28 2020 23:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I mean mafia, town, who?

On October 28 2020 23:29 raynpelikoneet wrote:

yes i dont think he'd do that without discussing it first with his teammates.

the intention of my first post was to get reaction from him mainly, because we just talked about the other game before the game started. I think it's actually best to full-claim with everyone at the start of the game (i also know that's not gonna happen because people dont believe in it), i havent lost an all-roled game where people actually did that, ever.

I kinda thought he was mafia when he didnt post at first, but then he came in with a really really anti-town suggestion about the corruption level (if you are town you know what i mean, townies mainly fear for unknown -- as they should). It's like, he would have to take a step back to wait for his teammates to answer my opening, but then he just goes with THAT of everything he could have said.

If you get what i mean.

On October 28 2020 23:41 raynpelikoneet wrote:
hmm, i actually read on of Dirkzor's posts wrong, he was not really saying he wants the corruption counter to increase. So ditch that town read.

On October 28 2020 23:57 iamperfection wrote:
Acro is probably 3p he always is.

On October 29 2020 00:19 Hapahauli wrote:
Slightly town.

I did like his thoughts about the game mechanic. However, him thinking critically about the game mechanic can mean any number of things:
1) Pro-town contribution from a player who is thinking about how to get information for the town;
2) A third-party who's win-condition is somehow tied to usage of the TL Mafia Database;
3) A mafia member who has enough extra information about the Database to know that his idea is either pro-mafia or ultimately harmless to mafia's objectives.

I lean towards #1, because the information deficit of town is a disadvantage to town in the theme games I have played.

On October 29 2020 00:26 Grackaroni wrote:

I don't really care either way.

From what I gather the corruption levels are probably the most important thing from the database and making sure the right number of people goes there probably makes more of a difference than any of options you get to choose from.

I won't be doing anything though so if other people don't want to go then I'll go.

On October 29 2020 00:28 iamperfection wrote:

Why? I don't understand.

On October 29 2020 00:33 iamperfection wrote:

I would doubt extremely that they would have actions figured out yet too

On October 29 2020 00:34 Hapahauli wrote:


I try to present my reads in a very constructed format.

That all being said, I'm having a bit of a hard time thinking about how I want to approach this game, because my role has two win conditions. One is that I can win with town, and the other is... a bit strange, but potentially pro-town. I may choose to reveal more as I learn more about the setup.

On October 29 2020 00:42 iamperfection wrote:

What no we force him to win with town I will make him

On October 29 2020 00:57 Hapahauli wrote:


I wish I could say I was purely a survivor, but my alternate win-con is a good deal more complicated than that. After all, it's a Greymist game.

That all being said, I don't mind visiting the database, but I have a couple of questions:

1) I thought we were playing "resistance" for Database slots.
2) Why do you believe you can force me to do anything, if you freely admit that you can't generally force survivors do to anything?
3) Why do you discount the possibility that my win-con may have something to do with the Database?

On October 29 2020 06:28 ShoCkeyy wrote:


Just trust me yo. If you're town, you'll trust me. If I'm mafia then Acro's post here becomes more relevant.

On October 29 2020 16:32 Dirkzor wrote:
##Commence Space-Time Destabilization

I'm claiming named town. I'm Neil deGrasse Tyson.

I've been thinking about this for a while now. I wasnt sure how to play this out or what do to. But i figured the best way to do it was to be open about it so that town can benefit the most from the information i am about to give.

I have a 1 shot ability (##Commence Space-Time Destabilization) that in 5 phases town will give a great benefit to town. Some kind of hint/info will be sent to me. I don't know what it is though. The downside is that the corruption level will increase by 1. (the flavor is that i spend a lot of database capacity to study "Event Horizon Level" and spent 5 phases doing that and will then have found the answer)

Further more I will show up as "3rd party" or "not town" if someone check my alignment. (i wasn't sure if this was town to write this. But my thought was that i'd rather be upfront and let you make your own conclusion instead of being checked N1 and then fight the uphill battle with the rest of the town and let mafia ride it out)

I also have a somewhat useful night action (for town) that i won't disclose for now.

