Was he confusing when he spoke to you privately about his read on me? Did you disagree with his reads? I made a post expressing paranoia that my top townread could be tricking me and now it all comes together and he really made a lot of sense?
To be clearer ES, How can Bugs who is the best scum player on this list (he says) ever scumread someone who expresses paranoia over a townread? If nothing that should encourage better play.
On July 26 2019 13:22 Tubesock wrote: To be clearer ES, How can Bugs who is the best scum player on this list (he says) ever scumread someone who expresses paranoia over a townread? If nothing that should encourage better play.
On July 26 2019 13:24 Fecalfeast wrote: not only scumread me but to say that that one post made him REALIZE WHY JOCK SCUMREADS ME
He obviously took it as a 'scumslip'. If I thought I had mafia 100% by their own admission I'd flip my read on a fucking dime too! Now I don't get how he saw it that way but I think that would explain his flipped read. Not sure what it had to do with Jock though. Maby I misunderstood something through the original conversation :/..
I'm gonna stop spamming the thread so ppl can catch up if anyone wants me to respond to anything I will but I'll try not to comment on every new post for a while
On July 26 2019 13:24 Fecalfeast wrote: not only scumread me but to say that that one post made him REALIZE WHY JOCK SCUMREADS ME
He obviously took it as a 'scumslip'. If I thought I had mafia 100% by their own admission I'd flip my read on a fucking dime too! Now I don't get how he saw it that way but I think that would explain his flipped read. Not sure what it had to do with Jock though. Maby I misunderstood something through the original conversation :/..
On July 26 2019 12:25 Fecalfeast wrote: Why let jock 'control the vote' when he could just unvote whatever you pick?
What? I’m not picking anything, Jock is in full control of who we vote, and I support his decision making.
We talk privately and I’ve asked him to focus on reading you because I was focusing on other players. [big]Now I see exactly why he thinks you’re scum[big] and that post alone really stood out to me.
Anyway his vote is my vote, that’s all there is to it.
On July 26 2019 13:24 Fecalfeast wrote: not only scumread me but to say that that one post made him REALIZE WHY JOCK SCUMREADS ME
He obviously took it as a 'scumslip'. If I thought I had mafia 100% by their own admission I'd flip my read on a fucking dime too! Now I don't get how he saw it that way but I think that would explain his flipped read. Not sure what it had to do with Jock though. Maby I misunderstood something through the original conversation :/..
On July 26 2019 12:25 Fecalfeast wrote: Why let jock 'control the vote' when he could just unvote whatever you pick?
What? I’m not picking anything, Jock is in full control of who we vote, and I support his decision making.
We talk privately and I’ve asked him to focus on reading you because I was focusing on other players. Now I see exactly why he thinks you’re scum and that post alone really stood out to me.
Anyway his vote is my vote, that’s all there is to it.
You can read into that one statement all you want, you’re taking one thing I said and blowing it all out of proportion. This is the only time I’m going to bother explaining this because I’d rather find scum and get them lynched than bother defending myself because it wastes a bunch of time. If you think we are scum then that is no longer my problem, you can blame yourself if we get lynched because our thoughts are completely transparent and impossible to fake as scum.
Here’s how it went down:
1. One of my first early reads is to actually lean town on FF. Like mid d1 or so, the state I gave to Jock:
FF - lean town. Maybe strongest read I have Eywa - lean town Tube - lean town Coag - lean town
rayn - lean scum
Everyone else unmemorable.
I want more time to read MZ, I also found his posting a bit odd but I think I find town MZ odd too.
I’m waiting for Pandain to post because he’s a valuable asset for bouncing ideas off of if he’s town.
This was around the time Jock posted his reaction dump IIRC, we had just shared a couple lists at that point.
2. Day progresses and my reads didn’t really change at all. Jock tells me he thinks MZ is a better vote than rayn and I tell him I’m fine with him voting MZ if he wants.
3. Rayn flips and I tell Jock we should look at people who reacted strangely or tried to take cred for townreading rayn before the flip.