I thought about what this will mean going further:

This will put a target on my back. I'm hoping i can be protected. And if not it will help other townies to come to their own conclusion.

This might be disruptive on the short term, but i hope the long term gain out weight this.

I wanted to do this as early as possible so to get the info as soon as possible. And figuring we dont vote on this day i thought it would be better to do it now rather than later.
I don't know what the corruption increase will do, but i'm willing to take that risk. I hope you do too. I didn't want to ask about this since it would be a whole lot of discussion where no-one knew anything anyway, and if we ended agreeing that i shouldn't do it, people would wonder if i actually could or not.

Anyway. Thats my claim. The timer should show up in thread so you can see my ability is real.

I'm in meeting the next 7 hours, but will do the multitask thingy =)

On October 29 2020 06:32 raynpelikoneet wrote:

I think he is town though because my role says he is lol

On October 29 2020 19:36 raynpelikoneet wrote:

No



Town

On October 29 2020 19:40 Dirkzor wrote:
Well, if its like my own one off power it just sort of happens. I don't think my ability could get roleblocked (i cant be sure of course).

I'm also noting that greymist didn't do anything. This might mean nothing or it might mean it was a fake ability. Why rayn would do that i don't know. That's why i want more information. Right now it doesn't mean anything without any context and that makes me think its scummy.

On October 30 2020 01:43 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I still have a couple of things that bother me a great deal.


I just cant get over this. We get grades but why isn't Slam there? I dont understand it, Slam should get F by the post above.

I also dont understand why Acrofales has been over on why i know shockeyy is town but not interested at all when Hapa knew i am town....

On October 30 2020 03:15 Hapahauli wrote:
Thoughts on the game with a fresh set of eyes:

Onegu and Koshi are good vig targets at this point. No feelings on them either way - Koshi from a lack of posting, and Onegu from a lack of substance beyond a playfulness with is seeming role mechanic.

Rayn, Iamp, Dirk, and Yamato feel strongly not-mafia (be it VT, neutral 3rd party, pro-town 3rd party... whatever).
- Rayn can be dickish as mafia, but he is generally dickish with an agenda. I don't see any agenda in what he was doing last night other than pure tilt, which is much more likely to come from town.
- Iamp is very engaged and posting loosely.
- Dirk's posting history and story very much checks out with someone who has a game mechanic tied to the Corruption Counter. Claim is too attention seeking.
- Yamato is a meta read. His tone has stayed very productive and constructive.

The people that stick out to me as mafia candidates are Slam, Acro, and Grack (in no particular order).
- Slam's explanation for the "lol hapa duh" comment is plausible, in that he may have simply quoted the wrong post and made the comment in reference to me being "not town". However, there is a "calmness" to his posting that typically comes from his mafia games from recent memory.
- Grack has been reasonably active and has been posting, but he has been largely offering safe (and confident) opinions on claims (myself and Dirkzor), as well as fairly substanceless mechanics discussions. The vibe of his filter is that he is happy posting his opinion on something and moving on, rather than engaging the thread in meaningful ways.
- Acro's filter does not look good on a second readthrough. A lot of words and not a whole lot of substance. Two things in particular stick out:

1) very quick and confident judgments on the two claims (myself and Dirkzor). The read on Dirkzor in particular reads like he's grandstanding the importance of his read:



2) His attempt to play "thread cop" after the Rayn/Yamato thing reads like an attempt to contribute without contributing. It's also exceptionally unproductive (since the argument was long gone by the time he showed up), and it only serves to dig up more drama.

On October 30 2020 03:38 Hapahauli wrote:
I know why I would want Onegu shot. Why do you?

On October 30 2020 17:04 Koshi wrote:

100% mafia read and I would vote Acro just based on that.

On October 30 2020 22:19 Hapahauli wrote:
I did not visit the database, since there did not appear to be a clear consensus about what I should do. I elected for another night action that is objectively pro-town. I was roleblocked anyway, making it a moot issue.