HF Slam MZ (Maybe) Koshi (Maybe) FF Rest of the player base still unreadable.
Tube looks okay. Still waiting on Pandain to do something and he’d make a good d2/d3 lynch if he continues to skate by.
The thing here is that I felt that Jock may have made in in-thread post on FF before I said this to him in the QT, my recollection is not great but I don’t remember my read change on FF being an entirely original thought. However I actually mentioned FF first in our QT.
3. I tell Jock to focus on FF and that I think he’s got a potentially good lead but I’m going to focus on other players, specifically slam and Coag.
4. FF posted a couple speculatory things that I noticed independently from Jock in the thread during the night, and I mention to him to not tell the thread why I have flipped my read on FF but that I have a different reason for believing FF to be scummy than Jock does. I told him I’m happy to push for FF’s lynch today since it’s a read we both seem to be coming to agreement on. However at that time I felt stronger about slam and Jock seemed to me to feel stronger than I did on FF.
5. FF posts that thing about tube superscumming and I think it looks really bad. For me now slam & FF are my top two lynches and I can see why Jock thinks FF is scum because I have now seen at least 3 things independently from Jock that indicate to me that FF is scummy.
On July 26 2019 09:47 Fecalfeast wrote: also if I'm in your pocket and you're you're doing a powerscum just be careful I'm spiky like a bunch of keys in tight jeans
This is trying to avoid responsibility for you own vote
The fact is tubesock was ALWAYS going to vote for us. He's made that clear since before EoD1, he's tunnelled on us and you very well knew that before you asked him who he was voting for.
On July 25 2019 02:49 Alakaslam wrote: From the look of things we lose Rayn.
Not good. He is a strong player.
Rayn when you return please just make cases in last bit don’t waste too much time on defense. There comes a point where people won’t change their minds, period.
Anyway, so people can make associations later:
My reason for believing Rayn to be town are mostly on meta. The case against him is basically that he is anti town because he is able to get angry. And not understand sarcasm. Basically.
Bad case. My reasons for scumreading the smurf is trying to shut me down, and a few other things but those are wifom. Not enough to vote on.
I vote him to save Rayn.
I want to hear what others think of this post as it sticks out quite a lot especially in light of rayn’s flip.
The good news is that tomorrow morning we have a confirmed townie, so if you are rayn’s partner please do not claim until then.
I also want to hear from you, HF. For everyone else my assignment to you is to tell me your read of HF at this very moment.
Ok I don't like this post from slam at all. The whole part about "making associates later" reeks like TMI and this post is basically slam's way of distancing himself from the lynch so that he's on the right side of the vote that he knows will flip town. Aside from that, he literally admits his reasons for voting the hydra are terrible but he's saving rayn, I view this as scummy since it's hard for me to believe someone organically comes up with a townread so strong on D1 that they're willing to vote for someone else they don't think is scum in order to save them.
On July 25 2019 08:51 Tubesock wrote: I townreading FF and Alakaslam. I also townread Coagulation but it's softer.
Yeah Bugs I’ll scumread you for shutting down a player for posting 25 times in a row when it’s a very slow game. It wasn’t like anyone else was around, and You should know that Slam isn’t exactly a high post count player, so shutting him down hurts town. I doubt it took you anymore time to read those 25 posts than it would have if it was all in one.
I think the shade towards FF and Meap post flip are scummy.
Alright so I'm still leaning scum on FF, I think that the hydra makes a decent point here
I think the TMI argument on slam is actually very strong, and I have some meta reasons as well that I can go over if anyone cares to but I'm really interested as to where you're getting this townread from, could you elaborate more on that?
I disagree with the hydra scum read but coag is also a soft townread for me.
On July 25 2019 12:24 Vivax wrote: Looks like I forgot to unvote NSH and vote anything else yesterday really..
I think we can all agree that after that mislynch I don't really have to feel arsed to play. He was rather obvious town.
My advice is that you look into HF and pandain.
Was really hoping from more than this from you vivax, picking lurkers as your suspects is weaksauce.