My lynch preferences are Grack and Acro. The secret ballot makes this frustrating, but if we simply make our vote-intentions transparent in thread, if someone else gets lynched, we will likely be able to deduce who lied about their vote.

On October 30 2020 22:25 Hapahauli wrote:
Is the thread split your only ability?

On October 30 2020 23:18 Hapahauli wrote:
EBWOP:

I have been delving through past GreyMist games. To be fair to Acro, the "thread-splitting" role has been town in a past GM game (Catastrophe Mafia).



That however doesn't invalidate the point that this is not an objectively pro-town role.

On October 31 2020 01:58 Grackaroni wrote:


I think it's a bit suspicious that Acro is sticking with his town read on me based off volunteering to go to the database when lots of other players did so afterwords including both Onegu and ShoCkkey.

I haven't made any effort at all to analyze posts yet. I'm going to start filter diving tonight.

On October 29 2020 02:44 ShoCkeyy wrote:


yea 10 pages of noise data.

What is an analytical person?
What is an analytical person? An analytical person wants to gather and consider information at length before making a big decision. Even in small choices, they will tend to look to the numbers or data for guidance, rather than making an off-the-cuff choice.

If you're truly say I'm not analytical, then I don't think you know what it actually meant.

On October 30 2020 04:48 ShoCkeyy wrote:
I also don't mind letting iamperfection visit the database alone, no one else, i trust him 100%.

On October 31 2020 02:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:
I didn't go to the database. What I find even more odd is the fact that Acro says this:



Why the fuck should I not be here Acro??? DID YOU TRY TO SHOOT ME LAST NIGHT?

On October 31 2020 02:59 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Lmfao. Acro is 100% mafia, thanks for letting me know. Took the bait I set out, and straight up went for it.

On October 31 2020 03:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:


Yea yea... you're the one with their pants down. Got caught.

On October 31 2020 03:18 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Shockeyy

1) Did you visit the TL Mafia Database last night?
2) Please describe the "trap" that you set for Acro.

@ Acro

1) Your posting suggests that your town read on Grack is strong enough that you wouldn't consider lynching him today. This appears to be based on the "speed" by which he volunteered to go to the Database. Is this true?
2) Today, you state that Onegu is a "blank void". Yesterday, you stated to the effect that I should shoot him because he's a scummy void. What changed your mind?

On October 30 2020 22:25 Hapahauli wrote:


I was notified that I was roleblocked in my Night 0 PM from the host.

I was also notified that I was selected as a "planeteer".

On October 31 2020 03:33 Grackaroni wrote:
For what it's worth I'd bet ShoCkkey is town. Even though it doesn't make any sense.

On October 31 2020 03:47 Hapahauli wrote:


If I am an anti-3p townie in your view, why am I not on your lynch list?

On October 31 2020 03:51 Hapahauli wrote:
Lynching me would be part of town's win-con, so you'd have to do it, and today is as good of a day as any other.

On October 31 2020 03:56 Hapahauli wrote:


No, I'm arguing in the alternative.

I am not an anti-town 3p, and no one (except for Acro) seems to believe that I'm an anti-town 3p. Nevertheless, from his perspective, it doesn't make all that much sense to not include me on a lynch list. Per Acro's post at the beginning of this cycle:



Emphasis added. Why am I not there?

My conclusion is that he's trying to spread paranoia about my role and motives, as opposed to seriously thinking that I am somehow "anti-town".

On October 31 2020 04:00 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Acro thoughts on Dirk?

On October 31 2020 04:01 Hapahauli wrote:
That does not make any sense Acro.

Let's say I'm a serial killer. I am arguably just as much of a threat to the town as mafia. So why then does lynching mafia take priority over lynching me?

On November 07 2020 05:18 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am pretty sure his clam was a big push to kill Acro in the other thread.

On November 08 2020 02:32 Alakaslam wrote:

But I’d have also never had KP realistically.

Every move would have been a mistake by that point; if I hadn’t gone one would have said I should have to gain KP etc etc.

And I claimed to gain info- I had planned on actually gaining info and using/sharing according to my discretion