On July 25 2019 17:30 Koshi wrote:
On July 25 2019 08:51 Tubesock wrote: I townreading FF and Alakaslam. I also townread Coagulation but it's softer.
Yeah Bugs I’ll scumread you for shutting down a player for posting 25 times in a row when it’s a very slow game. It wasn’t like anyone else was around, and You should know that Slam isn’t exactly a high post count player, so shutting him down hurts town. I doubt it took you anymore time to read those 25 posts than it would have if it was all in one.
I think the shade towards FF and Meap post flip are scummy.
This guy is town most likely. Going so hard against the consensus. Must be thinking aboit the game.
Koshi and Tube are definitely my strongest townreads.
On July 26 2019 06:47 Alakaslam wrote: What a short read.
He suspected Pandain and HF mostly. If he is killed this early, I tend to think he was on the right track.
See subsequent vote in vote thread. If folks want a counter wagon, it should be me I think so that my statements can warrant a reread when I am gone.
Because then y’all will realize: 1. I was town, and knew Rayn was too 2. That I was playing pretty carefully and pretty attentively 3. That though I couldn’t explain why, I was right on Rayn and am semi- likely to be right on other reads by EOD D2.
If Hf vs Pandain well idk I somehow feel they aren’t BOTH scum.
I think what I've highlighted red here sums up parts of my meta read on slam. Based on my memory, slam is absolutely not playing his usual self and he is aware of it and has tried to emulate that at times but it feels artificial. He is much too serious and, in his own words, careful compared to what town slam does.
On July 26 2019 07:09 Koshi wrote: 0% chance slam is mafia. If you think so you shoot up in my mafia list so high kites would be jealous.
On July 26 2019 07:10 Koshi wrote: I'll sheep slam even though I dont think Pandain is the best kill. But I dont know who is.
Ok you and Tube agreeing on this is enough to give me pause but I really would like to know what you think of some of the points I've brought up earlier in this post. I'm not going to just sheep either of you without some decent reasoning behind your thought process.
Alright I'm caught up and this is where I'm at. I think the TMI evidence, along with the meta/gut read I've got on slam is the strongest I've got right now. Going to go ahead and vote for him. FF is probably my second strongest read with a mix of Chez/Pandain/the dude who replaced in to round things out.
I don’t have a super strong read on Koshi but I also have tube as my strongest town read. I had Vivax as well but he got shot.
Jock was stronger on FF being scum than I was, but now I’ve come around. I think the opposite may have been true for slam but not sure, I think we are both in agreement that FF and slam look bad but will wait for Jock to come back in as there are things I want to discuss with him.
As for Tube saying that slam reading into why Vivax got shot and fingering HF & Pandain afterward is a fine reason for him to flip his townread, I think that’s a very weak argument.
First of all, slam’s response to me when I said “how are you so sure that HF is town here when even though I agree with HF I don’t have a read yet” was basically, cryptic TL;DR “because I know HF well”
Then if he knows HF well, he’d know that HF scum would likely never shoot Vivax on n1. Hell, he even made a jab at me because he thinks that is such a whacky kill that only someone with bad night kill skills would do such a thing. On top of that Vivax barely mentioned HF at all, just made one passing comment on both HF and Pandain to look into them. This is 100% not a reason to completely flip your read if you supposedly know HF well, because 1.) he was unlikely to shoot Vivax in the first place and 2.) even if he would shoot Vivax, HF is not such a weak scum player that he’d be worried about an offhand reference like that.
If anything it amplifies Vivax’s posts significantly when he was barely active yesterday and would backfire really badly.
i know I said I wouldn’t speculate further but I can’t resist. It smells more like a failed mason hunting attempt than anything else because scum are dumb
On July 25 2019 02:49 Alakaslam wrote: From the look of things we lose Rayn.
Not good. He is a strong player.
Rayn when you return please just make cases in last bit don’t waste too much time on defense. There comes a point where people won’t change their minds, period.
Anyway, so people can make associations later:
My reason for believing Rayn to be town are mostly on meta. The case against him is basically that he is anti town because he is able to get angry. And not understand sarcasm. Basically.
Bad case. My reasons for scumreading the smurf is trying to shut me down, and a few other things but those are wifom. Not enough to vote on.
I vote him to save Rayn.
I want to hear what others think of this post as it sticks out quite a lot especially in light of rayn’s flip.
The good news is that tomorrow morning we have a confirmed townie, so if you are rayn’s partner please do not claim until then.
I also want to hear from you, HF. For everyone else my assignment to you is to tell me your read of HF at this very moment.
Ok I don't like this post from slam at all. The whole part about "making associates later" reeks like TMI and this post is basically slam's way of distancing himself from the lynch so that he's on the right side of the vote that he knows will flip town. Aside from that, he literally admits his reasons for voting the hydra are terrible but he's saving rayn, I view this as scummy since it's hard for me to believe someone organically comes up with a townread so strong on D1 that they're willing to vote for someone else they don't think is scum in order to save them.
On July 25 2019 08:51 Tubesock wrote: I townreading FF and Alakaslam. I also townread Coagulation but it's softer.
Yeah Bugs I’ll scumread you for shutting down a player for posting 25 times in a row when it’s a very slow game. It wasn’t like anyone else was around, and You should know that Slam isn’t exactly a high post count player, so shutting him down hurts town. I doubt it took you anymore time to read those 25 posts than it would have if it was all in one.
I think the shade towards FF and Meap post flip are scummy.
Alright so I'm still leaning scum on FF, I think that the hydra makes a decent point here
I think the TMI argument on slam is actually very strong, and I have some meta reasons as well that I can go over if anyone cares to but I'm really interested as to where you're getting this townread from, could you elaborate more on that?
I disagree with the hydra scum read but coag is also a soft townread for me.
On July 25 2019 12:24 Vivax wrote: Looks like I forgot to unvote NSH and vote anything else yesterday really..
I think we can all agree that after that mislynch I don't really have to feel arsed to play. He was rather obvious town.
My advice is that you look into HF and pandain.
Was really hoping from more than this from you vivax, picking lurkers as your suspects is weaksauce.
On July 25 2019 17:30 Koshi wrote:
On July 25 2019 08:51 Tubesock wrote: I townreading FF and Alakaslam. I also townread Coagulation but it's softer.
Yeah Bugs I’ll scumread you for shutting down a player for posting 25 times in a row when it’s a very slow game. It wasn’t like anyone else was around, and You should know that Slam isn’t exactly a high post count player, so shutting him down hurts town. I doubt it took you anymore time to read those 25 posts than it would have if it was all in one.
I think the shade towards FF and Meap post flip are scummy.
This guy is town most likely. Going so hard against the consensus. Must be thinking aboit the game.
Koshi and Tube are definitely my strongest townreads.
On July 26 2019 06:47 Alakaslam wrote: What a short read.
He suspected Pandain and HF mostly. If he is killed this early, I tend to think he was on the right track.
See subsequent vote in vote thread. If folks want a counter wagon, it should be me I think so that my statements can warrant a reread when I am gone.
Because then y’all will realize: 1. I was town, and knew Rayn was too 2. That I was playing pretty carefully and pretty attentively 3. That though I couldn’t explain why, I was right on Rayn and am semi- likely to be right on other reads by EOD D2.
If Hf vs Pandain well idk I somehow feel they aren’t BOTH scum.
I think what I've highlighted red here sums up parts of my meta read on slam. Based on my memory, slam is absolutely not playing his usual self and he is aware of it and has tried to emulate that at times but it feels artificial. He is much too serious and, in his own words, careful compared to what town slam does.
On July 26 2019 07:09 Koshi wrote: 0% chance slam is mafia. If you think so you shoot up in my mafia list so high kites would be jealous.
On July 26 2019 07:10 Koshi wrote: I'll sheep slam even though I dont think Pandain is the best kill. But I dont know who is.
Ok you and Tube agreeing on this is enough to give me pause but I really would like to know what you think of some of the points I've brought up earlier in this post. I'm not going to just sheep either of you without some decent reasoning behind your thought process.
Alright I'm caught up and this is where I'm at. I think the TMI evidence, along with the meta/gut read I've got on slam is the strongest I've got right now. Going to go ahead and vote for him. FF is probably my second strongest read with a mix of Chez/Pandain/the dude who replaced in to round things out.
I don’t have a super strong read on Koshi but I also have tube as my strongest town read. I had Vivax as well but he got shot.
Jock was stronger on FF being scum than I was, but now I’ve come around. I think the opposite may have been true for slam but not sure, I think we are both in agreement that FF and slam look bad but will wait for Jock to come back in as there are things I want to discuss with him.
As for Tube saying that slam reading into why Vivax got shot and fingering HF & Pandain afterward is a fine reason for him to flip his townread, I think that’s a very weak argument.
First of all, slam’s response to me when I said “how are you so sure that HF is town here when even though I agree with HF I don’t have a read yet” was basically, cryptic TL;DR “because I know HF well”
Then if he knows HF well, he’d know that HF scum would likely never shoot Vivax on n1. Hell, he even made a jab at me because he thinks that is such a whacky kill that only someone with bad night kill skills would do such a thing. On top of that Vivax barely mentioned HF at all, just made one passing comment on both HF and Pandain to look into them. This is 100% not a reason to completely flip your read if you supposedly know HF well, because 1.) he was unlikely to shoot Vivax in the first place and 2.) even if he would shoot Vivax, HF is not such a weak scum player that he’d be worried about an offhand reference like that.
If anything it amplifies Vivax’s posts significantly when he was barely active yesterday and would backfire really badly.
i know I said I wouldn’t speculate further but I can’t resist. It smells more like a failed mason hunting attempt than anything else because scum are dumb
-wherebugsgo
Actually that wasn’t me, for what it’s worth.
I was referring to HF making the jab because HF thinks it’s a low skill move. You can read his gut reaction to the flip, I responded to it so I remember it exists somewhere.
I’m saying that since you apparently know HF so well it’s odd that you find the kill implicated him since the HF I know would not be very likely to kill Vivax unless he delegated the kill or it was a bad attempt at mason hunting, and if it were an attempt at mason hunting then the kill doesn’t implicate anyone because any scum would try that.
In other words there was no town-motivated reason for you to 180 your read that hard because presumably you’d know this already.
On July 26 2019 12:11 Eversince wrote: I will say though I reallly liked your point about FF t!rayn read but not evven bothering to try to save him by moving his vote though if I'm remembreing EoD though. Rayn was so obvious town he soft crumbed stupid early with the Eywa fight my gosh :/..
On July 26 2019 09:47 Fecalfeast wrote: also if I'm in your pocket and you're you're doing a powerscum just be careful I'm spiky like a bunch of keys in tight jeans
This is trying to avoid responsibility for you own vote
-J
Given the other post I made this is kinda wrong I didn't read the context beforehand, let me EBWOP:
Earlier:
On July 25 2019 09:12 Tubesock wrote: I’m tunneling you till you die.
Tubesock has no other very strong scum reads.
FF then asks tubesock who he's voting for.
9:44 FF votes for us
9:45 Tubesock votes for us
9:47:
On July 26 2019 09:47 Fecalfeast wrote: also if I'm in your pocket and you're you're doing a powerscum just be careful I'm spiky like a bunch of keys in tight jeans
This is trying to avoid responsibility for you own vote
Here's the thing.
FF never specifically said he was townreading tubesock. He never gave any impression that he would have a reason to sheep tubesock until suddenly when we are putting pressure on him he decides to 'sheep' tubesock and vote for us (when it was 100% obvious that TS would vote for us anyway). This is opportunistic to say the least. He then talks about maybe being in TS's pocket as a way of ensuring that we all know that if it goes wrong its not his fault.
So FF are you scum or are you so stupid that really didn't already know who TS was going to vote for?
EPT
.
!
